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Old 04-11-2016, 10:29 AM   #21
GoinAllTheWay
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Among the other innovations, he was the first one to try counter battery artillery to silence enemy guns.
Interesting technique. I have heard of a creeping barrage before but not this one. Using the flash from the gun and the resulting boom to determine location, usually figured out within 3 minutes. Pretty damn impressive for a time that had no computers at all. Used all the way up to the Vietnam war.
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Old 04-11-2016, 10:33 AM   #22
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Not to derail, but I've always hated that they called WW1 the great war. It was such a bloody waste, and all caused by the tensions created by the alliances at the time, colonialism and the assassination of a nobody.

"Home by Christmas" and "a good adventure for our boys" were common phrases used to drag young boys to a horrible war and face a terrible death.

One of the last wars where chemical warfare was used as part of a armies SOP.

Between living in rat infested water filled trenches for weeks at a time while your feet rotted off, to going over the wall into pre defined killing areas, to getting hit with horrifying choking and blistering agents, there was nothing great about this war.

There was an eventually to it.

I've always defined the period between WW1 and WW2 as the phony peace. There was only one World War and it started in 1914 and ended in 1945.
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Old 04-11-2016, 10:35 AM   #23
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Not to derail, but I've always hated that they called WW1 the great war. It was such a bloody waste, and all caused by the tensions created by the alliances at the time, colonialism and the assassination of a nobody.

"Home by Christmas" and "a good adventure for our boys" were common phrases used to drag young boys to a horrible war and face a terrible death.

One of the last wars where chemical warfare was used as part of a armies SOP.

Between living in rat infested water filled trenches for weeks at a time while your feet rotted off, to going over the wall into pre defined killing areas, to getting hit with horrifying choking and blistering agents, there was nothing great about this war.

There was an eventually to it.

I've always defined the period between WW1 and WW2 as the phony peace. There was only one World War and it started in 1914 and ended in 1945.
Death's Men is a great read on life in WW1.

####ing horrible, I can't even comprehend life during that conflict.
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Old 04-11-2016, 10:36 AM   #24
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The chemical warfare would be particularly horrifying
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Old 04-11-2016, 10:37 AM   #25
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Interesting technique. I have heard of a creeping barrage before but not this one. Using the flash from the gun and the resulting boom to determine location, usually figured out within 3 minutes. Pretty damn impressive for a time that had no computers at all. Used all the way up to the Vietnam war.
Artillary at that point was mostly fixed. It was difficult to tear it down, hook it to a truck or horse and drag it to the next location. so the idea of shoot and scoot didn't exist. So it was pretty academic in terms of the biggest threat to your troops being artillery, there fore it had to go.

For the most part with WW2, because of concepts like the Blitzkrieg and the advent of both lighter guns with heavier shells, and self propelled mortars and artillary, it became more difficult to fix and destroy artillary because for the most part you'd fire three or four barrages and then get moving to keep up with your army.

By the end of the second World War artillery had caught up to Infantry and armor in terms of its mobility, The Katushka was the ultimate in terms of WW2 artillery.
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Old 04-11-2016, 10:41 AM   #26
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Death's Men is a great read on life in WW1.

####ing horrible, I can't even comprehend life during that conflict.
Ordered. Thanks for the recomendation
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Old 04-11-2016, 10:50 AM   #27
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I've always defined the period between WW1 and WW2 as the phony peace. There was only one World War and it started in 1914 and ended in 1945.
I have always thought this way as well. In fact, in many European countries, they don't have the "WW1/WW2" names attached to the conflicts. That seems more like a North American thing.

Even the more recent Balkan Wars of the 1990s can be traced back to pre-WW1 political issues that were unresolved and the peace agreements/punishments put in place against the countries that lost in WW1.
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Old 04-11-2016, 10:52 AM   #28
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I have always thought this way as well. In fact, in many European countries, they don't have the "WW1/WW2" names attached to the conflicts. That seems more like a North American thing.

Even the more recent Balkan Wars of the 1990s can be traced back to pre-WW1 political issues that were unresolved and the peace agreements/punishments put in place against the countries that lost in WW1.
Its funny, because if you look at it, nearly every war in the 20th century was caused by French bungling.
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Old 04-11-2016, 10:54 AM   #29
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My father-in-law's Dad fought in both. He was an underager in WW1, got mustard gassed. He then re-upped in his 40's for WW2. I cannot imagine. He came home from both wars but died at the age of 55. Alcoholism did him in I think. He never really knew his Dad.
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Old 04-11-2016, 11:01 AM   #30
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http://www.canadiangreatwarproject.com/

If you want to learn more about the war and Canada's involvement.
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Old 04-11-2016, 11:25 AM   #31
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Just saw this thread. And I see that it's already been mentioned, but anyone who has the opportunity to visit the memorial should do so. It really is stunning.. It's an incredibly moving experience, that all Canadians should go through if they get the chance.
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Old 04-11-2016, 02:34 PM   #32
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Thanks for the thread. I have visited Vimy a couple times, it is awe inspiring.
Would like to go next year.
Pierre Berton's Vimy should be required reading for all.

I always highly recommend Tim Cook's books:

"At The Sharp End: Canadians Fighting The Great War 1914-1916"

and

"Shock Troops: Canadians Fighting the Great War 1917-1918"

Someone mentioned General Curries financial troubles so i would recommend Cook's "The Madman and The Butcher" for some great reading on that.

