[Rumour] Kadri used his NTC to nix a trade to the Flames involving TJ Brodie

[DazzlinDino]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

The Neal signing was almost universally praised when it was announced. I don't pin that one on Treliving for a second (and Neal could still work out, he finished the year marginally better with 12 points in his last 25 games).

Something that I don't know if everyone knows:

Since New Years' Eve:

Mangiapane - 13 points in 37 games
Neal - 12 points in 25 games

I'm really willing to give Neal a shot with a better centre than Jankowski.

These are both good point. Not knocking the players, or BT just looking for answers. It might be lack of experience concerning the GM's approach?

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

The Neal signing was almost universally praised when it was announced. I don't pin that one on Treliving for a second (and Neal could still work out, he finished the year marginally better with 12 points in his last 25 games).

Something that I don't know if everyone knows:

Since New Years' Eve:

Mangiapane - 13 points in 37 games
Neal - 12 points in 25 games

I'm really willing to give Neal a shot with a better centre than Jankowski.

I'm 100% willing to give Neal another shot. I'm not sure I completely buy the excuse of him not being able to train much the last two off seasons, but I'm willing to accept it. Finishing the year going almost 0.5ppg is a better sign than most here will acknowledge

[Dion]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

The Neal signing was almost universally praised when it was announced. I don't pin that one on Treliving for a second (and Neal could still work out, he finished the year marginally better with 12 points in his last 25 games).

Something that I don't know if everyone knows:

Since New Years' Eve:

Mangiapane - 13 points in 37 games
Neal - 12 points in 25 games

I'm really willing to give Neal a shot with a better centre than Jankowski.

To be fair I wasn't happy with the Neal signing because of the term he got. A
2-3 year deal would have been fine as opposed to the 5 he got.

[TheScorpion]

Originally Posted by Dion

To be fair I wasn't happy with the Neal signing because of the term he got. A
2-3 year deal would have been fine as opposed to the 5 he got.

Hey, I said almost universally praised.

Looking like a good call so far.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by DazzlinDino

I somewhat disagree. Sure maybe he couldn't see it coming; But if he had the prior experience he may have done things differently, He could have put them on show me contracts or signed them to slightly bigger contracts for shorter term like Chicago is doing with Lehner 1yr $5 million. Should he be absolved of blame, is it lack of experience, or just bad luck? Either way maybe he is looking in the wrong places, age, range, type of player. This is an area that can assessed and improved upon going forward just like Chicago is doing. It may be on the players but the decision to go ahead and pay them has met mixed results so what is the solution?

Neither of them were coming here on one year deals...both were coming off big playoffs and had multi year offers elsewhere.

hindsight neither worked out, #### happens

Calgary is a tough market for a GM...people need to stop looking at this big american markets and saying "just do that"

[DazzlinDino]

Originally Posted by dino7c

Neither of them were coming here on one year deals...both were coming off big playoffs and had multi year offers elsewhere.

hindsight neither worked out, #### happens

Calgary is a tough market for a GM...people need to stop looking at this big american markets and saying "just do that"

BT talks about improving all the time and about areas he could have done better. I am just trying to look at why we have signed 2 players that both have struggled as these 2 have. Sure "it happens". It is still a set back and we want to win the cup so assessing and improving as we go gets us a little closer.

Some people get married 3, 4 times before they realize, " hey maybe I need to take a different approach.

Maybe both "coming off big playoffs was the wrong approach?"

[The Professor]

Are there any rumours about what plan B is/was for moving Brodie?

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by jaikorven

I don't understand how BT is responsible for Brower or Neal though. By all accounts they should have worked out. It's on the players not the GM with these two.

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The flames traded for and signed middle tier players to get to the playoffs rather than wait a little longer to build through the draft.

Offered term and no trades to players who didn't deserve it and put themselves in cap jail as a result.

For good teams, free agency is for adding small dollar depth, top tier free agent to push you over the top or key top tier role player to address vital need.

The flames under treliving use free agency to plug holes in the middle of the lineup.

That's how you get Kevin Hayes at 7 million.

https://thewincolumn.ca/2019/06/28/b...dont-mix-well/

Basically all of trelivings free agent signings have become an inconvenience with only a couple notable exceptions.

Is there a other gm in the league with as many buyouts as Tre over his tenure?

It's not a good look.

[Manhattanboy]

Nor is all the near misses, Bishop, Stone, Zucker, Kadri etc.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Manhattanboy

Nor is all the near misses, Bishop, Stone, Zucker, Kadri etc.

The near misses are glaring only because of how active Treliving is overall. Is there another GM who has consummated as many big trades as Treliving has? Hamilton, Hamonic, Lindholm, Hanifin etc.

