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Originally Posted by Crumpy-Gunt
I would share some suggestions but they dont really apply if ones viewpoint of the 'problem of Islam' only really matters to them when it affects their life in the western world through global terrorist attacks and people from different cultures providing some shock when they move to the west.
To me thats kind of like continually filling a cup with holes and wondering why it wont hold water or mopping up a leak before you've cut the source and stopped the leak.
Part of the reason many people dont want to have this discussion is because it takes place by and large between middle aged white people in the west who are more interested in their own politics than helping opressed people reform their religion and societies. The scope is always a western one and not a global or humanist agenda to have people living in equality around the world. We dont care if its a rabbid dog in the desert as long as it never bites us.
As long as we deal with Islam from the west and look to solve only the problems Islam poses for the west we will never really 'deal with Islam' or liberate people in these countries so they can choose to be more secular; we will only deal with the individual issues that we find troubling about Islam. Not the ones that actually trouble Muslims.
Its a pretty selfish way to look at it. I'm not concerned with helping these people, I'm concerned with ensuring they dont hurt me or challenge my way of life. Basically I'm only concerned with the well being of people I know or can relate with culturally, religiously etc.
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If you think you value the people you don't know as much as the ones you do, you are either fooling yourself or wasting a lot of energy not making a difference.
I've yet to meet a person who truly acts selflessly. I've seen people give up a lot, and heard of those who gave up all, for the satisfaction that comes with helping people they don't know, but I've never met one who was doing those things with the expectation that doing such a things was going to make them unhappy and disappointed with themselves. So yes, it is partially selfish, but I really do thing that if our goal is to provide the best life to the most people, we should start by ensuring the areas that currently provide this best life continue to do so. And doing this, like it or not, requires border controls so that countries can let in people they think will fit, and exclude those that they think will damage the culture that contributes to it, or even just limit the rate so those that come in will integrate with the rest of the population so that people don't feel threatened and turn to right wing neo fascist groups to get rid of the threat.
But my answer wasn't, I'm not concerned with helping these people, it's I'm not as concerned with helping these people. There are multiple reasons for that, but one of them is that I actually have the ability to try change my own back yard for the better. Another is that I think there will always be parts of the world that become hell holes for periods of time. During these times, the best we can do is try make sure the part of the part of the world we live in doesn't. Additionally, by focusing on our back yard and maintaining our liberal values, we can continue to try to innovate and provide technological solutions to reduce some of the non-religious pressures that contribute to fighting in the middle east. For, example, we can fund research into more efficient and cheaper to build sea water purification techniques that could help reduce the water shortages in the area.
The people I contribute to helping the most are those that nothing but nets help the most. They happen to be my international charity of choice and help people in Africa reduce the rates of malaria and other diseases; things which they have no control over in an area where they don't have the benefit of massive amounts of oil money. Reduce the disease that plagues the area, improve the education, and this contribution just might, in the long run, make a material impact in reducing the rates of FGM in Africa.
I'm not an activist type as my mindset is way too skeptical. I've seen activists of all stripes get caught up in the ends justify the means type of a mindset and end up setting their movement and goals back more often than I've seen them actually make an overall positive difference. The people who make the biggest difference are those that have spent the time necessary to build business connections and large networks of friends, and as part of routine business they subtly change minds in ways that make the world a better place.
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As for the goal of having people around the world living in equality, I think it's a fool's errand. I would rather 80% of the world live in free, liberal cultures and 20% live under oppression and dictatorships than have 100% of the world living equally miserable lives. I'd even rather 20% of the world live in free, liberal cultures and 80% live in various amounts of oppression than have 100% of the world living equal, but somewhat oppressed, miserable lives with little to improvement to forward to. There's nothing about equality that is good in and of itself. Fairness is the moral good worth striving for, but fairness is much more complicated to determine than equality. Sometimes fairness dictates equality, but sometimes it indicates anything but.