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Old 02-25-2019, 02:49 PM   #41
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So you reacted one way, then in time changed your opinion and, instead of posting in one of the topical threads, felt you should make a new thread telling people they shouldn't react how you initially reacted with the implication that that wouldn't be reasonable?

Is that pretty much where we're at here?
You're talking to TheScorpion with a pretty sanctimonious tone right now

I'm with him...I was disappointed until I saw what Stone signed for. I'm highly optimistic for the future of the Flames even if I was briefly upset at the lack of trades.
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Old 02-25-2019, 02:50 PM   #42
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Dunno, trying to find his tweet from 20 minutes earlier where he said we should have traded Valimaki.
I mean, I would have been fine with giving up Valimaki in the right deal. The Flames have the luxury that they have a number of very good defensive prospects. But it was never a necessity.

Two things changed that:

1) Valimaki alone (or with a smaller add than a 1st) would not have been enough
2) Stone re-signed for much more than expected

Anyway, the point of this thread is to say that this team is already good enough. I think they could have traded a guy like Valimaki in the right deal, but because they didn't, they have a great luxury on the back-end. And, they're good enough that adding someone wasn't a real necessity at the end of the day.
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Old 02-25-2019, 02:51 PM   #43
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Everybody's trying to be as good as the Flames.

There's something I haven't said in like 20 years.
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Old 02-25-2019, 02:53 PM   #44
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I guess there's only one thing left to do...WIN THE WHOLE F'N THING
Everything that happened today is just extra incentive to make them all look foolish.
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Old 02-25-2019, 02:54 PM   #45
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Did we really need a thread for you to tell us how to feel? Kind of seems like grandstanding, everyone else was posting their thoughts in the other thread.
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Looks like you'll need one long before I will. May I suggest deflection king?
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Old 02-25-2019, 02:54 PM   #46
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Nice tweet from Tre and all the sentiment about standing pat, but there still is the large bold headline on TSN's front page about a big deal (presumably re Stone) that fell through last night. So like the Scorpion, even management changes their tune quickly.

Would be nice to know the parameters and why it fell apart.
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Old 02-25-2019, 02:55 PM   #47
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Did we really need a thread for you to tell us how to feel? Kind of seems like grandstanding, everyone else was posting their thoughts in the other thread.
Again this was intended to go in the "Treliving should be feeling the heat" thread but it was locked when I went to post so I opted to separate it. If a mod feels it's inappropriate then they can move it but this type of thread is hardly unique
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Old 02-25-2019, 02:56 PM   #48
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Yeah I had my reply all typed out for that thread too, but then I said screw it and put my thoughts in the "Flames are done for the day" thread.
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Looks like you'll need one long before I will. May I suggest deflection king?
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Old 02-25-2019, 02:59 PM   #49
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Again this was intended to go in the "Treliving should be feeling the heat" thread but it was locked when I went to post so I opted to separate it. If a mod feels it's inappropriate then they can move it but this type of thread is hardly unique
Why was the thread locked?

Its perfectly reasonable to criticize the GM of the team if fans dont like some moves (or lack of).
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Old 02-25-2019, 03:00 PM   #50
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I love this team, but they don't have enough sand paper or grit for a lengthy playoff run. Likewise for the Leafs out East.

Playoff runs are created by 2 things:
1. Goaltending
2. 3rd - 4th line crash/bang/garbage goals

Washington tried to win the cup for years based on skill alone and could never do it; that only gets you a president cup. You nee to bring in the Tom Wilson's for a solid playoff run.

Anyone who thinks that you can win the cup with skill clearly hasn't watched much playoff hockey in their lifetime.

EDIT: I'm damn glad we didn't take Mark Stone. I would of like to have Wayne Simmonds tho (but at a reasonable cost), he has the grit and edge the Flames lack.
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Old 02-25-2019, 03:02 PM   #51
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I mean, I would have been fine with giving up Valimaki in the right deal. The Flames have the luxury that they have a number of very good defensive prospects. But it was never a necessity.

Two things changed that:

1) Valimaki alone (or with a smaller add than a 1st) would not have been enough
2) Stone re-signed for much more than expected

Anyway, the point of this thread is to say that this team is already good enough. I think they could have traded a guy like Valimaki in the right deal, but because they didn't, they have a great luxury on the back-end. And, they're good enough that adding someone wasn't a real necessity at the end of the day.

Not directed specifically at you Scorp, but honestly how are people coming to this conclusion?

He was offered 10.5 M by the Sens....how much less did you guys think he would settle for?

