[Trade] Elias Lindholm + Noah Hanifin to Flames for D. Hamilton, Micheal Ferland, & Adam Fox

[Moneyhands23]

Originally Posted by stang

https://youtu.be/nlwXRkAhs6c?t=62

Jesus christ! Lol

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

First of all, I also believe there was a little more than just on-ice stuff here, there has been a fair bit of smoke and speculation from many sources.

However, I don't agree with the bold. I believe that this trade makes total sense - and I like it - strictly from a hockey perspective. Hamilton was a stats darling, and he has a great shot, but the way he played defense, and the way he carried himself on the ice, was more than enough reason for me to be in favour of this trade.

I can agree with this as I also like the trade from a hockey perspective. It certainly was more than just the off the ice stuff but I feel the off the ice issues was the catalyst of the trade.

You just do not see players of his ilk traded twice by age 25 if there is not something else at play. A 25 year old Dman who can play on your top pair, put up 15+goals and 50pts, while making $5.75M for 3 years is not typically a player that gets traded.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

The Bruins have a history of giving up early on top players for really odd reasons as they traded Thornton, Seguin, and Hamilton largely for a bag of pucks because of perceived issues. You can forgive any hockey fan for being highly skeptical of anything coming out of the organization when it comes to dealing with their top players.

I don't intend to defend any of those trades individually, nor do I think much of some of the badmouthing that seems to follow their traded players, but the Bruins have shown to be a rather successful organization. Maybe part of it is a philosophy of not falling in love with their own players.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

I don't intend to defend any of those trades individually, nor do I think much of some of the badmouthing that seems to follow their traded players, but the Bruins have shown to be a rather successful organization. Maybe part of it is a philosophy of not falling in love with their own players.

They won a cup but it's debatable how successful they have been. No it's not a philosophy of not falling in love with their own players. Joe Thornton is surefire HOF player and the biggest blunder in the history of that organization. It's just the way they roll.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

They won a cup but it's debatable how successful they have been. No it's not a philosophy of not falling in love with their own players. Joe Thornton is surefire HOF player and the biggest blunder in the history of that organization. It's just the way they roll.

Not that debatable. They are in the mix more often than they are not. They are doing something right which is not the same as defending the Thornton trade which given the return was obviously pretty bad.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

I don't intend to defend any of those trades individually, nor do I think much of some of the badmouthing that seems to follow their traded players, but the Bruins have shown to be a rather successful organization. Maybe part of it is a philosophy of not falling in love with their own players.

I think it is good drafting. Pasternak was picked in the 20’s and is easily top 5 in a redraft. McAvoy, Carlo making an impact so young helped limit the loss of Hamilton imo. Marchand elevating from a 20 goal 50pt pest to an elite first line player also contributed.

[Matata]

Watching Bostons trades is like watching Mr Magoo walk through a construction site.

[Funkhouser]

Originally Posted by 868904

He's a younger, better skating and bigger Denis Wideman; who happens to provide the same offense, same defense, same contribution.

Disagree.
He's more like a younger, redheaded, bearded, uppity Joe Colborne

[Nelson]

https://public.tableau.com/shared/N6...play_count=yes

A more appropriate comparison for Dougie Hamilton is Seth Jones. Dougie Hamilton has better results in every category except penalty +/-, but I think it's still fair to compare them.

[Enoch Root]

Hamilton had an expected goals for of 97 and an expected goals against of 63 and he was +1

Jones had an expected goals for of 90 and an expected goals against of 36 and he was +10

(a higher expected goals against number is better - it is reversed)

So either Hamilton is really unlucky and Jones is phenomenally lucky, or maybe these numbers don't show what they think they show.

[Nelson]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Hamilton had an expected goals for of 97 and an expected goals against of 63 and he was +1

Jones had an expected goals for of 90 and an expected goals against of 36 and he was +10

(a higher expected goals against number is better - it is reversed)

So either Hamilton is really unlucky and Jones is phenomenally lucky, or maybe these numbers don't show what they think they show.

