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Old 05-30-2005, 07:18 PM   #1
the_only_turek_fan
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For those folks that were older than 9 when they trade happened please give me some insight.

I know that Gilmour walked out on the team after the New Years game against Montreal.

What were some of the rumoured deals being talked about?

Why couldnt they get Wendel Clark out of TO for Gilmour.

That deal is still unfair but its better than Leeman.

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/leagues...0000381992.html
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Old 05-30-2005, 07:26 PM   #2
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I don't know. He was hugely popular in Toronto so he likely wasn't available.

Although he was rumoured to have almost signed with the Flames as a free agent just before he retired if memory serves me correct.
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Old 05-30-2005, 08:04 PM   #3
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Worst. Trade. Ever.

Worst trade in the history of the NHL. I still want to punch that whiteheaded fletcher #####.
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Old 05-30-2005, 08:15 PM   #4
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Getting Wendel Clark out of Toronto would've been as easy as re-naming the Saddledome Maple Leaf Gardens at the time.

The Leafs sucked for many years, but fans consider(ed) him a God.

We all know how bad the trade was, no use in a rehash of that.

But I wonder, if we'd gotten Potvin instead of Reese:

Would Potvin have developed and played as well as he did leading the Leafs to the semi finals in 1993 and 1994?

For those years, he was a bigger time goalie then Kidd who we had here (after Vernon left)....
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Old 05-30-2005, 08:20 PM   #5
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Bad trade but I don't think it really could be considered the worst.

In my opinion the worst trade has to be...
Phil Esposito, Ken Hodge, and Fred Stanfield to Boston in exchange for Pit Martin, Jack Morris, and Gilles Marotte

Then there is always the first round pick (first overall) that was used to pick Lafleur being traded to the Habs for basically nothing.

Every team has a trade that is around the level of horribleness that the Flames have with regards to the Gilmour trade...

With regards to the Clark trade idea, look at what the Nordiques had to give up in order to get the guy, Mats Sundin who wasn't really a scrub at the time either (and yes I do know of the Nordiques financial troubles which was the motivation behind the move). Never would have happened. Hell Clark was the Leafs for a long time there,
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Old 05-30-2005, 08:32 PM   #6
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Stop sticking needles in my eyes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 05-30-2005, 10:00 PM   #7
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Gilmour was a good player but he wasn't near the star in Calgary that he became in TO.

I'm still waiting for that movie though where he plays Jacques Villeneuve. Come to think of it, I'm still waiting for the movie about Jim Thorpe with Sandy McCarthy in the title role.
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Old 05-30-2005, 10:03 PM   #8
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Aww man, I remember I had such high hopes for Alexander Godynuk.
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Old 05-31-2005, 12:31 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hakan@May 30 2005, 07:04 PM
Worst. Trade. Ever.

Worst trade in the history of the NHL. I still want to punch that whiteheaded fletcher #####.
I heard that Fletcher made promises of raises to Gilmore and Newy before he left. Risborough didn't honor these promises for whatever reason and Gilmore took the Flames to arbitration and lost. The night before the hearing the arbitrator was watching the game with Flames officials and Gilmore figured they influenced the arbitrator. Gilmore was p*ssed and his relationship with the Flames went downhill. I guess Risborough trusted his former boss in the trade, "that whiteheaded fletcher #####", and got schooled.
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Old 05-31-2005, 07:36 AM   #10
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I totally concur with Vulcan.

Fletcher, the Silver Fox, completely manipulated his young 'protege' Riser.

A brilliant move on Fletcher's part, a glass-of-cold-water-to-the-face welcome to the newbie Riser.
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Old 05-31-2005, 07:42 AM   #11
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"The night before the hearing the arbitrator was watching the game with Flames officials and Gilmore figured they influenced the arbitrator. " That was the real kicker.

IIRC, the Flames has coveted Leeman for a couple of years, the thinking being that he could score 50 again with Gilmour as his center. The reason for the toss in of Macoun, Nattress and Wamsley came to light after the season was over - Macoun and Wamer got big bucks (for the time) from Fletcher and Nattress bolted to PHI for big bucks. The Goonynyk-Manderville thing seemed odd, but who knows, maybe Riser thought that with Chopper and Suter tutoring him he would improve.

The Laffs didn't really have a lot at the time - they were not coughing up Potvin or Clark.