I know we saw 8-8.5 on here a bunch of times in the lead up, but that was never realistic looking at where the salary cap has gone and where teams are spending their money...its all top heavy.

Him signing in Calgary for 8.5 for example and he would have left 16 million dollars on the table...thats a whole lot of dough to walk away from. A lot. Even if he is making life altering money as is, thats 16M of real cash evaporated.

It was one of the reasons i was so set against going after Stone...his cost wasn't just assets it was going to be a huge and largest chunk of the salary cap for years moving forward when he wasn't even going to be the best or 2nd best player on this very team.
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Old 02-25-2019, 03:02 PM   #52
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if all the speculation/rumours are to be believed....

when the price for Stone was too high, he tried for Simmonds.
when Simmonds wouldn't waive NTC for CGY, he tried for Zucker.
when Frolik wouldn't waive his NTC to go to MIN, he decided he was done for the day.


IF, large IF 'cause I don't know how reliable any of those sources are, then that's a GM who tried to improve things, didn't see a deal he liked and the ones he did fell apart, and eventually stood pat.

Not the worst thing.
If that's true, then Simmonds is a fool.
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Old 02-25-2019, 03:02 PM   #53
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Why was the thread locked?

Its perfectly reasonable to criticize the GM of the team if fans dont like some moves (or lack of).
I didn’t agree with your sentiment in that thread, but will defend your right to express it. It was strange it was locked...
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Old 02-25-2019, 03:04 PM   #54
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If that's true, then Simmonds is a fool.
Have you been to Nashville? I'm going for the first time this spring. I'm told it's awesome.

Plus I suppose Simmonds may be thinking it's an audition for a contract, which wasn't happening here.
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Old 02-25-2019, 03:07 PM   #55
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https://youtu.be/qXACXrrwjTw

4:02- end, for anyone wondering why we didn’t trade Valimaki. Short handed on the first play as well


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Old 02-25-2019, 03:13 PM   #56
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This thread isn't about Valimaki or Stone, but I'll say that I would have been fine dealing Valimaki for a Stone signed at closer to $8. Bumping that up to $9.5 is a critical distinction and it completely changed my perspective on the trade. I personally thought the rumoured $$$ ask for Stone was inflated by the Ottawa situation and he would sign for less elsewhere. I was wrong.
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Old 02-25-2019, 03:15 PM   #57
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Not intended to be directed at you Scorps but I think a nice friendly reminder is that knee jerk reactions makes people look like idiots (goes for trades, GDTs, PGTs, etc).

Take a second to absorb it and analyze it rather than getting all keyboard warrior and venting to the internet like it's your therapist.
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Old 02-25-2019, 03:15 PM   #58
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Not directed specifically at you Scorp, but honestly how are people coming to this conclusion?

He was offered 10.5 M by the Sens....how much less did you guys think he would settle for?

I know we saw 8-8.5 on here a bunch of times in the lead up, but that was never realistic looking at where the salary cap has gone and where teams are spending their money...its all top heavy.

Him signing in Calgary for 8.5 for example and he would have left 16 million dollars on the table...thats a whole lot of dough to walk away from. A lot. Even if he is making life altering money as is, thats 16M of real cash evaporated.

It was one of the reasons i was so set against going after Stone...his cost wasn't just assets it was going to be a huge and largest chunk of the salary cap for years moving forward when he wasn't even going to be the best or 2nd best player on this very team.
9.5 over 8 in a state without income tax makes a big difference... so there's no reason to think Stone would have signed for less in Calgary.
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Old 02-25-2019, 03:16 PM   #59
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This thread isn't about Valimaki or Stone, but I'll say that I would have been fine dealing Valimaki for a Stone signed at closer to $8. Bumping that up to $9.5 is a critical distinction and it completely changed my perspective on the trade. I personally thought the rumoured $$$ ask for Stone was inflated by the Ottawa situation and he would sign for less elsewhere. I was wrong.


I mean it is about Valimaki tho given that’s why the deal fell through. I held the same belief that brad did that Valimaki was untouchable even with a stone extension. Imma go on a limb and say in 4 years time Valimaki will hold more value than Stone when taking into account his contract, position and age. I obviously like Valimaki more than most but I truly believe we have a beast in the making here.


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Old 02-25-2019, 03:17 PM   #60
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I don't care if we are "good" for the next 100 years. If we don't win a cup or don't go for a cup because another team is "too good" you are a loser franchise.

This TD was a failure and waste of a career year for Gio.
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