Yeah, it could be that all these metrics, which show Hamilton in a higher or much higher percentile than Jones, are flawed. Or it could just be that Dougie Hamilton is an elite defenceman. I remember the days when people used to complain about Eric Karlsson's lack of game in the defensive zone. They complained until they realized it didn't matter because when he was on the ice his team always had the puck in the other team's end. It's the same thing with Dougie Hamilton. Oh no, he doesn't throw big body checks. Oh no, he doesn't block shots. He has no heart, no grit and is not a team player.

The truth is that Dougie Hamilton is also flawed. Sometimes he coughs up the puck and looks silly. He takes way too many penalties and causes the other team to take way too few. He is not mean and, in that sense, is not hard to play against.

But, come on! There is no doubt that Dougie Hamilton also has enormous strengths. Otherwise, his team would not do so well in all of these metrics with him on the ice. He had a better effect on the Flames' performance in all of them than Jones did on the Blue Jackets' performance despite playing with approximately equal teammates and against much harder opposition.

Now, that is not to suggest that Dougie Hamilton was a team player. It looks like he may not have been. But I don't think anyone can truly gather that from how he played. He is an amazing hockey player.

The Flames gave up a ton in this trade. Now, let's hope that Lindholm's really positive playmaking abilities, which suggest he should've had better results in the past, lead to an explosion in points this year and Hanifin continues to develop into a Seth Jones/Dougie Hamilton type defenceman.

[Tailgator]

Originally Posted by Matata

Watching Bostons trades is like watching Mr Magoo walk through a construction site.

Thanked for the mental picture and subsequent snort/laugh.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

I don't intend to defend any of those trades individually, nor do I think much of some of the badmouthing that seems to follow their traded players, but the Bruins have shown to be a rather successful organization. Maybe part of it is a philosophy of not falling in love with their own players.

They should have loved Thornton just a little more.

[theslymonkey]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

I don't intend to defend any of those trades individually, nor do I think much of some of the badmouthing that seems to follow their traded players, but the Bruins have shown to be a rather successful organization. Maybe part of it is a philosophy of not falling in love with their own players.

Or they fall in love with the right players (Bergeron, Chara, Rask) and keep the rest moving and refreshing for high picks.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by theslymonkey

Or they fall in love with the right players (Bergeron, Chara, Rask) and keep the rest moving and refreshing for high picks.

Seems like they have a lot of good players.

[Chonger]

Originally Posted by FiveSeven

It's completely normal nowadays. I've been a professional gamer for many years. People stalk every detail of everything I do. If I play on another account people have recorded me talking and compared my voice to keep tabs on what I'm doing. People literally have nothing to do so they seem to enjoy trolling and stalking people nonstop like it's their job. It's actually mind-blowingly ridiculous. For me it isn't impacting my day to day life like an athlete but lord baby jesus it's bad enough.

Csgo? I am stalking you?

Sent from my SM-G930W8 using Tapatalk

[FiveSeven]

Originally Posted by Chonger

Csgo? I am stalking you?

Sent from my SM-G930W8 using Tapatalk

Hahahaha. Yeah, csgo. Right now I'm patiently waiting for NHL 19, was playing beta, it's awesome.
Flames gonna be fun to play for once.

[FlamesAddiction]

I will admit, I am a bit of a chicken little when it comes to these things. I was really expecting the Hanifin signing right after Brouwer was bought out. It's just been so quiet. Although I guess that could be a good thing that no side is leaking information or trying to negotiate through the media. I also get that this is a difficult contract.

[jayswin]

Boston's strength is putting bullets in the drafting chamber - something Flashwalken constantly hammers home as a must - and then excelling at the draft table.

You do that constantly and you can afford to lose stars and still build a strong team on nice, short cycles, rather than the 5-6 year rebuilds most teams do.

[Strange Brew]

Yeah when it comes to ranking your confidence in an organization, not all categories are created equal. Drafting and development are much more important. That, and the Bruins have been served well by a philosophy that it’s not disastrous to move on from elite players.