Yes, Leeman sucked and it was a bad trade, but I have always said - Leeman on the ice is a better player than Gilmour at home.
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Old 05-31-2005, 08:13 AM   #12
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first off, to be clear the Gilmour trade made me sick to my stomach the second it was announced, it was obviously a terrible trade and I don't want to defend it, but 2 things

1. as people have pointed out Fletcher seemed to have planted the seed in the mind of Gilmour,Wamsley and Macoun at least. Riser had 3 unhappy campers and one willing trading partner. that's a tough position to be in

2.as bad as Gary Leeman turned out (and thats bad folks, even if he did 'win' a cup in 93) lets not forget this was a 30-50 goal man in the years leading up to the trade. Im sure Riser convinced himself that getting this guy on the better team, which CGY was at the time, would be a boost to his career
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Old 05-31-2005, 08:34 AM   #13
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the better issue to talk about here is aparently the flames had two offers on the table one from toronto.....we know how that turned out and one from hartford, I wonder what that offer was.

I'd bet that had gilmour ended up in hartford, this trade wouldn't hurt nearly as bad (even if the return from hartford was just as bad as leeman)
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Old 05-31-2005, 09:57 AM   #14
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I recall there were rumours of Gilmour going for Craig Janney or Adam Oates -> I wasn't excited about either of those at the time but they were head-and-shoulders above Leeman.
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Old 05-31-2005, 01:18 PM   #15
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As much a stinker as the Gilmour trade was for the Flames, it was almost as bad for the Blues when the Flames got him. IIRC, the Flames gave up Mike Bullard, a one-dimensional headcase -- granted, with great hands -- for a gifted leader who put us over the top. Bullard was nowhere near as productive as he was with the Flames ever again, and Gilmour went on to be a vital cog in the Cup year, and a top-tier superstar in the years that followed.

Also, IIRC, St. Louis was over a barrel with Gilmour as well, forced to trade him because of a highly-publicized rumour that he was havign an affair with his teenage baby sitter. Seems like Gilmour trades are just plain cursed.
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Old 05-31-2005, 01:28 PM   #16
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^^^Here's the full deal that brought The Big Quitter to Calgary:

Gilmour/Mark Hunter/Steve Bozek/Michael Dark for Mike Bullard/Craig Coxe/Tim Corkery

Mark Hunter played an undervalued role in our cup run. Great deal.
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Old 05-31-2005, 02:19 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally posted by JiriHrdina@May 31 2005, 01:28 PM
^^^Here's the full deal that brought The Big Quitter to Calgary:

Gilmour/Mark Hunter/Steve Bozek/Michael Dark for Mike Bullard/Craig Coxe/Tim Corkery

Mark Hunter played an undervalued role in our cup run. Great deal.
Yeah that's something I forget every time this Gilmour fiasco comes up and it always makes me feel a little better. Talk about burning the Blues with that one. Bullard was gone the next season, Coxe was about as "one dimensional" as you can get and Corkery never played an NHL game.

Looking back that would have been a fair trade for Mark Hunter alone. Fletcher stole Gilmour twice.
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Old 05-31-2005, 02:25 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally posted by JiriHrdina@May 31 2005, 07:28 PM
^^^Here's the full deal that brought The Big Quitter to Calgary:

Gilmour/Mark Hunter/Steve Bozek/Michael Dark for Mike Bullard/Craig Coxe/Tim Corkery

Mark Hunter played an undervalued role in our cup run. Great deal.
Hunter was pretty vital. Great deal -- pulled off by teh same guy who sent Gary Leeman to Calgary. But I digress ...

I don't think we picked up Bozek in that deal; he played for the flames through the mid-80s. I believe we sent him to St, Loo as part of the Hull deal that netted us Ramage and Wamsley. Could be wrong.
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Old 05-31-2005, 02:39 PM   #19
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My memory re. Bozek appears to be a little hazy so I did a little research online and I'm still confused. Generally here's the deals listed involving Bozek

- Part of the deal that brought Gilmour to Calary from St. Louis (but we know Bozek played in Calgary before that)
- Traded to St. Louis as part of Hull deal.
- Traded from Calgary to Vancouver along with Reinhart for a 3rd.

Now the timeline on all this is confusing. Did we trade for him and ship him off twice? Can someone remember what the scoop is with this guy?
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Old 05-31-2005, 02:52 PM   #20
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Off the top of my head...

We got Bozek from L.A. in the mid 80's

Traded him along with Hull to St.Louis in the spring of 1988
Got him back in the Gilmour trade in September 1988
Almost immediately traded him to Vancouver with Reinhart
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