Thoughts on the New Forwards?

[Red]

Bottom 6 has 1 goal combined in 4 games. Small sample but hard to find a positive so far. Although Simon and Leivo had some top 6 looks too and have done little with it.
Hope for Leivo to get better. He is a decent player.

[timbit]

Originally Posted by Macho0978

I also find so far that ward hasnt been afraid to put vslimski and nesterov out against top players. They seemed to be on the ice against Tavares line alot the other night. They both are on the pk 2nd unit. Rasmus getting a ton of pp time but right now hanifin is getting very little pp or pk time. Valimaki and nesterov are being trusted in key situations every bit as much as hanifin.

Hanifin does lead the team in plus minus but seeing how Vancouver d is playing this year this could be a chris tanev thing

Flame very easily could trade hanifin and not miss him that much

IMO, Hanifin has more upside than any of the Flames young D.

[GioforPM]

I find myself wondering if Backlund is a guy who needs lots of minutes to be effective.

[SeanCharles]

Originally Posted by timbit

IMO, Hanifin has more upside than any of the Flames young D.

I think most would agree Andersson and Valimaki are at the top of the heap.

Hanifin is up there with them but I’d say he’s #3 currently.

[timbit]

Originally Posted by SeanCharles

I think most would agree Andersson and Valimaki are at the top of the heap.

Hanifin is up there with them but I’d say he’s #3 currently.

Hence, why I prefaced my evaluation with “IMO”.

[Enoch Root]

If we're talking potential, I would also say Hanifin. Skating, size, ability to make plays - he has all the tools. Which is why he was drafted 5th overall.

Not saying he gets there, but he has the tools to be as good as Hedman.

If we're talking 'most likely to reach their potential', then I'll take Andersson.

[SeanCharles]

Originally Posted by timbit

Hence, why I prefaced my evaluation with “IMO”.

Is it because of where he was drafted or do you see things in his play that lead you to think this? The tools he has?

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by SeanCharles

Is it because of where he was drafted or do you see things in his play that lead you to think this? The tools he has?

Skating, size, physicality, vision, shot...

The tools are there. I don't see how anyone could conclude otherwise. The only question is: will he 'put it all together' and blossom into the player that he is capable of being?

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Skating, size, physicality, vision, shot...

The tools are there. I don't see how anyone could conclude otherwise. The only question is: will he 'put it all together' and blossom into the player that he is capable of being?

I agree that Hanifin has the tools and maybe he's on the verge of a breakout season. It could just be a boost in his confidence. But he is slowly falling into jay bo territory. Hedman had a huge breakout at 23. Hanifin just turned 24. Doesnt mean he won't breakout but its a bit concerning that he has taken a pp spot or a pk spot. How good are you if you don't excel at either? Hopefully he plays his way into those roles but I can't justify taking Rasmus or gio off the pp right now.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Macho0978

I agree that Hanifin has the tools and maybe he's on the verge of a breakout season. It could just be a boost in his confidence. But he is slowly falling into jay bo territory. Hedman had a huge breakout at 23. Hanifin just turned 24. Doesnt mean he won't breakout but its a bit concerning that he has taken a pp spot or a pk spot. How good are you if you don't excel at either? Hopefully he plays his way into those roles but I can't justify taking Rasmus or gio off the pp right now.

I don't think anyone is predicting he turns into Hedman. But "heading into Jaybo territory" would mean that he is a dman who eventually plays over 1200 NHL games, with overall 400 NHL points, and consistently being amongst team leaders in TOI while drawing amongst the toughest assignments.

And was a key part of a cup.

So if that's Jaybo territory - boy I'll take that!

[Moneyhands23]

I want to see Gawdwin get in sone games. Phillips as well.

Oh and Ruzika

Those guys are kind of new right?

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

I don't think anyone is predicting he turns into Hedman. But "heading into Jaybo territory" would mean that he is a dman who eventually plays over 1200 NHL games, with overall 400 NHL points, and consistently being amongst team leaders in TOI while drawing amongst the toughest assignments.

