[Trade] Toffoli to Flames for 2022 1st *, 2023 5th, Heineman, and Pitlick

[GioforPM]

I didn’t know some people wanted Miroschnichenko that badly.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by gvitaly

I don't get why anyone is upset with Toffoli's production with respect to his contract. At the absolute worst you get a 40 point guy that is responsible defensively, a good option on the PP, and is great in the room and with young players. Just listen to all the praise the players in MTL had for the guy when he left.

Was the price for Toffoli too high? not really. He just had an amazing season in 20-21, where he was one of the top scorers in the league and one of the best value contracts for such a scorer. He won cups with LA, and made the finals with MTL, so he knows what it takes to get there, and I'm sure he will be working his tail off to do it with Calgary. A 1st and a prospect used to be the price for a rental at the deadline.

Finally, people also expect a professional's athlete to a new team to be seamless each and every time. I thought Toffoli showed some chemistry with Mangiapane and Ruzicka/Dube as a line, but that was broken up once Jarnkrok got here. After that it was a bit of a struggle, as the team seemed to be experimenting with lines, trying to find the best combination or to generate chemistry. I think we will get to see a much more consistent version of Toffoli next season with at least 25G and 25A(on an 82 game pace). Is that worth a 1st round pick and a prospect? absolutely.

It's also Sutter's system. Generally mid six players aren't going to hit career highs playing under Sutter. They'll put up consistent points but also be forced to play more two way play then normal.

Toffoli at .5 ppg is exactly what the Flames need more of. If the entire mid six was doing that, the team would win more games.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by jjgallow

I forgot you did too, I had to look this thread up in my history and then check for posts that translated as "we know it was a bad trade but shame on you for criticising it"

Sounds like an exciting Thursday night.

[CalgaryFan1988]

Originally Posted by jjgallow

It was a dramatic dropoff in production from his regular season in a year that was his best ever in the NHL, and also a clear outlier, which the Flames bought into.

Buy high, sell low. Pay for it with draft picks.

Are you really that unaware to think the Flames didn't know who they were getting when they traded for Toffoli?

I mean, it's not like Sutter has any previous history coaching him or anything.

[saillias]

Would definitely rather have that 1st right about now.

Didn't really get the fit in the first place, didn't see a need for a 4 million 2nd/3rd line RW. They already signed Coleman for the same role. Now in a cap crunch where they might need to clear cap to keep the important RFAs. Maybe they can trade him?

[djsFlames]

Toffoli has been full value for his 4M cap hit.

What's a 25-30th overall pick going to do for you any time soon, if ever?

Get rid of Toffoli and next season we're already pining again for another RWer that can score.

Nope. You hang on to as many good value contracts like that as you can.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by djsFlames

Toffoli has been full value for his 4M cap hit.

What's a 25-30th overall pick going to do for you any time soon, if ever?

Get rid of Toffoli and next season we're already pining again for another RWer that can score.

Nope. You hang on to as many good value contracts like that as you can.

This is supposed to be a very weak draft, no? While picks are valuable, context is important. Having a 20 goal scorer on your roster during the prime years of your stars is much more important than having a prospect that may struggle to play regular games in a meaningful role. 25-30 in a weak year isn't a guarantee of being an NHler by any stretch. People often do overvalue prospects over known quantities, but this is ridiculous.

[agulati]

Toffoli is at a good value contract for next 2 years. 4 million for 20 goals/50 points (if he can get there) is a very good cap hit.

[Ragnar]

Toffoli sucks. He was brutal in the playoffs.

Cant skate or pass or make a decent play in the O-zone. Not sure what Tre was thinking.

[RedHawk12]

Originally Posted by Ragnar

Toffoli sucks. He was brutal in the playoffs.

Cant skate or pass or make a decent play in the O-zone. Not sure what Tre was thinking.

You can pretty easily recoup the assets traded away at the deadline two years from now if you really wanted to. And still get at least a year and a half where he helps your core players stay competitive.

[FiveSeven]

Originally Posted by Ragnar

Toffoli sucks. He was brutal in the playoffs.

