Official WWE/ECW/WCW/TNA talk, or whatever v2

[CaptainCrunch]

I'll reiterate what I said before this episode, that I didn't see the point of them doing this.



It wasn't promoting their product, it backed up what Punk said happened, I didn't see where Tony should have been afraid for his life.



The reason to do things in wrestling is simple since Pro Wrestling is based on a long running con. What can you do to draw money, that's it. Where and why does it draw money. They might get a temporary 15 minute bump, but if you're going to insert something to draw people in, have a strong show, this was a at best ok show.


All this really did for AEW was nothing. they might get a bump for the 15 minute segment, but most of the people that want to see it will go to the web to do it.


I remember Paul Heyman telling the story of his famous shoot interview against McMahon. He went up to Vince and asked if he wanted a preview of what he was going to say and Vinces response was draw me money.



AEW lost that, if there's one thing that holds back a company is Tony's money its when they put out massive statues or shows and don't worry about dwindling audiences and TV ratings. AEW isnt hungry.

[TheIronMaiden]

I get that CM Punk was in the wrong for making a verbal argument physical.
But damn if it ain't wrestling, and when he was breaking into the business that #### was happening all the time. Hell in 2016 Brock Lesnar and Chris Jericho got in a fight.

[Muta]

I love AEW, but a couple thoughts here after watching that 'clip' last night:

• The backstage vid from London was unnecessary, especially eight months later. Didn't do anything to advance the company.
• That was the most melodramatic vid; not even sure why it was a big deal. Couple guys shoved each other, oh no. I've seen worse than that at a gym on a random weeknight.
• I hate the Bucks, I wish they would ride off into the sunset.
• I did like FTR coming on afterwards on the mic and basically saying 'what is the point of showing this #### eight months later', which I'm sure is part of the storyline anyways.

On the positive side, Ospreay is really becoming one of my faves on the mic, and Anna Jay is stupid hot. That is all.

[SuperMatt18]

Sounds like the Young Bucks weren't really on board with it either but it was Tony Khan's call, and he made Ospreay reply to HHH as well.

I do wonder if Tony Khan is starting to lose that locker room.

Seems like a good guy to work for. But I don't think wrestlers are super happy with the booking, the wrestlers aren't going to like working in front of half empty buildings, and I don't think anybody is going to like them showing the back stage videos.

One thing about the wrestling industry that you've always heard is "the locker room is the wrestlers space". For TK to play security cam footage, live on TV, without any wrestlers signing off on it feels like a move that is not going to be seen positively by the locker room.

Tony Schiavone seemed absolutely frustrated by them playing that video when they cut to him afterwards too.

I feel like AEW is speed running through the normal big wrestling company issues...and we are now at the point where in order to take the next step TK needs to be in a smaller role portion of the speed run.

AEW should be the best wrestling product on TV, they just need to get out of their own way to do it.

[TheIronMaiden]

One thing is for sure, wrestling has been very entertaining this month.

[Inferno]

I was expecting to see Perry get jumped or something. The only thing that's disputable is what was said and there wasn't any audio to go against what was said.

I did see some AEW fanboys claim that Punk said Perry approached him but going back and watching the interview that's not true.

[mile]

I feared for my life watching this footage

[TheIronMaiden]

I seriously can't wait to hear Jim lay into this.

[Deegee]

Wrestling has been better since AEW started. The WWE product has gotten better and fans have been treated to some banger matches. What a shame it is that Tony is such a child.

[TheIronMaiden]

AEW is good if you're a hardcore fan who genuinely likes watching no context wrestling matches. I don't want to take anything away from those folks.

[CaptainCrunch]

WWE needs AEW, AEW needs WWE to improve.



Does WWE view AEW as a serious threat anymore? Probably not, based on AEW's signing of former WWE stars and then wrecking them.


If Tony was the one pushing for this and Wills shot at HHH, its a really poor miscalculation.


If the idea was to use this to springboard Jack Perry back in as an upper midcarder, I don't think its going to work out like they think. The fans were chanting for Punk, Perry looked weak ass in the footage, if they bring him back as the villain who chased out a popular star like Punk he's going to get nuclear F off heat, not good heat.


I loved Tony S reaction, it was like jesus christ I'm in WCW again and Vince Russo is booking ####.


Just hearing some reports that workers in the back are really frustrated with the release of the video.



I don't think it matters though as long as the paychecks clear the banks.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by TheIronMaiden

AEW is good if you're a hardcore fan who genuinely likes watching no context wrestling matches. I don't want to take anything away from those folks.