And was a key part of a cup.

So if that's Jaybo territory - boy I'll take that!

Yes Jay bo is good. But he was nowhere near the franchise dman he was said to be when he first entered the league.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Macho0978

Yes Jay bo is good. But he was nowhere near the franchise dman he was said to be when he first entered the league.

Franchise dmen are indeed hard to find, but if Hanifin ends up playing over 1,000 games as a top pairing dman - that's REALLY damn good.
Perhaps expectations are a bit out of whack.

[Strange Brew]

Hanifin’s upside potential would be Jay Bouwmeester.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Macho0978

Yes Jay bo is good. But he was nowhere near the franchise dman he was said to be when he first entered the league.

He wasn't the GOAT, but he was a top pairing Dman for many years.

I think your post illustrates the problem, with respect to Hanifin: because he was drafted so high, and has been in the league since he was 18, he has to be as good as Hedman or he is a failure. Meanwhile, Valimaki is a hero because he dominated in the Finnish league.

If Hanifin has a JBo career, that would be great. However, Hanifin has some physicality to his game - more than Andersson or Valimaki - so I don't think JBo is a good comparison anyway.

[Erick Estrada]

Defensemen that can play over 18 minutes a game competently don't grow on trees people. Take a look at the Oilers and Canucks to see what happens when you take the position for granted.

[Calgary4LIfe]

Bouwmeester was basically a franchise D in Florida. I argue that when he came here and played under Sutter, it was in a system that wasn't conducive to many of his strengths. I came to detest Bouwmeester, and wanted him gone.


When Hartley took over, it was like getting a completely different Bouwmeester. If Hanifin turns into that, I will thank the hockey Gods by making many sacrifices. That Bouwmeester was a complete stud.


Hanifin right now is a legitimate 2nd pairing defencemen who is reliable and who is getting better. I didn't think Hanifin was very trustworthy in his own zone, but he has dramatically improved and has become a very reliable defencemen. I do want him to start taking a few more risks with the puck and start generating offence, but even if he completely stagnates and 'this is what he is', I am still happy with him. If he lands anywhere on the spectrum between Bouwmeester and Hedman, we should all be praying at the altar at the hockey God of Luck, or the Hockey God of development.

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

He wasn't the GOAT, but he was a top pairing Dman for many years.

I think your post illustrates the problem, with respect to Hanifin: because he was drafted so high, and has been in the league since he was 18, he has to be as good as Hedman or he is a failure. Meanwhile, Valimaki is a hero because he dominated in the Finnish league.

If Hanifin has a JBo career, that would be great. However, Hanifin has some physicality to his game - more than Andersson or Valimaki - so I don't think JBo is a good comparison anyway.

When people come on here and say hanifin could breakout still look at hedman im not assuming the poster is saying he will be hedman good. Its more how the career developed. Same goes for jay bo. Top pick came into league looked like a superstar and evolved into a solid defender for years but nowhere near a superstar. Hanifin came into league played big minutes for his age put up decent points and looked like a future 50 point dman who plays all situations. He slowly looking to have Jay bo type career path but not necessarily exactly Jay no caliber.

Hedman came in league seemed like he was going to be good but didn't show he was special for about 5 years then he exploded into an elite superstar. Some make this comparison to Hanifin. Doesnt mean they think he will be exactly as good as hedman just that he has untapped potential that could develop into much more soon.

Sure if Hanifin turns into Jay bo he will have a very good career. But he is looking to develop on the same path Jay bo did and its not as good as once expected path.

[Jiri Hrdina]

I think that's your expectation being misaligned. Hanifin was a guy that was highly touted largely because of his tremendous skating, but there were questions about his upside.

No one has played more games from his draft year than Jay Bouwmeester. So again, if Hanifin has Jay Bo's career - I struggle to see how that isn't as good as the expected path.

[Enoch Root]

And my comment wasn't directed at you, it was in reference to the 'Hanifin has played 400 NHL games, so he is what he is' crowd.