Cant skate or pass or make a decent play in the O-zone. Not sure what Tre was thinking.

[MrMike]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Loser

I figured this thread would have ended after this comment

[Steve Bozek]

Originally Posted by MrMike

I figured this thread would have ended after this comment

As it should have.

[dino7c]

reminds me of people trashing Markstrom last summer...hopefully with similar results

[jjgallow]

Originally Posted by MrMike

I figured this thread would have ended after this comment

You must be referring to our playoff performance.

This thread and trade never should have happened as clearly demonstrated by the severe, severe whooping we received in the playoffs, highlighting our obvious need for D, and quite frankly, playoff goaltending. D, in particular, something we were well aware of prior to the playoffs but don't seem to ever care about.

So let's pretend for a second that it somehow made sense to blow a first rounder on a rental. And by the way, it didn't, which is plain obvious.

Okay, we're going to blow our first rounder. What on earth made Treliving think our greatest need was a 30 year old winger? Yeah ok, our RW is an issue. But so is our RD, our LD, our Center, and quite frankly, our goaltending (separate rant on this).

How can you possibly justify blowing a first rounder on our maybe 4th biggest priority, ignoring RD, LD? Center? IMHO not recognizing this for a GM is a fireable offense. Sure, maybe hindsight is 20-20 but this really was pretty blatant. It's like he was just going for entertainment.


Now about blowing that first rounder. Sorry, but we have an entire team of talent that does not perform in the playoffs, ever, and we've seen that time and time and time again. Was it really necessary to blow a first rounder on this core when the result is so incredibly predictable in the playoffs?

The only arguement I see is in here is Toffoli may be serviceable for a few regular seasons. A quick math check makes that an aweful use of a first rounder.

[AndyM]

Fireable offense?

You like hyperboles.

[Jiri Hrdina]

It wasn't a rental.
the main problem with the D in the playoffs was they lost their best dman in Tanev.

If you want people to respect your thoughts on this site, then treat others with some level of respect and show that you actually know what you are talking about.

Coming back on here and posting "told you so" is just such awful behavior. It's the time of stuff that drags down communities. Here's a news flash: this site has been debating the Toffoli trade for weeks. You've offered nothing fresh or new except errors.

So if your only point was to come back and somehow pretend that you were "right". Save us. We don't need it. We are just doing fine without that type of non contribution.

[jjgallow]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

It wasn't a rental.
the main problem with the D in the playoffs was that Tanev was their best Dman.

fixed that for you. also,

I told you so

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by jjgallow

fixed that for you. also,

I told you so

thanks for proving my point.

[Flamesfan05]

Originally Posted by jjgallow

You must be referring to our playoff performance.

This thread and trade never should have happened as clearly demonstrated by the severe, severe whooping we received in the playoffs, highlighting our obvious need for D, and quite frankly, playoff goaltending. D, in particular, something we were well aware of prior to the playoffs but don't seem to ever care about.

So let's pretend for a second that it somehow made sense to blow a first rounder on a rental. And by the way, it didn't, which is plain obvious.

Okay, we're going to blow our first rounder. What on earth made Treliving think our greatest need was a 30 year old winger? Yeah ok, our RW is an issue. But so is our RD, our LD, our Center, and quite frankly, our goaltending (separate rant on this).

How can you possibly justify blowing a first rounder on our maybe 4th biggest priority, ignoring RD, LD? Center? IMHO not recognizing this for a GM is a fireable offense. Sure, maybe hindsight is 20-20 but this really was pretty blatant. It's like he was just going for entertainment.


Now about blowing that first rounder. Sorry, but we have an entire team of talent that does not perform in the playoffs, ever, and we've seen that time and time and time again. Was it really necessary to blow a first rounder on this core when the result is so incredibly predictable in the playoffs?

The only arguement I see is in here is Toffoli may be serviceable for a few regular seasons. A quick math check makes that an aweful use of a first rounder.

Both Jarnkrok and Toffoli trades turned out to be bad

But that’s what you pay when you want to go for it when you still have your best players.