Network PowerLine Adapters - Seperate Breakers

[Drak]

Is anyone familiar with running a network using PowerLine Adapters?

We have a stand alone garage that uses the same power as the house, but it has its own separate breaker panel. Our Internet with Shaw is currently set up in the main house.

I was going to call Shaw and inquire about a solution to have our Internet set up in the garage as well. Then a friend of mine told me about PowerLine Adapters that turn the electrical circuit into a network. I'm pretty out of date on technology but this sounded like a great idea.

The problem is, our garage has its own breaker panel and I'm reading that in this case, it might not work. Does anyone have any experience here? If I'm out of luck I need to go back to figuring something else out. I suppose I could just buy a product and try it, but perhaps some brands are better than others.

[Nufy]

If the breaker panel is sub fed from the house you should be ok.

[Raekwon]

Pulled from another forum with the same question.

"I use powerline network adapters to connect my detached garage that's about 50 or 60 feet from my house. The garage is on a sub-panel and the outlet that the source device is connected to is about 15 feet from the main panel.

They're made my Netgear - AV500 is the model.

I've not done any speed tests so far, since my goal was to get my Airport Express network access so I can stream music out in the garage / back yard. It's done very well in that regard so far.

I'll get some tests ran tonight and will post back.

EDIT: Ran a single speed test from the garage. Managed to get 23Mbps down / 19Mbps up. So yeah, not blazing fast, but fast enough for streaming music. "

[Azure]

I guess it depends what you are trying to do there, but if you need more speed & reliability it would probably be a better idea to setup a point to point wireless antenna.

Something like the Ubiquiti Nanostation.

We have them all over the place with our buildings and they work great.

[Drak]

Thanks for the responses everyone. Speed isn't a huge factor, although it would be nice. Just wanted to be able to update the OS, software etc. when it needs it and download purchases.

I think I'll look into the Netgear brand and try it out. If it's a problem it's still helpful in the main house for some of our systems.

[Raekwon]

Originally Posted by Azure

I guess it depends what you are trying to do there, but if you need more speed & reliability it would probably be a better idea to setup a point to point wireless antenna.

Something like the Ubiquiti Nanostation.

We have them all over the place with our buildings and they work great.

I never put reliability and wireless in the same sentence. When I needed a connection in our old house I always used powerline when needed.

[DoubleF]

Depends what you're trying to do. Imagine you have a lawn that needs watering and you can't reach the far side. You can buy a hose to extend (ie: Power line) or you can consider other options akin to a sprinkler set up like point to point wireless and mesh wireless systems which may be more effective and more future proof for your needs long term.

A power line adapter is like a super long ethernet cable via walkie talkie. It will generally work fine, but I wouldn't consider it for a robust backbone component of a network if at all possible.

Hopefully the following isn't overly simplified.

A 1Gbps power line adapter I think runs around $60-80 a pair and the thing that annoys me the most is that most are badly designed and will unnecessarily block power outlets. They also don't really work if plugged into a power bar etc. They're pretty straight forward to use though and are essentially plug and play. I don't know if the designs have improved, but like cheap routers, after a few months, they always seemed to overheat and drop signal until unplugged and rebooted. There are also wifi repeater type power line modules, but existing networks don't always like them making them excessively annoying to set up at times.

If the current wifi signal is strong enough, a point to point wireless antenna is around $40-60 but is quite a bit more complex than plugging in a power line adapter. Furthermore, if the signal isn't strong enough, you have to do more to your network anyways to get it to work which is a hassle money and time wise. I wouldn't suggest this method unless you have a way to do this method relatively pain free (ie: A friend who knows how to hook it up with ease).

A mesh network set up is around $200-300 and generally comes with around 3 nodes. After the power line, it's probably the easiest for plug and play. It's the same difficulty as setting up a router, but the newer router interfaces in the last year or two are just so much easier to use and set up than before. You'd in theory plug a node on the side of your home closest to the garage and another inside the garage if the signal strength isn't strong enough. You then have an extra node for somewhere in your home. Once set up, the units sync to each other and are essentially repeaters of your internet/wifi set up. This should bring a reasonable wifi to your garage and also has the benefits of improving wifi signal to the rest of your home close to the nodes. Additional nodes I believe are around $60-80, but most individuals seem to note that 3 nodes is adequate/overkill for a 3K sq ft home or less.

[DoubleF]

Originally Posted by Drak

Thanks for the responses everyone. Speed isn't a huge factor, although it would be nice. Just wanted to be able to update the OS, software etc. when it needs it and download purchases.

I think I'll look into the Netgear brand and try it out. If it's a problem it's still helpful in the main house for some of our systems.

Did you mean update OS and software of a computer or something in your garage? Because most power line adapters are not really going to have meaningful firmware updates nor a meaningful interface. A power line adapter effectively is an ethernet cable, so if you have an ipad or phone or something like that which isn't directly connected via ethernet, it won't really be beneficial in the garage.

A mesh system on the other hand will have more meaningful updates for stability, speed and perhaps even features updates in the future. I'm also quite impressed for their performances for wireless set ups. There are significantly less issues that require constant reboot/power cycling than in previous wireless hardware iterations. They're fantastic if you want something that just works and you can essentially set and forget. It's also great for anything wireless in the garage like a phone, laptop, tablet etc. and in the future if a car uses wireless for updates, it works for that too.

[Drak]

Originally Posted by DoubleF

Did you mean update OS and software of a computer or something in your garage? Because most power line adapters are not really going to have meaningful firmware updates nor a meaningful interface. A power line adapter effectively is an ethernet cable, so if you have an ipad or phone or something like that which isn't directly connected via ethernet, it won't really be beneficial in the garage.

