Don Cherry Fired by SN - Poll Added

[Barnet Flame]

Originally Posted by Manhattanboy

She was all wound up and totally incoherent.

If she teamed up with Don, it could be a great show!

I might pitch this to Rebel News.

[R0taryRocket]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

You are wrong.

The usage of the words "racist," and "racism" is extended beyond mere ethnicity to include prejudice on the basis of regional distinctions as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oxford English Dictionary
racist, n. and adj.
Pronunciation: Brit. /ˈreɪsɪst/, U.S. /ˈreɪsᵻst/

a person whose words or actions display prejudice or discrimination on the grounds of race (see race n.6 1b, 1c, 1d). Also in extended use: a person who is prejudiced against people of other nationalities.

So, yes. What Don Cherry said is most definitely racist.

Originally Posted by Textcritic

The narrow definition of racism to exclude prejudices based on region or nationality is wrong. There is nothing debatable in these points.

I think your extended version of the extended version only creates confusion. By region? My interpretation is this applies if you are specific about a particular region or a group of similar regions. Immigration represents a large diverse range of regions. I think it was pretty clear DC was talking about immigrants when he said, "you people ... come here." What he said was discriminatory and divisive, full stop. You can't argue it, nor should it be supported.

Was it racist? I've heard the argument, and you just KNOW what he meant by "you people." Or, how did he determine who is an immigrant by just walking the streets of Toronto? Thus the argument requires you to make assumptions and put words in his mouth. What about another theory? In terms of geographic distribution, Toronto leads every other Canadian city by a considerable margin when it comes to where immigrants settle (from Stats Canada). So his opinion could have been formed by simply observing a good majority of people in TO not wearing the poppy. Either way, no one knows what he was thinking, other than he was very discriminatory and unfairly singled out a group of people comprised of a diverse range of nationalities. Respectfully, this is where I think TextCritic is not using the term correctly, but I am open to hearing a different opinion

[sketchyt]

My mom is an immigrant. I asked her about the whole Don Cherry saga/debacle. Her words, translated:

"I disagree with him. I think it's funny that other people are telling me what I should be offended about though."

I've asked other extended family. More or less the same comments.

IMO, Cherry was wrong. Should've been fired. You can't say stuff like that in a public position as an employee but that should be the end of it.

The joyful glee I see from some people from the firing is disturbing to me. The 'us' vs 'them', left vs right, you're a snow flake / you're a racist... lowest common denominator style of thinking that is becoming more and more pervasive in Canadian culture is something I'm not used to in this country and is something I don't like.

[cannon7]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Ah, so when I critique your position, it's a "personal attack," and when you do the same, you're quick to defend that your weak definition of "personal attack" actually doesn't apply to your posts. Weird! lol

If you look at my posting history, this thread aside, I make a concerted effort to only address the views expressed and not the poster. I don't even remember poster names, for all I know this is the first time we've debated. I'm not taking anything you say personally. I just would like a counter argument more thoughtful than "you're wrong". I know you think you've elaborated as to my wrongness, but we'll have to agree to disagree there.

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

I'm just playing with you. Call my position that of a six-year-old all you want, it's all good, just a bit phony to play the weak "personal attack" card and act the same way to others.

If you want to take the six year old comment as a personal attack that's fine. I could have probably worded that better. Another poster in this thread (again, not keeping track of names, so don't remember off hand) said much the same thing but without resorting to a comment that could be taken as a personal attack. So I'll defer to that poster however many pages back and retract the six year old comment.

[カナダ人です]

I've read through most of this thread, and contributed my 2 cents.

Saying that, I'd like to point out a positive: most posters here seem reasonable, at least understand why Cherry's comments were inappropriate (even if they disagree with Sportsnet's actions), and are generally empathetic to what new Canadians have to deal with when they come here, and are against the "blame immigrants" rhetoric some people spew. (We're basically all immigrants or descendants of immigrants anyway, etc etc blah blah)

So good on you CP. The conversation didn't (hasn't?) devolve into a classic, roll-your-eyes internet #####storm of hate and trolls and hyper SJWs.

Now I'm off to the E=NG thread for some laughs. Take care my fellow Canadians! (and PRs and visitors!)

[Roughneck]

Originally Posted by Barnet Flame

If she teamed up with Don, it could be a great show!

