Arena Negotiation Discussion v2

[Joborule]

Not arena related, but the city has proceeded on funding $19M to the Foothills Fieldhouse project to get a detailed design, as well master plan for area as whole completed for next year. It is expected the facility will take four and a half years to construct the fieldhouse.

In the report below, it gives details into what the design should consist that we already know about (track, gyms, pool, and new twin arena), possibility of partnering up with the university in funding and building the facility, as well possibly what will be done with McMahon stadium. The McMahon Stadium Society is interested in starting phase 1 of 4 in renovations that would cost $25M. It would be renovated concourses with enhanced and new washrooms, concessions, and circulation.

If you're interested in reading the report to the council committee:

Deputy City Manager's Office Report to Foothills Athletic Park Redevelopment Advisory Committee - 2019 May 10

[Erick Estrada]

Just my opinion but that's pretty underwhelming for a city fieldhouse. It's not really much larger than a typical community center. I don't see much of a draw here for people that live in the far south. They can build this state of the art library but when it comes to a fieldhouse this is the best they can do? Pretty weak. I get that Nenshi and some of the latte sippers in city hall don't see a lot of value in sports but man this city is falling behind in this area.

[Roughneck]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

It's not really much larger than a typical community center.

If your idea of a typical community centre is the Rocky Ridge YMCA, I guess.

[Joborule]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Just my opinion but that's pretty underwhelming for a city fieldhouse. It's not really much larger than a typical community center. I don't see much of a draw here for people that live in the far south. They can build this state of the art library but when it comes to a fieldhouse this is the best they can do? Pretty weak. I get that Nenshi and some of the latte sippers in city hall don't see a lot of value in sports but man this city is falling behind in this area.

What would you be expecting for it to be more of what you would envision?

[edslunch]

Originally Posted by Roughneck

If your idea of a typical community centre is the Rocky Ridge YMCA, I guess.

I was at Rocky Ridge YMCA last night for the first time - what an amazing facility!

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Roughneck

If your idea of a typical community centre is the Rocky Ridge YMCA, I guess.

Even the Genesis center in the NE isn’t much smaller than this concept. Don’t get me wrong it looks like a nice center but I was expecting a little more from a city field house.

[Joborule]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Even the Genesis center in the NE isn’t much smaller than this concept. Don’t get me wrong it looks like a nice center but I was expecting a little more from a city field house.

If we're going to compare to big sporting facilities for a city, a good one to compare to is the Toronto Pan Am Sports Centre; which happens to be a city/university partnership. That one is pretty similar to what's being proposed for the fieldhouse, except that it doesn't feature a fieldhouse itself. So no turf/field playing surface.

Toronto Pan Am Sports Centre

Spoiler!

[Roughneck]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Even the Genesis center in the NE isn’t much smaller than this concept. Don’t get me wrong it looks like a nice center but I was expecting a little more from a city field house.

It doesn't look like anything yet, it hasn't been designed. Anything in the report is just for massing.



But there are limitations due to the utilitarian nature of the fieldhouse. Your footprint and shape is dependent on needing a big rectangle with lots of room above it to accommodate the field and the track. That basically leaves you with an airplane hangar type design that you can't load up too heavy on top.

[sureLoss]

Not new arena updates but this station services the Saddledome and will be one of two that will service the new arena.

City has released conceptual drawings for the new Victoria Park/Stampede station. Will allow traffic to enter the stampede grounds at 17th ave and also eliminate the pedestrian bridge.

From @mpotkins

[Scary Eloranta]

^^^ That's looks like a nightmare. Why wouldn't they put the tracks underground like most other cities do? Just seems like a potential gong show like the crappy station setup at McMahon.


Maybe its because Vic Park is further away?

[Mass_nerder]

Originally Posted by Scary Eloranta

^^^ That's looks like a nightmare. Why wouldn't they put the tracks underground like most other cities do? Just seems like a potential gong show like the crappy station setup at McMahon.


Maybe its because Vic Park is further away?

This is the existing station running south, parallel to the convention center. I don't think they're doing anything to the existing red line alignment.
*Edit* Basically where 17th is being extended into the the grounds

[Jimmy Stang]

If I'm not mistaken, isn't the potential spot for the new arena further north and east near the CP tracks? Which would line up nicely with the Green Line, of course.

This station is... interesting. I like the idea of being easier to access from the street, more open and inviting, etc. but I can't help but think that Macleod and 17th will become a bit of a gong show at busy times. That's an awful lot of people, trains, and cars sharing a general space. The trains I trust the most not to screw it up. Pedestrians and drivers not so much.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Scary Eloranta

^^^ That's looks like a nightmare. Why wouldn't they put the tracks underground like most other cities do? Just seems like a potential gong show like the crappy station setup at McMahon.


Maybe its because Vic Park is further away?

Well for one thing, it's right near the river. And in a flood zone.

[You Need a Thneed]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Well for one thing, it's right near the river. And in a flood zone.

The Green Line is literally going UNDER the river.

It’s something to take into account, not a deal breaker.

But, it would be a LOT more money, and likely would mean that the south line wouldn’t be connected to the rest of the LRT system for at least a year (almost certainly more), and have no Erlton or Stampede stations for that time frame.

Either the Big 4 (permanently) or Macleod Trail (during construction) would have to be out of service.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by You Need a Thneed

The Green Line is literally going UNDER the river.

It’s something to take into account, not a deal breaker.

But, it would be a LOT more money, and likely would mean that the south line wouldn’t be connected to the rest of the LRT system for at least a year (almost certainly more), and have no Erlton or Stampede stations for that time frame.

Either the Big 4 (permanently) or Macleod Trail (during construction) would have to be out of service.

Not the station, I think. All of the lines are underground at some point, but a station underground is a different kettle of fish. I only know of one and that's on high ground (Westbrook).

[You Need a Thneed]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Not the station, I think. All of the lines are underground at some point, but a station underground is a different kettle of fish. I only know of one and that's on high ground (Westbrook).

Still, not really different than many buildings downtown that go underground below river levels. Entrances would need to be above flood plain.

[Joborule]

Isn't the 2nd Ave/Eau Claire Station for the Green Line suppose to be in a floodway on 2nd Street SW?

[metroneck]

Seems on par with the 3 NCAA Div 1 facilities I frequent here in the Denver area.

I’d say that puts it in good company.

[getbak]

Originally Posted by sureLoss

Not new arena updates but this station services the Saddledome and will be one of two that will service the new arena.

City has released conceptual drawings for the new Victoria Park/Stampede station. Will allow traffic to enter the stampede grounds at 17th ave and also eliminate the pedestrian bridge.

Here's the overhead view of the planned new station design:




Based on these drawings, I think the plan is to rebuild/repurpose the existing "C" platform as the new Northbound platform (and the existing track for the "C" platform would be the new Northbound track). That would allow them to make the existing Northbound track into the new Southbound track and build the new Southbound platform in place of the current platform.


What will be really interesting is how the construction of this project is going to happen. The plan is for construction to begin immediately following the Stampede next year and go for about 3 years (that will include the full construction including the new 17th Ave crossing).

Presumably, they'll try to keep the station open as much as possible during construction, but you have to think it will need to close for some time eventually.

When they rebuilt Chinook in 2013, it was closed from mid-January until Labour Day.

Between the Stampede and all the events that the Saddledome hosts, closing the station for any time from mid-September through mid-July would cause massive headaches for many people.

[shogged]

Wouldn’t be impossible to bury both stampede stations using cut and cover. That would be the ultimate solution to opening up stampede park from the west

This is basically chinook station 2.0 which is fine, will be a big improvement