Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

Go Back   Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community > Main Forums > Fire on Ice: The Calgary Flames Forum
Ivrnet

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 03-14-2013, 04:02 AM   #1
Frank MetaMusil
RANDOM USER TITLE CHANGE
 
Frank MetaMusil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: South Calgary
Exp:
Default Young guns/Rusty muskets

Ok, I've been thinking on this for awhile and Walken and co. basically forced me to create a thread. I had to do it.

Essentially this thread is a historical "bring it" for Flames fans.

An old preview from the 1999-2000 season.

Quote:
Who knew that Grant Fuhr would one day be the source of inspiration, rather than humiliation, for the Flames? Fuhr, who spent the better part of his 18-year goaltending career shutting down Calgary en route to winning five Stanley Cups in Edmonton, was acquired by the Flames from the Blues for a third-round draft choice on Sept. 4.
Ah ****

Quote:
While Calgary boasts a veteran defense anchored by Steve Smith and Phil Housley, its offense is characterized by youth and inexperience. That can translate into an inability to execute: Witness a 12-game stretch last spring in which the Flames scored just 17 goals. At 29, Steve Dubinsky is Calgary's oldest forward; after 22-year-old wing Jarome Iginla, who had 28 goals last year, 25-year-old forward Cory Stillman (27 goals) is the Flames' most promising scoring threat.
This made me howl the most though.....

Quote:
The all-rookie line of the team's last three No. 1 picks -- Daniel Tkachuk, Rico Fata and Oleg Saprykin -- has been impressive in camp and may end up being the No. 1 line.
C'mon, post your fondest/worst memories of the "Young Guns"




http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/hoc...w/cgy_preview/

Last edited by Frank MetaMusil; 03-14-2013 at 05:58 PM.
Frank MetaMusil is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Frank MetaMusil For This Useful Post:
Old 03-14-2013, 04:25 AM   #2
Frank MetaMusil
RANDOM USER TITLE CHANGE
 
Frank MetaMusil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: South Calgary
Exp:
Default

Another old HF (Hockey's Future) article for the Flames

http://www.hockeysfuture.com/article...t_clarke_wilm/

Quote:
In 1998/99, Clake Wilm won his roster spot over players like Sergei Varlamov and Travis Brigley. Rico Fata and Martin St. Louis began the journey but both returned to junior and the minors respectively, leaving Wilm to carry the torch of the rookies forward.
Time to take a walk Flames fans. Remember any of this stuff?

Last edited by Frank MetaMusil; 03-14-2013 at 04:27 AM.
Frank MetaMusil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2013, 05:06 AM   #3
FlamesAddiction
Franchise Player
 
FlamesAddiction's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Toronto-ish
Exp:
Default

Quote:
While Calgary boasts a veteran defense anchored by Steve Smith and Phil Housley, its offense is characterized by youth and inexperience. That can translate into an inability to execute: Witness a 12-game stretch last spring in which the Flames scored just 17 goals.
I remember that well. It was a brutal stretch, and there were a few just like it.

You know too that half the people demanding a youth movement will be smashing their TVs on the lawn once the inevitable terrible streaks happen. And a good portion of the rest will just disappear until the team is good again like in 2004. Iknow most of them say they won't give up during the 3-5 year rebuild, and I think they really believe that, but it happened last time and I am sure it will happen again.

I love hearing about the old expectations. I came across a bunch of my old magazines from the 1990s when I was moving, but I had to get rid of them. I read a couple beforehand though. One of the season previews had compared Stillman to Sakic. They also talked about how Iginla was in Brian Sutter's doghouse because he was a lazy player and had to apply himself better. I know that describes a lot of young players, but people often forget that Iginla went through his fair share of growing pains as a young player.
__________________
"A pessimist thinks things can't get any worse. An optimist knows they can."
FlamesAddiction is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to FlamesAddiction For This Useful Post:
Old 03-14-2013, 05:18 AM   #4
Frank MetaMusil
RANDOM USER TITLE CHANGE
 
Frank MetaMusil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: South Calgary
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction View Post
I remember that well. It was a brutal stretch, and there were a few just like it.

