2022 Freedumb Convoy(s) Thread

[combustiblefuel]

Originally Posted by btimbit

Hardly. There has been a lot of healthy debate on this forum. We're just largely united against this particular brand of BS

It's like 92% of Canada that got there shots just don't understand then8 % that didn't.....

I think the old saying that if your part of the minority vs the majority you are rarely ever right....

[combustiblefuel]

Originally Posted by Goriders

Is that you Gerald Butts?

I don't know .. did you see children there?

[ThatsWhatSheSaid]

Originally Posted by Ducay

Ya its a great question, but trying to demonize and antagonize the convoy was not the right answer. Just like people here are doing, trying to call the other side karens, nazis, racists, terrorists, etc, isn't going to change their mind, only embolden them and galvanize divide. I don't know what the perfect play would have been for him.....but it wasn't this. (benefit of hindsight obviously)

If only Trudeau had the ability to influence the Legislative branch of the federal government to adjust laws.....

But in all honesty, I would also contend the monetary intervention by the feds is a gross overreach in this case. You might agree with the policy now because you disagree with the protestors in this case, but it sets a dangerous precedent and suspect we'll see some blowback from this.

I'm no Trudeau fan myself and generally happy to point out his incompetence, but even I am finding it a difficult stretch to pin this disaster on him. The things this debacle has taught us is that we have flaws to correct in our legislative ability to cope with new age domestic threats, and that we really need to take a look at the competency of our education systems.

To 'demonize' the convoy in the context you are using, is to say that somehow they were being mischaracterized. The very not-so-secret intent (spoiler alert: not about mandates) of this convoy were sedition and even according to our own Criminal Code, terrorism. They carried around effigies of our Prime Minister in nooses and other extremely alarming criminal acts to be committed, I'm not sure what other way we should characterize them. I'm not sure anyone could have antagonized a group that was already very literally calling for the head of our PM. As our neighbors to the South say "we do not negotiate with terrorists." And there is reason behind that, because you don't want every single entitled radicalized group to commit terrorism to achieve their means.

I can see how you might perceive parts of this board as being antagonizing by the use of some of these terms - while I agree certain posters may react heatedly which does not make for easy or constructive discussion - understand that these terms are being used, because they are accurate in many cases. It doesn't encompass every single person in support of the convoy, but one or more of the terms covers an alarmingly large portion of them. Calling them out for what they are, isn't what is emboldening them - they are emboldened by what had appeared to be an impotent law enforcement group, little resistance, and a misconstrued sense of being justified in their views/actions with support of the greater population (which, the majority of us are here to say, we do not condone their values or acts). Nor is calling them out galvanizing divide - which is created by a very clear difference in ideology (read: not just politics) and grasp of reality.

I'm a bit rusty from my social studies classes, but are you implying that it would have been quicker for Trudeau to have a bill passed through both the HOC and Senate versus using the emergency act? I seem to recall this to be a fairly long process but I could be wrong.

As for monetary intervention being an overreach? Feds in most western countries, but especially in countries like Canada, US, France, England, etc. have always had the uncontested ability to freeze funds when they believe there to be a domestic or terrorist threat. We have no idea what intelligence is being/ has been collected the last month, but I imagine they have discovered disturbing things and did not freeze those funds lightly with so many eyes on the situation. What the public knows about (bomb threats, plans to gun down police officers) is probably already enough to justify intervention.

Given the group's links to alt/far right such as "S0ldiers of 0Din", QAn0n, and other white nationalist/supremacist groups, there is likely legitimate concerns to where funds were going. It's not only what they are already doing now, it's what we believe they are capable of doing and what they have said they intend to do. Funding terrorism has always been well within the rights of federal jurisdiction, but feel free to call me out if I have somehow misinterpreted the law.

There is a lack of understanding in what the convoy represent, for those asking for diplomacy in how we speak about and speak to these supremacists. It's important to hear all voices, but not where morality is in jeopardy. There is no "both sides" to an equation that does not allow for constructive discourse. Dialogue requires opposing views are made in good faith and parties have capacity (i.e. competence and ability to understand). These people do not operate in good faith, have no intent or ability to negotiate; we are simply dealing with what is right and wrong from a moral and ethical standpoint. And as we will likely see over time, legally as well.

[PeteMoss]

Originally Posted by Ducay

Ya its a great question, but trying to demonize and antagonize the convoy was not the right answer. Just like people here are doing, trying to call the other side karens, nazis, racists, terrorists, etc, isn't going to change their mind, only embolden them and galvanize divide. I don't know what the perfect play would have been for him.....but it wasn't this. (benefit of hindsight obviously)




If only Trudeau had the ability to influence the Legislative branch of the federal government to adjust laws.....

But in all honesty, I would also contend the monetary intervention by the feds is a gross overreach in this case. You might agree with the policy now because you disagree with the protestors in this case, but it sets a dangerous precedent and suspect we'll see some blowback from this.