I might pitch this to Rebel News.

Make it a PPV event and donate the proceeds to the Legion.

[cannon7]

"Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people."
- Eleanor Roosevelt

[ST20]

Originally Posted by cannon7

"Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people."
- Eleanor Roosevelt

"You People"

My last comment in here! It's game day so let's talk some hockey

[Robbob]

I wonder if it is time to move this to the OT side.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by sketchyt

My mom is an immigrant. I asked her about the whole Don Cherry saga/debacle. Her words, translated:

"I disagree with him. I think it's funny that other people are telling me what I should be offended about though."

I've asked other extended family. More or less the same comments.

IMO, Cherry was wrong. Should've been fired. You can't say stuff like that in a public position as an employee but that should be the end of it.

The joyful glee I see from some people from the firing is disturbing to me. The 'us' vs 'them', left vs right, you're a snow flake / you're a racist... lowest common denominator style of thinking that is becoming more and more pervasive in Canadian culture is something I'm not used to in this country and is something I don't like.

Okay, well fist of all, with all due respect to your mom it's actually perfectly okay for a society of citizens to defend a minority group (say, immigrants).

They're not telling individual immigrants what they should and shouldn't be offended by, that's absurd. They're speaking out against something that is offensive to many immigrants and non-immigrants. Very different things.

Secondly, you grouped "us vs them" into your list of issues that are permeating Canadian culture that you don't like....but that's exactly what Don Cherry was doing, and it's ultimately what got him fired.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by cannon7

"Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people."
- Eleanor Roosevelt

I'm very confused about how this quote is applied to the thread. I'm seeing ideas, people and an event being discussed by everyone in here, including you. Are you saying everyone has a great, average and small mind?

[Flamenspiel]

^^The quote refers to gossip. Which is what this thread and most of the discussion on this matter has become.

[jayswin]

Yeah, I get that. Assuming he posted it directed at people who were opposing him in this thread I was confused as to how it applied to others and not him.

[Scorch]

Looks like there was a small group of protesters outside of Rogers headquarters in Toronto

https://toronto.citynews.ca/2019/11/...-headquarters/

And

https://twitter.com/user/status/1194687935230205954

[Scorch]

Double post

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Don Cherry comes to mind, actually.

Was that an attempt at humour?

The article was about online discourse.

[oldschoolcalgary]

Geeeez... 57 pages?!

Don Cherry hasn't been this topical for the past 12 years...

[Robo]

Why are people so upset about this he should have been off the air years ago I just dont understand

[PsYcNeT]

Originally Posted by Robo

Why are people so upset about this he should have been off the air years ago I just dont understand

Because everyone assumes they are a good person, but society has now deemed Cherry as "bad", so now anyone who actually agrees with Cherry feels personally attacked as though society denounced them specifically. See: Trump and his bad opinions.

[sketchyt]

Originally Posted by jayswin

Okay, well fist of all, with all due respect to your mom it's actually perfectly okay for a society of citizens to defend a minority group (say, immigrants).

They're not telling individual immigrants what they should and shouldn't be offended by, that's absurd. They're speaking out against something that is offensive to many immigrants and non-immigrants. Very different things.

Secondly, you grouped "us vs them" into your list of issues that are permeating Canadian culture that you don't like....but that's exactly what Don Cherry was doing, and it's ultimately what got him fired.

I think you’re either misunderstanding me or twisting my words.

1. My mom did not say it’s not ok to defend a minority group. She found it amusing it’s happening. Mildly offended by it? Maybe. Enough to get a rise out of her? No. I was just trying to share an observation that I thought was interesting.

2. ‘Us vs them’. Again, please don’t misunderstand or twist the meaning of what I’m saying. What I’m saying, to be clearer, is that I don’t like the deliberate division of people and the increasing intensity of it.. Yeah, Cherry got fired for it. That is something I support. Your passive aggressive emoji was unnecessary.

3. One of the tools to divide people is to feel good about punishment. I support the punishment of Cherry but am saddened by it. I’m disturbed by the people who needed it to feel good. Alternatively, I’m also disturbed by the people who are so upset by it it evolves into anger. To be clear, I’m not seeing a whole lot of this behaviour from you or on this board.

I think it’s ok to have conflicting feelings and thoughts about this sort of thing. Which I do.