I was really hoping there would be a legitimate contender to the iPad, but it's certainly not looking like that's going to happen very soon. At least it's 'pretty thin'.
Not to defend that, or even legitimize it, but 'CRTL+ALT+DEL' on Windows 7 brings up an administrative function, rather than being used mainly to remedy crashes as in some earlier Windows versions
Well this thing is running a tablet version of Win7. Windows has always scaled crappily and sucked when trying to adapt it to tablets. If you want a real analogue to the iPad experience, probably look toward future Android tablets.
After months of engadget, techcrunch and gizmodo comenters building this up...HP completely blew it. If you're going to build a tablet to compete with the iPad, you do it from the ground up with a tablet in mind. The 'windows in tablet form' has been done before and failed so hard.
Under no circumstances do you make it take 30 seconds to boot...Also, you can tell that he's having tonnes of trouble getting it to do simple things like go to Youtube and scroll. Can you imagine how difficult it would be to build a powerpoint presentation? This is the definition of fail.
Looks like Android's up to bat.
Last edited by Flames0910; 09-24-2010 at 02:09 AM.
After months of engadget, techcrunch and gizmodo comenters building this up...HP completely blew it. If you're going to build a tablet to compete with the iPad, you do it from the ground up with a tablet in mind. The 'windows in tablet form' has been done before and failed so hard.
Under no circumstances do you make it take 30 seconds to boot...Also, you can tell that he's having tonnes of trouble getting it to do simple things like go to Youtube and scroll. Can you imagine how difficult it would be to build a powerpoint presentation? This is the definition of fail.
Looks like Android's up to bat.
How is booting in 30 seconds is bad? If it boots in 30, how long will it take to power on when hibernated? I can't remember the last time I powered down any of my computers, with the exception of updates or installs that required a restart.
If you expected HP to make an iPad clone with thier own custom OS, then you were seriously delirious. I think the fact that it is running Windows is a good thing for the market, especially if the hardware makes that running of Windows a good user experience. It remains to be seen if the hardware will do that because as you said it seemed like some things were difficult to do, like scrolling down the page and opening random links while he did it.
Battery life is another show stopper as well. You need a minimum of 4, (preferably 6-8) hours battery at this stage of the game or you have seriously missed the mark. The extra added functionality of Windows isn't worth much if you need to have it plugged in half the time.
If this comes in at a similar price to the iPad, it might make some headway.
__________________
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How is booting in 30 seconds is bad? If it boots in 30, how long will it take to power on when hibernated? I can't remember the last time I powered down any of my computers, with the exception of updates or installs that required a restart.
Looks pretty custom to me. At some point HP ratcheted things back. My guess would be cost overruns (but again, just a guess).
Even if it was just an overlay more suited to touch input with Windows under the hood, it would have been better. We've tried the Windows Tablet Edition before and it didn't work - seemed like everybody was agreed on that (and I guess HP missed the memo). This is just another of the old tablets with more horsepower.
From a UI standpoint, the OS assumes mouse and keyboard input. Nothing wrong with that - interface designers have to make some kind of assumptions, but using a mouse/keyboard paradigm on a tablet is simply a recipe for disaster.
The problem isn't so much that it doesn't work - you could write a report or send an email or whatever - but that it doesn't do anything better. Mobile productivity? Buy a netbook. Casual movies or web surfing? Buy an Android or iOS device.
Edit: I thought this thing was supposed to run WebOS. Isn't that what HP bought Palm for?
Wiki:
Quote:
It is now believed that HP will make both Windows 7 and WebOS tablets, then market the former to the enterprise market and the latter to the consumer market
Looks like I was wrong. It does do something better than other devices: let's you provide forward thinking tablet technology to employees while playing nice with corporate IT policies. Of course the people who are forced to use these will probably hate them after a couple months...
After using an iPad for 10 minutes why would anybody ever go with a show/hide keyboard button? Such an incredibly bizarre move. I also think the size would bother me. For my liking the iPad is as absolutely small as I'd like it. Truthfully I'd prefer it to be a stitch bigger, but any smaller and it would lose appeal.
The problem isn't so much that it doesn't work - you could write a report or send an email or whatever - but that it doesn't do anything better. Mobile productivity? Buy a netbook. Casual movies or web surfing? Buy an Android or iOS device.
So your answer to why a full featured OS tablet isn't needed is because you can just buy and carry two other things instead?
I had an opportunity to live with an iPad for 2 weeks, and in the end used it mainly to play Rocket Bird and Cribbage. It just wasn't enough.
I want the portability of the tablet form, I want the intuitiveness of a multi-touch interface, and I also want a full featured OS that lets me be fully connected, fully entertained, and fully productive.
Now the typical iPad defender response is "the tablet form is intended to be a complementary device, it isn't intended to replace a lap top", to which I reply "Why the hell not?" Why inherently limit the usefulness of a product? It makes as much sense as it would have made to object to adding TV, DVR, movie, and music functionality to a PC on the grounds that a PC wasn't intended to be an entertainment device. TV's and stereos were specialized for entertainment, and PCs were to be complementary devices.
I'm not saying this tablet is the answer, or that Windows 7 is perfectly suited, but don't try to tell me that it's wrong or pointless to try to bring a full featured OS tablet to market because the iPad supposedly defined the form as being less than that.
The ergonomics of this thing are completely ######ed. If I'm holding it in my left hand, and want to type with my right, how am I supposed to easily and comfortably hit the keyboard button. Awful.