If we're being honest is there anything he could have done that you wouldn't have disagreed with?

[edslunch]

The complaint about Trudeau not negotiating or even talking to the protesters rings hollow for me. They - and many others including on CP - hate him. They’ve always hated him. They hated his father, they hate his party. They blame everything bad on him and acknowledge nothing good. You don’t need to leave this forum to see it. And yes the other side hates Kenney just as much etc. etc. My point is they cannot be placated by anything short of his resignation or at least utter humiliation.

Has he inflamed tensions - probably so, but it takes two to tango. These folks were already inflamed and dare say looking to be further inflamed. One side of the political spectrum and media/social media were happy to stoke this. (And yes it happens on the other side too..).

So people should get off their soapbox of blaming everything on Trudeau, no matter whether they think he’s competent and working in their best interests or not. There’s plenty of blame to go around (cough, Kenney )

[Matata]

Originally Posted by btimbit

Hardly. There has been a lot of healthy debate on this forum. We're just largely united against this particular brand of BS

CP skews pretty hard towards the terrified, compliant basement dweller. When I want to know what that groups thinking, I come here.

[FormerPresJamesTaylor]

Originally Posted by Matata

CP skews pretty hard towards the terrified, compliant basement dweller. When I want to know what that groups thinking, I come here.

That sounds like projecting

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by Matata

CP skews pretty hard towards the terrified, compliant basement dweller. When I want to know what that groups thinking, I come here.

Yeah I know eh. All our accounts are going to be frozen and we’re all going to be arrested by the big bad tyrannical government! Stay terrified!

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Matata

CP skews pretty hard towards the terrified, compliant basement dweller. When I want to know what that groups thinking, I come here.

We appreciate your interest in wanting to know what we think.

[Looch City]

The basement CP deplorables have come out of the woodwork I see.

[FormerPresJamesTaylor]

Mom's got the sunday morning tendies going

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by FormerPresJamesTaylor

Which rioting and building were burned in Canada? Honest question

"simply park and block" gives you away

This has been brought up before already. Feel free to look back through the news on the BLM Montreal riots and looting.

https://montrealgazette.com/news/loc...-protest-march

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Matata

CP skews pretty hard towards the terrified, compliant basement dweller. When I want to know what that groups thinking, I come here.

Aren’t you the same poster who lives with his mom, believes almost everything is some conspiracy, and wanted Netflix cancelled because they had a movie about 12 year old girls that you found irresistibly sexy?

[SutterBrother]

Originally Posted by Ducay

Ya its a great question, but trying to demonize and antagonize the convoy was not the right answer. Just like people here are doing, trying to call the other side karens, nazis, racists, terrorists, etc, isn't going to change their mind, only embolden them and galvanize divide. I don't know what the perfect play would have been for him.....but it wasn't this. (benefit of hindsight obviously)
.

They were walking around under a Nazi flag? They were assaulting minorities? They waived flags of foreign political parties (Trump) who clearly support white nationalism. They talked of overthrowing democracy, and took money from foreign states.

How are they not racist Nazis?

Why would we, as Canadians talk to them?

[calculoso]

Originally Posted by calgarygeologist

This has been brought up before already. Feel free to look back through the news on the BLM Montreal riots and looting.

Who thought that was good, and who supported those acts?

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by calculoso

Who thought that was good, and who supported those acts?

We're not talking about sentiment towards the action just the fact that they happened. JamesTaylor seems to believe that there was no rioting associated with BLM in Canada. There clearly was.

[Lumby Lager]

[QUOTE=calgarygeologist;8183270]This has been brought up before already. Feel free to look back through the news on the BLM Montreal riots and looting.

https://montrealgazette.com/news/loc...-protest-march[/

Nice edit

[calgarygeologist]

[QUOTE=Lumby Lager;8183281]

Originally Posted by calgarygeologist

This has been brought up before already. Feel free to look back through the news on the BLM Montreal riots and looting.

https://montrealgazette.com/news/loc...-protest-march[/

Nice edit

Are you upset that I edited my post because I incorrectly posted the wrong link? When I caught my mistake I fixed it by posting the proper article. I apologize to you for making a mistake when trying to share information.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by calgarygeologist

We're not talking about sentiment towards the action just the fact that they happened. JamesTallylor seems to believe that there was no rioting associated with BLM in Canada. There clearly was.

But we clearly are talking about sentiment behind the action. People are outright supporting what this convoy has done at our crossings and in downtown Ottawa. There are specific groups who clearly support that. The same cannot be said for BLM rioting. So enough already. It was also the entire intent of the convoy. To disrupt ####.

Rioting attributed to BLM protests was secondary and an issue. It was not the goal.

[Yoho]

Originally Posted by Matata

CP skews pretty hard towards the terrified, compliant basement dweller. When I want to know what that groups thinking, I come here.

Is it too early for post of the year?