Something that's still bothering me about the ROR debacle and NOW.

[Fischy13]

Here's what bugs me about the ROR situation. Peole keep thinking Feaster is an idiot for possibly giving up a 1st and a 3rd for nothing..... DO you really think the NHL would allow that to happen to a team?? Not a fricken chance. One of two things would have happened if Colorado didn't match. If they held it up that he would have to go through waivers, the Flames would have gotten a mulligan and withdraw the offer, or they would have ruled that the RFA negotiation list trades with the player and no waivers required. In no way would the NHL allow a black mark like that, and see the Flames lose the player and their picks for nothing. Not a chance.

[nfotiu]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

At the time they had games in hand and certainly could've gotten back in the race with a good cluster of games.

A month later it was obvious they weren't going to make a run and thus had pretty much no chance at the playoffs.

But O'Reilly would have been a good long term piece regardless. He only recently turned 22.

Also, they probably thought Kipper coming back was going to help move them up the standings. That obviously didn't pan out as planned.

[squiggs96]

Originally Posted by Dr. Doom

Obviously you didn't read my post and don't understand the point I'm trying to make either.

They DIDN'T fall in the standings. And they didn't get ROR.

Between then and now however they went into full rebuild.

The way it comes across they would have had a different approach had they of landed ROR then what they are doing now (full rebuld).

They did fall in the standings, one, in terms of their record relative to .500, two, in number of teams between them and 8th, and three, in number of points behind 8th spot.

If a team continues to stay at .500, they won't make the playoffs with three point games, and especially this year when all games are against conference opponents and the increase in the number of three point games.

If they had gotten ROR, the thought was they were going to get better this year, as well as in the future. They still wanted to make the playoffs this year. Once the realized they couldn't, they started getting value for their assets.

[JazzyFlame]

Originally Posted by Fischy13

Here's what bugs me about the ROR situation. Peole keep thinking Feaster is an idiot for possibly giving up a 1st and a 3rd for nothing..... DO you really think the NHL would allow that to happen to a team?? Not a fricken chance. One of two things would have happened if Colorado didn't match. If they held it up that he would have to go through waivers, the Flames would have gotten a mulligan and withdraw the offer, or they would have ruled that the RFA negotiation list trades with the player and no waivers required. In no way would the NHL allow a black mark like that, and see the Flames lose the player and their picks for nothing. Not a chance.

Completely agree, it would have allowed Colorado to "arbritrage" the situation, keep ROR and the picks.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by nfotiu

Also, they probably thought Kipper coming back was going to help move them up the standings. That obviously didn't pan out as planned.

Yup. I think Kipper has had two really suberb games this season and the rest crap. We all knew at some point he'd fall off, he's 36 but don't know if anyone knew he would be this bad this year.

Hopefully a team like Toronto chalks it up to bad team defense and hoping he can bounce back. Honestly wouldn't be surprised of he still has a season or two of high level play left in him.

[Cowperson]

Originally Posted by Dr. Doom

Ok guys,

Amongst all of the “Fire Feaster” discussion (because there is A LOT of it going on), I can’t help but feel extremely bothered about something that I don’t know has been talked about really yet. Leastways I can’t find a discussion on it amongst the various different threads going on. So here goes…

Can someone explain (or try!) to explain to me how this management group goes from point A to point B in a month’s time:

A) Feb. 28th - 3 games under .500, Flames present a 2 year/$10 million offer sheet to Ryan O'Reilly, which (forgetting about the whole waiver debacle for the sake of argument for a moment) would have cost them a 1st and 3rd rounder

B) End of March/beg. Of April – approx. 3 games under .500, we go into full rebuild mode starting with Iginla, Bouwmeester, Kipper talking with Leafs/Hawks, Glencross rumored, Feaster/King essentially saying they are in full swing on deals

I think out of everything Feaster/ownership have managed to muck up, this of all situations confuses the hell out of me and makes me wonder if these guys even know whose driving the bus or where they are going?

Because correct me if I’m wrong but doesn’t point A above still go at the “win now” philosophy and point B the full rebuild? If that’s the case did we seriously just take a 180 in a matter of a month??????????????????????

As a long time Flames fan that concerns the hell out of me. How screwed would this franchise still be if we did end up landing ROR? Would they be trying to re-sign Iginla, keeping a win-now mentality with the same useless plugs?

Is it just me or does our franchise seem lost at sea?

You're making some kind of assumption that the acquisition of O'Reilly would have prevented the dismissal of Iginla and Bouwmeester.

I would hope those latter two transactions would have happened anyway.

Cowperson

[Red]

Originally Posted by Fischy13

Here's what bugs me about the ROR situation. Peole keep thinking Feaster is an idiot for possibly giving up a 1st and a 3rd for nothing..... DO you really think the NHL would allow that to happen to a team?? Not a fricken chance. One of two things would have happened if Colorado didn't match. If they held it up that he would have to go through waivers, the Flames would have gotten a mulligan and withdraw the offer, or they would have ruled that the RFA negotiation list trades with the player and no waivers required. In no way would the NHL allow a black mark like that, and see the Flames lose the player and their picks for nothing. Not a chance.

Agree, but the other story creates more buzz and gives people a reason to spew venom.....internets are good for that :-)

[gargamel]

Originally Posted by nfotiu

Also, they probably thought Kipper coming back was going to help move them up the standings. That obviously didn't pan out as planned.

