[GT] Day 11 (PM of Monday Feb 19 - AM of Tuesday Feb 20) - Page 15 - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

Jetfire · 02-20-2018, 06:21 AM

Holy crap S Korea giving the Finns a run for their money. This is amazing.

AustinL_NHL · 02-20-2018, 06:38 AM

Yea, it has to be an equipment issue with the Humphries sled.

They've had 2 really good runs and have had much better runs than everyone ahead of them yet they're trailing

AustinL_NHL · 02-20-2018, 06:44 AM

Officially in shock.

Germany 1 (currently in 1st after heat 2) just had a terrible run, yet finished with the fastest run in heat 2.

Does the runners choice have that HUGE of an effect?

MRCboicgy · 02-20-2018, 06:46 AM

Back to short track - I feel that's twice that the Canadians have been penalized for getting bumped by the Koreans - after Boutin got elevated to the Bronze...

craigwd · 02-20-2018, 06:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AustinL_NHL

I understand that a skid is worse than a bump but I must've missed the skidding. I saw her skid a tiny bit going into corner 9 but that's all I saw

She fishtailed quite a bit going into the curve.

Quote:

Originally Posted by AustinL_NHL

Officially in shock.

Germany 1 (currently in 1st after heat 2) just had a terrible run, yet finished with the fastest run in heat 2.

Does the runners choice have that HUGE of an effect?

Yes. Big impact.

psyang · 02-20-2018, 07:08 AM

Regarding the Homan team, I wonder if any curlers can pipe in. I have a friend who curls a lot, and he has been telling me about Miskew's release for some time now. Her elbow and wrist are bent at awkward angles on the release. When she has to give the rock an extra push for weight, it can change the rock's trajectory quite a bit. I've been watching the team's releases since, and Emma does seem to have weird arm/wrist angles.

As my friend says, the problem never gets corrected because they keep winning, but maybe it is getting exposed under the pressure of the Olympics.

I dug up some pictures of Miskew and Homan for comparison (spoilered for size).

Emma Miskew

Spoiler!

Rachel Homan

Spoiler!

MRCboicgy · 02-20-2018, 07:09 AM

https://twitter.com/user/status/965928284692168704

GirlySports · 02-20-2018, 07:50 AM

Too bad Korea went down 3-0.. they were in most of that game.

They also overplayed Dalton. He looked spent.

Slava · 02-20-2018, 08:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MRCboicgy

Back to short track - I feel that's twice that the Canadians have been penalized for getting bumped by the Koreans - after Boutin got elevated to the Bronze...

Yeah, that's just garbage. The SK skater falls and takes out the Canadian and somehow we get DQ'd?

craigwd · 02-20-2018, 08:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slava

Yeah, that's just garbage. The SK skater falls and takes out the Canadian and somehow we get DQ'd?

Unrelated to that fall.
Up to the skater to avoid stuff like that. Not impeding the other teams.

Table 5 · 02-20-2018, 08:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kobasew19

Hilarious story on how Elizabeth Swaney gamed the system in order to compete at the Olympics.

http://www.nbcolympics.com/news/how-...m_tags=oly1001

People keep saying Olympic events should have an every-man to benchmark against. Well here we go!

Slava · 02-20-2018, 08:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by craigwd

Unrelated to that.

Yeah and I read about that after, but frankly that doesn't really change things. It's a rule that hasn't been called during the Olympics, until now...and honestly that is just ridiculous. It's decisions like that that just taint the games as a whole.

Flamenspiel · 02-20-2018, 08:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slava

Yeah, that's just garbage. The SK skater falls and takes out the Canadian and somehow we get DQ'd?

SK?I gather you mean KOR, North Korea is PRK. It did look like they got bumped by the KOR skater, the one finished the relay leg. Call it the home team advantage.

https://www.britannica.com/topic/Mou...-Country-Codes

Cecil Terwilliger · 02-20-2018, 08:54 AM

Oh I'm sorry. I didn't realize this was the official IOC thread. And I've been calling them Russians the whole time instead of OARs.

FurnaceFace · 02-20-2018, 08:55 AM

I both love and hate short track. It's such a great event to watch for the speed and craziness of it but it's maddening with the violations and crashes. It doesn't always come across as an "even" competition. It must be tough to be a competitor and have this stuff happen.

I'm still waiting for a blatant skater takes out the entire field to hand a teammate the gold move.

Matt Reeeeead · 02-20-2018, 09:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kerplunk

Ya, weird ice exists everywhere, and it constantly changes as the match goes on. At their level they SHOULD be able to adjust.

Just watched the 5th end and then bounced back to a couple of the earlier ends, and on many of the draw shots the sweepers needed to be on it damn near out of the hand, and they still barely got it near where they wanted it. Homan then seems to be misreading the ice based on light shots. Maybe combination of nerves and not communicating ice conditions to each other?

