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Old 09-12-2017, 01:34 PM   #21
TheOnlyBilko
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HAHAHAHAHA!!!!


And I got BASHED by so many people on this forum when I said the Smith trade was awful and Calgary should have grabbed MAF.

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Old 09-12-2017, 01:39 PM   #22
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HAHAHAHAHA!!!!


And I got BASHED by so many people on this forum when I said the Smith trade was awful and Calgary should have grabbed MAF.

What does this even mean/ have to do with anything? I'm so confused
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Old 09-12-2017, 01:46 PM   #23
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HAHAHAHAHA!!!!


And I got BASHED by so many people on this forum when I said the Smith trade was awful and Calgary should have grabbed MAF.

Well, I'm convinced now. Kudos.
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Old 09-12-2017, 01:48 PM   #24
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HAHAHAHAHA!!!!


And I got BASHED by so many people on this forum when I said the Smith trade was awful and Calgary should have grabbed MAF.


Goalie for goalie...maybe. but we are talking about a multitude of scenarios where the Flames would have been hurt by taking Fleury's full salary. Like AC said it likely would have cost the Hamonic trade. Or like I said, it would have cost Stone or Ferland or losing other players to make work. In reality, we have have Smith, Lack and Hamonic likely because of the retained salary from the Lack and Smith trades.
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Old 09-12-2017, 01:49 PM   #25
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"I think so" is important. I doubt that Fleury, being the guy he is, is going to diss a city without any reason. So when he's asked a hypothetical like that, what's he going to say "no - I'd never go to that dump"?
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Old 09-12-2017, 01:50 PM   #26
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HAHAHAHAHA!!!!


And I got BASHED by so many people on this forum when I said the Smith trade was awful and Calgary should have grabbed MAF.

So what has changed?
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Old 09-12-2017, 01:59 PM   #27
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Probably not popular opinion, but I'd still take Fleury and his 115 playoff games over Smith's 19.

The team was good enough to get in with junk goaltending last season.


Yup I'm with you on this
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Old 09-12-2017, 02:01 PM   #28
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So what has changed?
Because when the Smith trade was announced and even way before this (like during the 2016 draft) I had been saying Calgary should grab Fleury and multiple people told me Fleury would not come to Calgary
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Old 09-12-2017, 02:03 PM   #29
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Goalie for goalie...maybe. but we are talking about a multitude of scenarios where the Flames would have been hurt by taking Fleury's full salary. Like AC said it likely would have cost the Hamonic trade. Or like I said, it would have cost Stone or Ferland or losing other players to make work. In reality, we have have Smith, Lack and Hamonic likely because of the retained salary from the Lack and Smith trades.
We have no idea what could have been worked out though. We could have still had Hamonic. There's players to be moved things to be done. But really it don't matter anymore, it's on Mike Smith now to prove his worth and it's all on Brad Treliving to prove he made the right move. We will see. I hope he did
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Old 09-12-2017, 02:03 PM   #30
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Assuming it was at last year's trade deadline - could have made a big difference given how Elliott played in the playoffs.
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Old 09-12-2017, 02:05 PM   #31
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Even the playoff stats are funny. Fleury obviously has had a lot of playoff success on several iterations of stacked Penguins teams. Meanwhile Mike Smith made a big run with a PHX team in 2012, and also 3 games for Tampa earlier in his career.

Fleury's career playoff stats: .908, 2.65
Fleury 16/17 playoffs: .924, 2.56
Fleury 15/16 playoffs: .875, 3.04

Smith's career playoff stats: .945, 1.88
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Old 09-12-2017, 02:14 PM   #32
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I'm guessing a Fleury trade means we would have been out on Hamonic.

I think given the options of Fleury vs Hamonic + Smith, I'd take the current situation.