You know too that half the people demanding a youth movement will be smashing their TVs on the lawn once the inevitable terrible streaks happen. And a good portion of the rest will just disappear until the team is good again like in 2004. Iknow most of them say they won't give up during the 3-5 year rebuild, and I think they really believe that, but it happened last time and I am sure it will happen again.

I love hearing about the old expectations. I came across a bunch of my old magazines from the 1990s when I was moving, but I had to get rid of them. I read a couple beforehand though. One of the season previews had compared Stillman to Sakic. They also talked about how Iginla was in Brian Sutter's doghouse because he was a lazy player and had to apply himself better. I know that describes a lot of young players, but people often forget that Iginla went through his fair share of growing pains as a young player.
Haha, surely you jest. 90% of flames fans would tolerate a rebuild.....

The Flames were primed to score more goals on Weimer's line. Fact remains is they didn't.

The only time the Flames ever made noise was with a sniper winger and an elite goalie (who shall remain unnamed) The two guys who need to be traded, ironically.

I'd love to see a bunch of Wilm, Shantz, Dubinskys come down the pipe. Bring on 7 more seasons!



Todd Simpson, Valeri Bure, Chris Dingman, etc.

Fans can cheer for a rebuild, but they might not have witnessed how the previous one went either.
Frank MetaMusil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2013, 05:22 AM   #5
pylon
NOT Chris Butler
 
pylon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Vote Threeve!
Exp:
Default

The Ducks brawl was tops for me. LOL Begin has come full circle.

pylon is online now   Reply With Quote
The Following 8 Users Say Thank You to pylon For This Useful Post:
Old 03-14-2013, 05:32 AM   #6
Frank MetaMusil
RANDOM USER TITLE CHANGE
 
Frank MetaMusil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: South Calgary
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pylon View Post
The Ducks brawl was tops for me. LOL Begin has come full circle.

Bring back heart and soul guys like Cassels!

Or Bure's little brother, who amounted to nothing.

Damn, the Flames are headed in this same direction if they don't fix it.

It's like watching a 10 year old car wreck.
Frank MetaMusil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2013, 05:36 AM   #7
Frank MetaMusil
RANDOM USER TITLE CHANGE
 
Frank MetaMusil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: South Calgary
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction View Post
I love hearing about the old expectations. I came across a bunch of my old magazines from the 1990s when I was moving, but I had to get rid of them.I read a couple beforehand though. One of the season previews had compared Stillman to Sakic. hey also talked about how Iginla was in Brian Sutter's doghouse because he was a lazy player and had to apply himself better. I know that describes a lot of young players, but people often forget that Iginla went through his fair share of growing pains as a young player.
This was basically quoted in a Blaze magazine when we had Guy Charron coaching as well.

I guess Iginla has made it to the HOF while being a lazy player for the majority of his career.

F'n hell the young guns sucked.

Is everyone ready for a "rebuild"?
Frank MetaMusil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2013, 05:43 AM   #8
pylon
NOT Chris Butler
 
pylon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Vote Threeve!
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank MetaMusil View Post
Bring back heart and soul guys like Cassels!

Or Bure's little brother, who amounted to nothing.

Damn, the Flames are headed in this same direction if they don't fix it.

It's like watching a 10 year old car wreck.
I never could figure out who that last pathetic soul left sitting on the bench was.

Boughner taunting the bench was frikkin awesome.

Seeing Sarge makes me sad.

Seeing Giguere lose his shutout for third man in makes me LOL.

And who was Vernon's Backup?
pylon is online now   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to pylon For This Useful Post:
Old 03-14-2013, 05:47 AM   #9
Frank MetaMusil
RANDOM USER TITLE CHANGE
 
Frank MetaMusil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: South Calgary
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pylon View Post
I never could figure out who that last pathetic soul left sitting on the bench was.

Boughner taunting the bench was frikkin awesome.