There's no question that "ice reading" is a skill in itself, but lets be clear here, any elite curler will tell you that bad, unpredictable ice, is an equalizer. It brings a great deal of randomness, luck, and unpredictability in a match.

They are all timing rocks and cleaning paths, but if a spot changes dramatically from shot to shot, or gets soft at an unpredictable time, there isn't really a lot you can do to predict that.

The fact that three of there losses have been on the same sheet, in the same way illustrates that point. If you look at the percentages of shots made yesterday, China wasn't much better. They struggled with similar misses, they just the shots they did make were at the right time.

Anyways, not aiming to be an apologist here, as much as providing a narrative as to what is going on. This isn't a team that is choking or not rising to the occasion. Rachel is by far the most skilled female curler in the world who is struggling with a particular sheet of curling ice. I have some sympathy for that. I do think they haven't handled the situation particularly well mentally and seem more aiming to make excuses than try to fight and adapt as much as possible. Seems like they feel a lot of weight on their shoulders and hard when you dont feel like you are meeting expectations. The rock kicked off against Denmark showed how much pressure they are facing as that was a very uncharacteristic decision, but was glad to see she righted the ship when they faced China and faced a similar circumstance.

You should expect those ice conditions at the club level, but at this point, these types of factors are meant to be removed and make the game more about skill level than trying to predict the unpredictable. Its frustrating for me to here the comments of people (not here, on twitter and people you run in) who really have no clue and just see the results "wow what a terrible shot, how did she miss so bad" or "they are choking so hard". These girls dont miss shots as often or by as much as they are now, and that really is a reflection on ice conditions. Its really annoying on this stage when they are trying to get growth in the sport to put as many obstacles in front of them in performing their best.

Matt Reeeeead · 02-20-2018, 09:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by psyang

Regarding the Homan team, I wonder if any curlers can pipe in. I have a friend who curls a lot, and he has been telling me about Miskew's release for some time now. Her elbow and wrist are bent at awkward angles on the release. When she has to give the rock an extra push for weight, it can change the rock's trajectory quite a bit. I've been watching the team's releases since, and Emma does seem to have weird arm/wrist angles.

As my friend says, the problem never gets corrected because they keep winning, but maybe it is getting exposed under the pressure of the Olympics.

I dug up some pictures of Miskew and Homan for comparison (spoilered for size).

There would be some level of truth to that, but you could pick out a flaw in virtually any thrower. For example, Rachel releases the rock more revoluation than anyone, and more than what would be taught, but has turned that into being the best female takeout artist.

Ultimately, with curling, what the skip needs you to be able to do is make your motion in a very repeatable, and predictable way. Emma's technique I would agree is visually awkward, but she is consistently one of the highest percentage thirds in the world. I would suggest they have been playing together a very long time, and Emma does is consistently, and has a feel for repeating it in a very exact way. This would allow Rachel to adjust the broom for that, and adjust for differences in her own shots.

Ultimately, it doesnt consistently cause misses for either player and would suggest nothing "needs" to be changed, and isnt an explotable flaw.

Emma's misses this week have been primarily on a ton of very poor draws that arent even close. That wouldnt be caused by what we are seeing in the pictures. That would be the team likely managing ice conditions very poorly.

GirlySports · 02-20-2018, 09:18 AM

The Homan team has always been more of a hitting team then a drawing team right? (while Jones is the opposite).

Are other teams just making the Homan team draw more? I've always found the Homan team either really good or really bad. She doesn't win many Grand Slam events and sometimes misses the playoffs entirely.

At the trials, the first game loss to Carey was awful then she caught fire and won 10 in a row to get here.

getbak · 02-20-2018, 09:20 AM

I found the video for the Medals Ceremony on the CBC site: https://olympics.cbc.ca/video/todays...ony-feb-46061/

Three golds for Canada: The 2-Man Bob ceremony starts about 28 minutes in; Ice Dancing starts around 41 minutes; and the Women's Ski Halfpipe around 1:05.

Matt Reeeeead · 02-20-2018, 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GirlySports

The Homan team has always been more of a hitting team then a drawing team right? (while Jones is the opposite).

Are other teams just making the Homan team draw more? I've always found the Homan team either really good or really bad. She doesn't win many Grand Slam events and sometimes misses the playoffs entirely.

At the trials, the first game loss to Carey was awful then she caught fire and won 10 in a row to get here.

They would be a top percentage team on any shot. Their second, Joanne Courtney, is arguably the best female sweeper out there. Poses a pretty big advantage when you look at the rest of the field and helps put rocks in good positions.

Rachel would be especially good at the hit game, but has had to do that more from a defensive standpoint because they havent been able to get rocks in good positions. Normally the shots she is capable of are for more multiple point ends that can change the dynamics of the game... but they just havent been able to earn many opportunities.

The ice conditions make it very difficult for precise touch shots (but not so much on hits).