Exactly. If you take a team that's 3 points out of a playoff spot with games in hand, and add ROR and one of last year's top 5 goalies in the NHL, you should safely be a playoff team. ROR is not worth a top 4 pick, but he is worth the type of pick that Feaster could have reasonably assumed we'd have.

[trublmaker]

Originally Posted by Fischy13

Here's what bugs me about the ROR situation. Peole keep thinking Feaster is an idiot for possibly giving up a 1st and a 3rd for nothing..... DO you really think the NHL would allow that to happen to a team?? Not a fricken chance. One of two things would have happened if Colorado didn't match. If they held it up that he would have to go through waivers, the Flames would have gotten a mulligan and withdraw the offer, or they would have ruled that the RFA negotiation list trades with the player and no waivers required. In no way would the NHL allow a black mark like that, and see the Flames lose the player and their picks for nothing. Not a chance.

some people refuse to see this and just keep bringing it up like it is some massive black mark on Feaster.

[fredr123]

I thought maybe the team was closer to the playoff cutoff around the ROR debacle than they were when the firesale began. Guess that's not really the case. Looks like time just ran out and the inevitable, as these things off do, was about to happen.

On February 28 - The Flames had 18 points and sat in 14th place in the Western Conference. They were 5 points out of a playoff spot and had games in hand on many teams. There were still 29 games to go.
http://www.dropyourgloves.com/Games/...-2-28&League=1

On March 30 - The Flames had 30 points, holding sole possession of 14th place in the Western Conference. They were 6 points out of a playoff spot. There were 15 games to go in the season.
http://www.dropyourgloves.com/Games/...ate=2013-03-31

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by trublmaker

some people refuse to see this and just keep bringing it up like it is some massive black mark on Feaster.

Because, unless the NHL told Feaster 'go ahead, we've got your back' the only thing the League could do is follow the rules as both Colorado and who ever is first in line for the waiver are just as screwed as the Flames, what makes us think the league would choose to save the Flames from their incompetance by scewing over either the Avs or the Blue Jackets (if memory serves me)?

[JJsChaos]

You've got to ask yourself, how much pull does management have. It seems to me that ownership has their hands in the pot a little too deep.

[gargamel]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

Because, unless the NHL told Feaster 'go ahead, we've got your back' the only thing the League could do is follow the rules as both Colorado and who ever is first in line for the waiver are just as screwed as the Flames, what makes us think the league would choose to save the Flames from their incompetance by scewing over either the Avs or the Blue Jackets (if memory serves me)?

Not going to rehash the details again as there's a very long thread on the topic, but the language in the MoA supported Feaster's interpretation. At the very worst, the league would have said the language was too ambiguous, voided the deal, and clarified the language for the future.

[JayP]

Originally Posted by Fischy13

Here's what bugs me about the ROR situation. Peole keep thinking Feaster is an idiot for possibly giving up a 1st and a 3rd for nothing..... DO you really think the NHL would allow that to happen to a team?? Not a fricken chance. One of two things would have happened if Colorado didn't match. If they held it up that he would have to go through waivers, the Flames would have gotten a mulligan and withdraw the offer, or they would have ruled that the RFA negotiation list trades with the player and no waivers required. In no way would the NHL allow a black mark like that, and see the Flames lose the player and their picks for nothing. Not a chance.

What precedent is there for this?

You don't think the 29 other teams might have an issue with the NHL making rulings to benefit the Flames simply because of bad PR (which is more of a Flames issue than an NHL issue)?

[cubistcastle]

I think often about Feaster during the intermission of that Flames-Avs game right after the acquisition fell through insisting that ROR is a franchise player. That moment always tempers any optimistic thoughts I have about Feaster and those are few and far between as it is.

[Badgers Nose]

Berra is/was a backup in the Swiss B division who is known for not being able to win the big game. Sounds promising.

"second best goalie outside the NHL'

So that means there are about 60 goalies better than him. LOL

The fact that in the middle of trade season Feaster would prioritize signing him tells me everything I need to know about the Flames.

Yeah, I triple posted it but the point just keeps on giving.

[Phil Russell]

When the ROR offer went out we were still in strive for last playoff spot mode. Had he accepted, I doubt we would have subsequently traded Iginla and Jaybo and entered full-rebuild mode. We would be buyers today. We would have finished as we always finish--a spot or three out of the playoffs.

After COL matched and we hit the skids in CA the decision was made to go full rebuild.

I am glad that COL matched--in large part triggered the rebuild

[normtwofinger]

Originally Posted by Phil Russell

When the ROR offer went out we were still in strive for last playoff spot mode. Had he accepted, I doubt we would have subsequently traded Iginla and Jaybo and entered full-rebuild mode. We would be buyers today. We would have finished as we always finish--a spot or three out of the playoffs.

After ROR declined and we hit the skids in CA the decision was made to go full rebuild.

I am glad that ROR declined--in large part triggered the rebuild

ROR didn't decline. COL matched the offer sheet.

[BloodFetish]

Originally Posted by Badgers Nose

Berra is/was a backup in the Swiss B division who is known for not being able to win the big game. Sounds promising.

"second best goalie outside the NHL'

So that means there are about 60 goalies better than him. LOL

The fact that in the middle of trade season Feaster would prioritize signing him tells me everything I need to know about the Flames.

Yeah, I triple posted it but the point just keeps on giving.

Source?

[drPepper1]

Originally Posted by North East Goon

What would that do to TSN's viewer ratings for the draft?

Change their name to CSN? And regional