Fleury is coming off a 0.909 season on a Stanley Cup team, and Smith put up 0.914 on a team of garbage.
The Penguins gave Vegas a 2nd round pick to take Fleury and his contract instead of whoever else they exposed. Doubt it effects the Hamonic trade at all.
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Old 09-12-2017, 02:16 PM   #33
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The Penguins gave Vegas a 2nd round pick to take Fleury and his contract instead of whoever else they exposed. Doubt it effects the Hamonic trade at all.
Sure, but they had to move Fleury at all costs by that point otherwise they'd lose Murray.

I'm sure the cost to any other team was significant. We've heard the Penguins wanted #6 (Tkachuk) for Fleury the year prior.
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Old 09-12-2017, 02:28 PM   #34
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We have no idea what could have been worked out though. We could have still had Hamonic. There's players to be moved things to be done.
I suppose this is principally true, but I am highly sceptical that even an astute GM like Treliving could have managed trades for both Hamonic and Fleury without a considerable sacrifice from this year's starting lineup.

After the Harmonic deal the Flames currently have:

2018 3rd, 4th x 2, 5th, 7th x 2
2019 1st, 4th x 2, 5th, 7th x 2
2020 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th.

The Flames traded a conditional 2018 2nd/3rd pick, a good prospect and Chad Johnson's negotiating rights for Mike Smith + $1.05 m retained.

Would Pittsburgh have been willing to move Fleury in exchange for a package of any of these remaining draft picks? Even if so, how many draft picks would the Flames be willing to move for Fleury? Bear in mind that they are already missing one first and two seconds in the next two years.

But moreover with the expansion draft looming what would Pittsburgh have wanted in exchange for MA Fleury? They traded a prospect, an 2017 second and a 2018 fourth to Vegas just to ensure that they would select Fleury in the expansion draft.

In the end, I am really quite convinced that the cost to acquire Fleury would have been higher than for Smith, to say nothing for the salary retained by Arizona in the deal. I am inter3ested to know given your confidence how YOU would have made a deal for MA Fleury without jeopardising available assets and necessary cap-space to acquire Hamonic.
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Old 09-12-2017, 02:33 PM   #35
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The Penguins gave Vegas a 2nd round pick to take Fleury and his contract instead of whoever else they exposed. Doubt it effects the Hamonic trade at all.
Fleury came with a $5.75 m cap hit. Mike Smith is costing the Flames $3.1875 m for each of the next two years.
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Old 09-12-2017, 03:05 PM   #36
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Because when the Smith trade was announced and even way before this (like during the 2016 draft) I had been saying Calgary should grab Fleury and multiple people told me Fleury would not come to Calgary
Ah I see. Well I think we made out better this way anyhow. Fleury's numbers are garbage for a guy playing behind the most stacked team in the NHL for years. I am predicting his SV% this season will hover around .800
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Old 09-12-2017, 03:21 PM   #37
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Offer Pittsburgh the Smith package and in addition they still keep the picks and prospect they gave to LV. But they would be out a different player in the expansion draft.

In the end this comes down to Treliving wanting Smith the player, not about the best deal and I'm sure the familiarity with Smith helped him make the decision. I hope he is right.
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Old 09-13-2017, 01:49 AM   #38
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[QUOTE=PeteMoss;6370431]The Penguins gave Vegas a 2nd round pick to take Fleury and his contract instead of whoever else they exposed. Doubt it effects the Hamonic trade at all.[/QUOTEta I have no idea why it would have effected the Hamonic trade
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Old 09-13-2017, 02:04 AM   #39
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I have no idea why it would have effected the Hamonic trade
As mentioned, PIT previously asked for a 1st from Calgary for Fleury. So the assets spent to acquire Fleury would impact our ability to acquire Hamonic.

Also, Smith's caphit to Calgary gives us another $1.5M of cap space compared to Fleury's.
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Old 09-13-2017, 07:02 AM   #40
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His statements don't mean that much to be honest. It's a hypothetical question he's answering. Plus he is already with a new team. I wouldn't take too much solace in his answer. He has no reason to state otherwise at this juncture. There's nothing for him to gain by stating he wouldn't have waived his NTC.
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