Seeing Sarge makes me sad.

Seeing Giguere lose his shutout for third man in makes me LOL.

And who was Vernon's Backup?
Remember when the Flames had Wregget as their #1?


Supposedly Fuhr was better, and thus Brathwaite "emerged"

I really hope fans are ready for this. Calgary has made some hilarious trades in their time. Feaster is probably eyeing up Conklin to round out the squad......

Hey, from 1993 - 1996 the Flames were a playoff team.

Last edited by Frank MetaMusil; 03-14-2013 at 05:50 AM.
Frank MetaMusil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2013, 05:52 AM   #10
pylon
NOT Chris Butler
 
pylon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Vote Threeve!
Exp:
Default

You know what though. I really enjoyed the game more then. There was zero expectations on the team, and you went to the game to see some hockey, and have a good time, if they won... great, but they were at such a disadvantage because of economics, you couldn't hold it against them when they lost. Plus that era had genuine fans. Anyone that was paying to see that product, truly cared. It wasn't the duckface / self portrait / with the ice in the background place to be seen.

I actually have some really fond memories of that era, because the team was such a rag tag, cobbled together, piece of crap... especially in the late 90's. Kinda like a beat up old car you didn't have the heart to get rid of.
pylon is online now   Reply With Quote
The Following 19 Users Say Thank You to pylon For This Useful Post:
Old 03-14-2013, 05:56 AM   #11
Frank MetaMusil
RANDOM USER TITLE CHANGE
 
Frank MetaMusil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: South Calgary
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pylon View Post
You know what though. I really enjoyed the game more then. There was zero expectations on the team, and you went to the game to see some hockey, and have a good time, if they won... great, but they were at such a disadvantage because of economics, you couldn't hold it against them when they lost. Plus that era had genuine fans. Anyone that was paying to see that product, truly cared. It wasn't the duckface / self portrait / with the ice in the background place to be seen.

I actually have some really fond memories of that era, because the team was such a rag tag, cobbled together, piece of crap... especially in the late 90's. Kinda like a beat up old car you didn't have the heart to get rid of.
It was an awesome/or ####ty time for Flames fans. They hit rock bottom after the cup win and tried to recoup for so many years.

I miss the old hot stove lounge. $4 pitchers. It was just a different time for fans, but the casual bandwagoner decided to abandon ship.

Tough economic times in the 90's, but hey, Calgarians helped keep the oilers in edmonton.........

Damn i miss the old school dome beers.
Frank MetaMusil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2013, 06:09 AM   #12
FlamesAddiction
Franchise Player
 
FlamesAddiction's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Toronto-ish
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pylon View Post
I never could figure out who that last pathetic soul left sitting on the bench was.

Boughner taunting the bench was frikkin awesome.

Seeing Sarge makes me sad.

Seeing Giguere lose his shutout for third man in makes me LOL.

And who was Vernon's Backup?

Wasn't it Jukka Hentunen? An older player the Flames drafted and brought over for one year? I think it was probably this game that scared him back.
__________________
"A pessimist thinks things can't get any worse. An optimist knows they can."
FlamesAddiction is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2013, 06:34 AM   #13
Frank MetaMusil
RANDOM USER TITLE CHANGE
 
Frank MetaMusil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: South Calgary
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction View Post
Wasn't it Jukka Hentunen? An older player the Flames drafted and brought over for one year? I think it was probably this game that scared him back.
It was totally Hentunen. It's basically the impending doom for Ramo, although some may still think he can come into Calgary and rip it up. Gaudreau is basically the same thing in the 4th round.

Calgary won't improve until they trade picks for picks. It also stands to reason that Renaud or Pelawa would have been decent, but it's the same story/worse as Blake Geoffrion (sp)

Hell, Chucko retired at 25 yrs/old.

I can't trust Calgary to make a first round draft pick that will make a difference in their lineup in 2 seasons. Sven might even bust as well.