I'm not sure that's even fully fair. Some of the guys can tell a story.

MJF was able to do that. Swerve is able to. Hangman at times. Others as well.

I think the problem is that really the roster isn't getting the help they need to tell the stories week over week.

It's not a talent problem. Or a roster issue. It's up to Tony Khan to put together the structure required to allow this roster to shine both in ring and week to week storyline wise.

[CaptainCrunch]

One thing that's really improved with WWE is that they don't hotshot book anymore, their stories seems to be coherant and stretch out and make some sense.


There are still cringeworthy stories, but the bloodline, damage ctrl, Sami's stories all made sense and progressed and elements weren't dropped and there were jumping off points to the next story.

[TheIronMaiden]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

One thing that's really improved with WWE is that they don't hotshot book anymore, their stories seems to be coherant and stretch out and make some sense.


There are still cringeworthy stories, but the bloodline, damage ctrl, Sami's stories all made sense and progressed and elements weren't dropped and there were jumping off points to the next story.

Another thing that has really improved is their production quality. For a while WWE was unwatchable due to all the jump cuts. Wrestling is only more impressive with a steady cam.

[trackercowe]

Their roster is pretty thin right now as well. Just think about it....

The four "pillars":
MJF: Injured
Sammy Guevara: Suspended
Jack Perry: Suspended
Darby: Injured

Then their five biggest draws
Punk: WWE
Cody: WWE
Sting: Retired
Omega: Injured
MJF: Injured

That's a pretty big blow to their roster. Bryan, Swerve, Mox, Jericho, Joe, Copeland, Christian, are all ex-WWE guys whose best days are behind them. I don't know if any of them can move the needle.

The same can be said about the abundance of Japanese stars who also don't seem to draw ratings. I think a big problem is how they're introduced to the company, most of the time they just "show up" randomly without any kind of fervor or anticipation. If you're just a casual wrestling fan you have no idea who these people are. I know many AEW fans tend to be hardcore fans, not casuals.... but how are you going to bring in those casual viewers.

If you're finishing up that rerun of Big Bang Theory (the real four pillars of AEW are Sheldon, Penny, Leonard, and Howard), why would you stick around when random wrestlers from other feds are showing up? I would consider myself a hardcore fan, and even I don't know who many of these international stars are. They did a great job with Ospreay, and he seems like a big deal. Yet most of the others come and go, usually lose... why should we care? Shibata and Ibushi are big names in Japan, yet they are basically on jobber duty in AEW. As are many others coming through the forbidden door. So why should the audience care?

I'll say it again when AEW has their full roster it's relatively impressive. I think they have the best roster of talent outside the WWE since The Monday Night Wars with WCW. The wrestling might be the best on the planet, but that alone is never going to be enough of a selling point. Casuals don't watch for wrestling alone. Maybe they're happy with that, but with that depleted roster the future is looking quite bleak at the moment.

[rubecube]

All In and All Out on back-to-back weekends again this year. Absolute clown ####.

https://www.cagesideseats.com/aew/20...ecutive-london

[TheIronMaiden]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

I'm not sure that's even fully fair. Some of the guys can tell a story.

MJF was able to do that. Swerve is able to. Hangman at times. Others as well.

I think the problem is that really the roster isn't getting the help they need to tell the stories week over week.

It's not a talent problem. Or a roster issue. It's up to Tony Khan to put together the structure required to allow this roster to shine both in ring and week to week storyline wise.

Though AEW is leagues better than TNA, it is similar in that there are times that the product is outstanding and others where it is hot dog poop. Anyways, I'll continue to follow Will Ospreay and MJF who are top 10 in the world.

[Muta]

Originally Posted by trackercowe

That's a pretty big blow to their roster. Bryan, Swerve, Mox, Jericho, Joe, Copeland, Christian, are all ex-WWE guys whose best days are behind them. I don't know if any of them can move the needle.

I don't think I'd include Swerve in this list. He's only 33 (young in the wrestling world), white hot in terms of popularity, and will likely be the next AEW World Champion. His best days are in front of him.

[rubecube]

Honestly, I think one of AEW's biggest problems is that they're still trying to blend kayfabe and shoot into their angles. It was somewhat novel and cute when they were starting up, but it comes off as tired and desperate now.

[Deegee]

Originally Posted by TheIronMaiden

AEW is good if you're a hardcore fan who genuinely likes watching no context wrestling matches. I don't want to take anything away from those folks.

Going by the ratings it's not worth it to cater to those folks. They are much better when they do long term story telling. The arc with Kenny and Adam Page was must see TV and was maybe the best feud AEW ever did.