I would much rather the GM near miss from time to time as opposed to seldom swinging or hitting.


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[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

The near misses are glaring only because of how active Treliving is overall. Is there another GM who has consummated as many big trades as Treliving has? Hamilton, Hamonic, Lindholm, Hanifin etc.

I would much rather the GM near miss from time to time as opposed to seldom swinging or hitting.


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What on Earth...

No text, the misses are glaring because they are all for players who would've filled massive holes in the lineup were it not for having spent assets and caps space on players who weren't worth it.

The flames could've used vezina Calibre goaltending last season, or a 30 goal second line centre, or a top 5 winger in the entire league.

Unfortunately the flames had Neal stone and Lazar instead.

Oh well, at least Tre went Big Game Hunting.

This quoted post is essentially saying you'd rather he made bad trades than no trades which I guess is par for the course for fans who just want to cheer everything.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by Dion

To be fair I wasn't happy with the Neal signing because of the term he got. A
2-3 year deal would have been fine as opposed to the 5 he got.

He wasn't available for 2-3 years. It was likely 5 or nothing.

[Rando]

It's almost farcical the way some hold certain teams up on a pedestal or build their own strawmen hockey teams to slag the Flames. Treliving's made mistakes, bad signings, too many buy-outs, but guess what, "good teams" plug holes in their line-ups via free agency as well, especially in the middle. There were hundreds of player transactions yesterday and it wasn't exclusive to depth or high end players.

Good teams like Pittsburg signed Tanev yesterday, good teams like Washington signed Brett Connolly. Good teams like the ones in the cup final a month ago had David Backas, Tyler Bozak and David Perron in their respective line-ups, three good players but no one will mistake them for stars nor 4th line depth.

The Flames and Brad Treliving have lots of work to do but stop lying to yourself about what got the good teams where they are. It certainly isn't mistake free signings. All teams have free agent blunders.

[Snuffleupagus]

Originally Posted by btimbit

I'm 100% willing to give Neal another shot. I'm not sure I completely buy the excuse of him not being able to train much the last two off seasons, but I'm willing to accept it. Finishing the year going almost 0.5ppg is a better sign than most here will acknowledge

Commodore mentioned he spent the summer healing rather than training and likely was near the bottom in fitness training, I guess we'll have to find out if it was just an excuse or not.

Originally Posted by The Cobra

He wasn't available for 2-3 years. It was likely 5 or nothing.

Yeah, Vegas offered him 4 x $5.25m

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

Commodore mentioned he spent the summer healing rather than training and likely was near the bottom in fitness training, I guess we'll have to find out if it was just an excuse or not.

Yeah, Vegas offered him 4 x $5.25m

I don’t like that argument. How could he have not gotten in game shape by April?

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

Commodore mentioned he spent the summer healing rather than training and likely was near the bottom in fitness training, I guess we'll have to find out if it was just an excuse or not.

Yeah exactly. Not sure I completely buy it but it does make some sense. I'm willing to find out though. One positive sign is he's at least been saying the right things, not acting like nothing is wrong like Brouwer.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

I don’t like that argument. How could he have not gotten in game shape by April?

A lot of the wear and tear of the season just allows players to maintain their bodies throughout the season. It's why so many players put so much emphasis on shorter breaks in the summer now. Improvements are done in the summer, maintenance is done in the season.

If Neal spent the summer healing, it's unlikely that once the grind begins he'll have time to focus on strength training to ensure his first few strides are fast etc. If you watch some of the training Frolik did last summer in preparation for the season, and then imagine Neal not doing any of that, you can see why there was an issue.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

I don’t like that argument. How could he have not gotten in game shape by April?

From what I remember based on some player quotes, the summer is for getting in shape, and the season is basically just trying to maintain it and get through.

I think because of the tough slog of a full season there’s not much players can can do to make any big gains or improvements. The season takes a big and continuous toll on the body. I think if you’re behind the 8 ball on October 1, you’re likely stuck there. It’s tough making gains when you’re in a constant cycle of preparing for and recovering from games.

You may not like it, but I don’t think it’s rare. Off the top of my head I can’t think of a guy who has come into training camp behind and caught up to his peers as the season goes on.

[transplant99]

Look no further than Nylander last year, and he could train through the summer but was never able to catch up on game speed after not being ready for things because of camp. Neal same thing and although he was in camp etc, he was never able to get to speed because he hadn't been able to train through the summer.

That sounds plausible at least.

I think he has a bounce back to some degree at least, because he cant be any worse than he was last year and he seems like a straight shooter and honorable guy who knows he has to get the work in this time.

[btimbit]

A bounceback isn't ridiculous. I don't think he puts up first line numbers by any means but 40 points would be a massive success