Last edited by Frank MetaMusil; 03-14-2013 at 07:40 AM.
Frank MetaMusil is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Frank MetaMusil For This Useful Post:
Old 03-14-2013, 07:23 AM   #14
Frank MetaMusil
RANDOM USER TITLE CHANGE
 
Frank MetaMusil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: South Calgary
Exp:
Default

Calgary can't even hit or keep once on a 5th rounder or higher either.

Since 1996, 5th + rounders have been

-Josef Straka
-Ryan Wade
-Ronald Petrovicky (honorable mention for making the team)
-Ilja Demidov
-Jeremy Rondeau
-Dustin Paul
-Radek Duda
-Jonas Fogren
-Kevin Mitchell
-Matt Doman
-Jesse Cook
-Cory ######
-Matt Underhill
-Blair Stayzer
-Dmitri Kirilenko
-Wade Davis
-Travis Moen (actually won a cup)
-Jukka Hentunen (never won anything)
-David Hajek
-Micki DuPont
-James Hakewill
-Yuri Trubachev
-Garrett Bembridge
-David Moss (1st line center for Calgary last season)
-Joe Campbell
-Ville Hamalainen
-Jiri Cetkovsky
-Emanuel Peter
-Victor Bobrov
-Kristofer Persson
-Jyri Marttinen
-Greg Moore
-Tyler Johnson
-Thomas Bellemare
-Cam Cunning
-Kevin Harvey
-Adam Pardy (Pardy time!)
-Fred Wikner
-Matthew Schneider
-James Spratt
-Kevin LaLande
-Matt Keetley
-Brett Sutter
-Myles Rumsey
-Juuso Puustinen
-Jordan Fulton
-Devin DiDiomete
-Per Jonsson
-Mickey Renaud (RIP)
-C.J. Severyn
-Ryley Grantham
-Alexander Dellert
-Spencer Bennett
-Joni Ortio
-Gaelan Patterson
-Michael Ferland (traded?)
-Patrick Holland (traded)
-Laurent Brossoit
-Coda Gordon
-Matthew Deblouw

Wow this team is bad at drafting. They might hit on one of these new guys, but eff that's bad up to now.

Last edited by Frank MetaMusil; 03-14-2013 at 07:25 AM.
Frank MetaMusil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2013, 07:29 AM   #15
Frank MetaMusil
RANDOM USER TITLE CHANGE
 
Frank MetaMusil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: South Calgary
Exp:
Default

Moen is the only player of those 60 I listed that has a cup.

I am going to try and run the numbers for other teams in the next few days, but Calgary's drafting in any round has been crippling. It doesn't seem to matter if they accumulate picks or not.

They just can't make the right decision, no matter where they sit in the standings. Anyone hoping for losses needs to realize this team can't draft players no matter what spot they sit in.

Tod Button is still around somehow.......

Last edited by Frank MetaMusil; 03-14-2013 at 07:35 AM.
Frank MetaMusil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2013, 07:55 AM   #16
FlamesAddiction
Franchise Player
 
FlamesAddiction's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Toronto-ish
Exp:
Default

I totally forgot about Igor (Gary) Kravchuk. That guy had a lot of haters, but I kind of liked him. He seemed like a nice guy in all the interviews.

I also remember Stillman had a lot of haters, but in retrospect, we'd be lucky to draft a player as good as he was in any round.

It's funny when you look back and see how many good players went through Calgary only to have greater success once they left. We can talk about drafting and money being the key issues (which they they were big ones for sure), but management made some terrible decisions. Not referring to the Stillman trade as it worked out good for us, but St. Louis, Savard, Nylander, Giguere, and Roloson were all assets that were not managed well. Add to that, players that we acquired that never came as advertised (Weimer, Nazarov, Corbet, Special Nieds, Leeman if you go back far enough), the past management sucked at assessing talent.
__________________
"A pessimist thinks things can't get any worse. An optimist knows they can."