Lastly I recently found in a used store, "Ghosts Have Warm Hands" by Will Bird, a Canadian soldier of WW1. Just an incredible account of the daily life in and out of the trenches. He seemed to spend most of his war scrounging for food and souvenirs, and trying to find a dry place to sleep. Wanted this book for a long time, was thrilled to find it.

I lied, this is the last: I enjoyed Ernst Junger's "Storm Of Steel". I don't think you can get a better account of being on the wrong end of shelling. Memorable account of fighting on the German side. Though many are put off I imagine by the author, and his seeming love of battle; he nonetheless gives you a vivid depiction of the fighting.

As CC said, just a horrible experience for the average soldier. That's why I remember and respect those who went before.
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Old 04-12-2016, 04:21 AM   #33
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Not to derail, but I've always hated that they called WW1 the great war. It was such a bloody waste, and all caused by the tensions created by the alliances at the time, colonialism and the assassination of a nobody.

"Home by Christmas" and "a good adventure for our boys" were common phrases used to drag young boys to a horrible war and face a terrible death.

One of the last wars where chemical warfare was used as part of a armies SOP.

Between living in rat infested water filled trenches for weeks at a time while your feet rotted off, to going over the wall into pre defined killing areas, to getting hit with horrifying choking and blistering agents, there was nothing great about this war.

There was an eventually to it.

I've always defined the period between WW1 and WW2 as the phony peace. There was only one World War and it started in 1914 and ended in 1945.
I may be wrong but I think it was called the "great war" not because we won but because at the time it was the first global war, it had the largest death toll for a time period and in the end it also and paved the way for major political changes across the world.

The "Home by Christmas" and "a good adventure for our boys" was a normal type slogan from the U.S Civil War till the end WWII and probably longer, nothing shocking at all.

I do agree though that it didn't create peace but then again we still don't have global peace!
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Old 04-12-2016, 06:57 AM   #34
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I may be wrong but I think it was called the "great war" not because we won but because at the time it was the first global war, it had the largest death toll for a time period and in the end it also and paved the way for major political changes across the world.



The "Home by Christmas" and "a good adventure for our boys" was a normal type slogan from the U.S Civil War till the end WWII and probably longer, nothing shocking at all.



I do agree though that it didn't create peace but then again we still don't have global peace!


It was also called the war to end all wars, but we know how that turned out
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Old 04-12-2016, 11:54 AM   #35
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I may be wrong but I think it was called the "great war" not because we won but because at the time it was the first global war, it had the largest death toll for a time period and in the end it also and paved the way for major political changes across the world.
Nah there had been other large world enveloping wars, the Napoleonic Wars jump to mind.

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The "Home by Christmas" and "a good adventure for our boys" was a normal type slogan from the U.S Civil War till the end WWII and probably longer, nothing shocking at all.

I actually think that the "Home by Christmas" was/is associated with WW1. To be honest I have never seen it associated with the US Civil War, but I might be wrong.

I seem to think it may have been used at the start of the Korean conflict.
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Old 04-12-2016, 11:59 AM   #36
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Just a reminder that the Somme 100th is this June/July, so have a look out for that. A few of our soldiers (alas, not me) will get a nice trip to Belgium and France to go on numerous parades and other events.
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Old 04-12-2016, 11:59 AM   #37
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Pierre Berton's Vimy should be required reading for all.
+1 for Pierre Berton and Vimy. Anything worth knowing about regarding Canadian history was probably covered by Berton, and better than anyone else could have done. Vimy and Klondike were two of his best.
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Old 04-12-2016, 08:02 PM   #38
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Capturing a hill while the British snatched up more colonies and starved civilians. Then the Germans simply ignored it and nearly marched to Paris again a year later.
Ironically it did help Canada gain more autonomy, but we stupidly went to war again even though we had a say in the matter.

Some big centennials coming up. Jutland on June 1st. Largest naval battle of the era, nearly 10,000 dead. I feel bad for the Danish and Norwegian fishermen who went out to sea the day after. Many of the peaks near here are named after sunken ships in that battle. Beatty and Jelicoe even get mountains. They might be the least deserving of that honour except Petain, that mountain should definitely be renamed. (There is a Mt. Haig in the Crowsnest but it's named for a different Haig.)

Also The Somme on July 1st, a holiday of mixed feelings in Newfoundland where that date was known as Memorial Day before N.L. joined Confederation.


Edit:
It was called the Great War because of the size and scale of it and the amount of nations and combatants involved. I doubt anybody thought of it as the "Awesome War of Epicness" except maybe Churchill.

Franz Ferdinand wasn't a nobody, he was heir to the throne and the holder was the aged Franz Jozef who ended up dying in 1916.

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Old 04-12-2016, 08:08 PM   #39
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As WWII has been mentioned, it's very annoying but I've seen memorials in the States that give the war's years as 1941-45. Just because you were latecomers doesn't diminish the fact that there were two more years of war. Arrogant Yanks.
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Old 04-12-2016, 08:47 PM   #40
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On the topic of books, August 1914 by Solzhenitsyn is really good. Speaks to some of the blunders of the Russian ww1 army. Compared to Currie these poor souls were underequipped, spread out, and used old napoleon tactics. Pretty sad
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