I'm not saying this tablet is the answer, or that Windows 7 is perfectly suited, but don't try to tell me that it's wrong or pointless to try to bring a full featured OS tablet to market because the iPad supposedly defined the form as being less than that.
I didn't. In fact I said this would have been better with a UI overlay
Quote:
So your answer to why a full featured OS tablet isn't needed is because you can just buy and carry two other things instead?
I want the portability of the tablet form, I want the intuitiveness of a *multi-touch interface, and I also want a full featured OS that lets me be fully *connected, fully *entertained, and fully *productive.
I said it doesn't do anything better than anything else. In other words, it doesn't solve a problem.
By your own criteria it scores a 3/4 (and that's generous because I'm not sure it will take full marks on the other three but we have to wait and see how it runs productivity programs and for info on battery life). 75% is a pass but it's not anything to write home about. HP isn't solving a problem because they're not properly taking advantage of the the touch interface.
You seem to have placed me in the 'iPad defender camp' by way of my disliking the HP Slate. I'm not. iPads aren't for everybody. I just really dislike both HP and the slate. Like I said, check out the Nav9 or ExoPC if you're looking for full featured.
Last edited by Flames0910; 09-25-2010 at 09:54 AM.
The ergonomics of this thing are completely ######ed. If I'm holding it in my left hand, and want to type with my right, how am I supposed to easily and comfortably hit the keyboard button. Awful.
Thats a really good point.
How does an iPad handle the keyboard?
__________________
"Wake up, Luigi! The only time plumbers sleep on the job is when we're working by the hour."
It just comes up when needed. I see this as a niche product for the MikeFs of the world. It does everything but not any better than anything out there. The WebOS version will be better suited for the masses and compete with iOS and Android tablets. Why they are releasing a Windows tablet before the WebOS version is confusing.
The really baffling part is how they told everyone after the Palm acquisition that there never was a Windows 7 tablet in the making, and then the media said whole thing with Ballmer announcing one was just a gimmick.
So... there is one, there isn't one, there is one... and what's the deal with WebOS? What kind of message does it send when you go from announcing a Windows tablet, to buying a mobile OS maker, to announcing there is no Windows tablet, to releasing a prototype of a Windows tablet? Is there something wrong with WebOS? Are they not able to adapt it properly? Would it cost more to go with WebOS than Windows 7 and are they coupling that with a low sales forecast, causing them to dump WebOS? Is MS doing their thing again?
These are all questions that have gone through my mind the last couple days. I haven't really had a lot of time to look into it though.
I'm not saying this tablet is the answer, or that Windows 7 is perfectly suited, but don't try to tell me that it's wrong or pointless to try to bring a full featured OS tablet to market because the iPad supposedly defined the form as being less than that.
If this is really what you think, then you don’t understand the tablet market very well, or don’t have much experience in the space.
Furthermore, history is full, absolutely full, of failed examples of tablet and tablet-like devices that attempted to adopt a full desktop OS metaphor and failed. They are the proverbial jack of all trades, master of none. Nobody wants an El Camino - they want a sedan, or they want a pickup (or, insert car metaphor of choice here, but is sure as hell isn’t the Camino they want)
I’m not saying this as a rabid iPad fan (I’m keenly following what Samsung and others are doing too), but as someone that’s used everything from a 2 megabyte monochrome Palm Pilot, to the earliest Newton’s, to ruggedized tablet devices, tablet PC, etc.
You seem to have placed me in the 'iPad defender camp' by way of my disliking the HP Slate. I'm not. iPads aren't for everybody. I just really dislike both HP and the slate. Like I said, check out the Nav9 or ExoPC if you're looking for full featured.
Sorry, that whole thing wasn't directed solely at you, I just used your post as a jumping off point for a general rant
If this is really what you think, then you don’t understand the tablet market very well, or don’t have much experience in the space.
Furthermore, history is full, absolutely full, of failed examples of tablet and tablet-like devices that attempted to adopt a full desktop OS metaphor and failed. They are the proverbial jack of all trades, master of none. Nobody wants an El Camino - they want a sedan, or they want a pickup (or, insert car metaphor of choice here, but is sure as hell isn’t the Camino they want)
I’m not saying this as a rabid iPad fan (I’m keenly following what Samsung and others are doing too), but as someone that’s used everything from a 2 megabyte monochrome Palm Pilot, to the earliest Newton’s, to ruggedized tablet devices, tablet PC, etc.
I have tried previous tablet devices, and the problem wasn't that they tried to provide a full OS, the problem was that the interface was lacking. A stylus just didn't cut it -- handwriting on a pc screen or typing with a stylus weren't big enough advantages (if at all) over the keyboard and mouse/trackpad.
Apple deserves huge credit for perfecting multi-touch, but there should be no a priori reason why a touch primary device can't feature an full OS that allows for productivity.
It's funny how you claim that everyone wants a sedan or pickup and offer the el camino as the failed alternative, ignoring the huge boom in crossover vehicles.
It's true that XP tablets, and maybe even the HP tablet, are the el caminos of the tablet world, but there's plenty of room for a Honda CR-V or Audi Q5
It's true that XP tablets, and maybe even the HP tablet, are the el caminos of the tablet world, but there's plenty of room for a Honda CR-V or Audi Q5
Yeah, but shoehorning a desktop OS into a tablet form factor isn’t going to accomplish that goal, as you already pointed out; that the interface isn’t suitable. Having a ctrl-alt-del button on a tablet joint underscores the absurdity of what HP is doing. Hell you can’t even enter text on this thing, without using a hardware button to pull up a software keyboard...talk about mixed metaphors
The HP Slate, your full tablet experience