Last edited by FlamesAddiction; 03-14-2013 at 09:17 AM.
FlamesAddiction is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to FlamesAddiction For This Useful Post:
Old 03-14-2013, 07:55 AM   #17
Frank MetaMusil
RANDOM USER TITLE CHANGE
 
Frank MetaMusil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: South Calgary
Exp:
Default

If anyone wants to see a comparison of 5th round or high er picks from Chicago since 1995, here goes.

-Marc Maglariditi
-Marty Wilford
-Steve Tardif
-Casey Hankinson
-Michael Pittman
-Andy Johnson
-Mike Vellinga
-Chris Twerdun
-Andrei Kozyrev
-Ben Simon
-Pete Gardiner
-Kyle Calder (decent player)
-Heath Gordon
-Jared Smith
-Sergei Shikhanov
-Chris Feil
-Kent Huskins (serviceable NHL d-man)
-Jari Viuhkola
-Jonathan Pelletier
-Tyler Arnason (also serviceable NHL forward)
-Sean Griffin
-Alexandre Couture
-Andrei Yershov
-Michael Jacobsen
-Michael Leighton (NHL cup finalist)
-Mattias Wennerberg
-Yorick Treille
-Andrew Carver
-Alexander Barkunov
-Mike Ayers
-Joey Martin
-Cliff Loya
-Adam Berkhoel
-Peter Flache
-Reto Von Arx
-Arne Ramhold (related to tim?)


Chicago has so many to list

9th round - Burish
8th round - Byfuglien
7th round - Brouwer
6th round - Ben Smith
5th round - Kruger

Chicago hit picks in the late rounds where Calgary hit nothing.

It does help.
Frank MetaMusil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2013, 07:57 AM   #18
Frank MetaMusil
RANDOM USER TITLE CHANGE
 
Frank MetaMusil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: South Calgary
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction View Post
I totally forgot about Igor (Gary) Kravchuk. That guy had a lot of haters, but I kind of liked him. He seemed like a nice guy in all the interviews.

I also remember Stillman had a lot of haters, but in retrospect, we'd be lucky to draft a player as good as he was in any round.

It's funny when you look back and see how many good players went through Calgary only to have greater success once they left. We can talk about drafting and money being the key issues (which they they were big ones for sure), but management made some terrible decisions. Not referring to the Stillman trade as it worked out good for us, but St. Louis, Savard, Nylander, Giguere, and Roloson were all assets that were not managed well. Add to that, players that we acquired that never came as advertised (Weimer, Nazarov, Corbet, Leeman if you go back far enough), the past management sucked at assessing talent.
They were basically punked off for cap space.
Frank MetaMusil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2013, 07:58 AM   #19
neo45
Powerplay Quarterback
 
neo45's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Exp:
Default

You're kind of all over the map in your triple post, what exactly is your point? That the Flames haven't been good at drafting in later rounds?

Their previous draft picks in rounds 5-9 are hardly the problem. They actually managed to draft some full time NHLers which is about as much as you can ask for in those rounds. It's their lack of success in the first round, and total lack of second round picks period that are the problem. After those rounds, they probably look like any other team success-wise
neo45 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2013, 08:08 AM   #20
Frank MetaMusil
RANDOM USER TITLE CHANGE
 
Frank MetaMusil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: South Calgary
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by neo45 View Post
You're kind of all over the map in your triple post, what exactly is your point? That the Flames haven't been good at drafting in later rounds?

Their previous draft picks in rounds 5-9 are hardly the problem. They actually managed to draft some full time NHLers which is about as much as you can ask for in those rounds. It's their lack of success in the first round, and total lack of second round picks period that are the problem. After those rounds, they probably look like any other team success-wise
I don't have a point really man. It's just the fact that since the "Young guns" the flames haven't drafted anyone of impact. At all. Brodie is basically the only one that will hopefully break the cycle.

Do you have any young guns memories?

Chris Dingman has 2 stanley cups
Frank MetaMusil is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
oilers sucked since 2002

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:47 AM.

Calgary Flames
2014-15
CP Chat!

CPRadio

2014-15 Regular Season:





Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright Calgarypuck 2009