A mesh system on the other hand will have more meaningful updates for stability, speed and perhaps even features updates in the future. I'm also quite impressed for their performances for wireless set ups. There are significantly less issues that require constant reboot/power cycling than in previous wireless hardware iterations. They're fantastic if you want something that just works and you can essentially set and forget. It's also great for anything wireless in the garage like a phone, laptop, tablet etc. and in the future if a car uses wireless for updates, it works for that too.

Yep, it's a desktop computer. Basically a DAW workstation.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Raekwon

I never put reliability and wireless in the same sentence. When I needed a connection in our old house I always used powerline when needed.

I don't think reliability is much of an issue more with some of the newer generation wireless point to point radios.

We use them quite heavily, and they work great. Zero downtime.

Ubiquiti is not really consumer grade wireless gear.

[Nage Waza]

Option 2:

You could run a line of conduit along the fence and run some outdoor grade ethernet. Make sure to give it some slack as the fence sways. You can go without conduit as well, just depends on what you have going on in the yard.

[Raekwon]

Originally Posted by Nage Waza

Option 2:

You could run a line of conduit along the fence and run some outdoor grade ethernet. Make sure to give it some slack as the fence sways. You can go without conduit as well, just depends on what you have going on in the yard.

Conduit? Just do what one of the managers here did and run it through a garden hose . . .

[Drak]

The conduit idea was what I was thinking of originally. I could try to pass a network cable alongside the existing underground cable conduit which seems to have a short run. The garage electrical is connected to the house this way.

Another option is through the basement sill plate and up and over the deck(we have a breezeway style deck that connects the house to the garage/studio) but that method is rather messy. But then I started thinking about amped up Wifi and moved to the Network Powerline adapters when a friend mentioned it.

[Raekwon]

Buy them at Costco test it out and if it doesn't work as well as you hoped return it.

[DoubleF]

Originally Posted by Drak

The conduit idea was what I was thinking of originally. I could try to pass a network cable alongside the existing underground cable conduit which seems to have a short run. The garage electrical is connected to the house this way.

Another option is through the basement sill plate and up and over the deck(we have a breezeway style deck that connects the house to the garage/studio) but that method is rather messy. But then I started thinking about amped up Wifi and moved to the Network Powerline adapters when a friend mentioned it.

My only issue with the powerline adapter is that it's a product for a specialized purpose that likely becomes obsolete and money out the window very fast. It's like paying a lot of money for an ethernet extension cord which likely will not be necessary/useless within a few years with the way wifi network gear is improving and decreasing in price.

For $310, you can get this set with 3 units which has power line built in. It can improve the performance if you pull an ethernet cable to each node, but it's not necessary.

https://www.amazon.ca/TP-Link-Deco-P.../dp/B081ZWJ6FX

The version without power line is $175 (still 3 units) and at worst you need to spend an extra $20 to give your desktop wifi.

https://www.amazon.ca/TP-Link-Deco-W...C3D9XAD4SCZVK8


NOTE: I don't think the powerline back haul aspect of the mesh system is actually necessary to extend signals. It just makes the system even more powerful/robust than without the powerline built in.

Not saying that power line is a bad idea, but if you ever change things to negate the need of the power line to the garage, there's a high likelihood it will collect dust (money out the door). For slightly bit more, ($200-300) you will have a system that will have overflow benefits to the stability and signal strength to the remainder of your home and future networking upgrades your system may need in the future may likely already be done just by having this system. Heck, even if you are thinking you just want a patch solution because you might move or something, you just bring the mesh system with you and still reap the benefits vs powerline adapter may become pointless at another location.


Actually, now that I have stumbled upon this, the Deco P9 looks like the perfect lazy option my parents' place. The built in powerline backhaul is perfect as a lazy option to address the lack of ethernet backhaul option at their place. I just don't have the time to sort things out, so that tiny bit of premium to do it lazy style is something I will consider.

[Drak]

Originally Posted by DoubleF

My only issue with the powerline adapter is that it's a product for a specialized purpose that likely becomes obsolete and money out the window very fast. It's like paying a lot of money for an ethernet extension cord which likely will not be necessary/useless within a few years with the way wifi network gear is improving and decreasing in price.

For $310, you can get this set with 3 units which has power line built in. It can improve the performance if you pull an ethernet cable to each node, but it's not necessary.

https://www.amazon.ca/TP-Link-Deco-P.../dp/B081ZWJ6FX

The version without power line is $175 (still 3 units) and at worst you need to spend an extra $20 to give your desktop wifi.

https://www.amazon.ca/TP-Link-Deco-W...C3D9XAD4SCZVK8


NOTE: I don't think the powerline back haul aspect of the mesh system is actually necessary to extend signals. It just makes the system even more powerful/robust than without the powerline built in.

Not saying that power line is a bad idea, but if you ever change things to negate the need of the power line to the garage, there's a high likelihood it will collect dust (money out the door). For slightly bit more, ($200-300) you will have a system that will have overflow benefits to the stability and signal strength to the remainder of your home and future networking upgrades your system may need in the future may likely already be done just by having this system. Heck, even if you are thinking you just want a patch solution because you might move or something, you just bring the mesh system with you and still reap the benefits vs powerline adapter may become pointless at another location.


Actually, now that I have stumbled upon this, the Deco P9 looks like the perfect lazy option my parents' place. The built in powerline backhaul is perfect as a lazy option to address the lack of ethernet backhaul option at their place. I just don't have the time to sort things out, so that tiny bit of premium to do it lazy style is something I will consider.

That looks pretty cool actually. Hmmm, I think I might have to consider this as an option. Thanks for this info!

[Jawbone Hill]

Originally Posted by DoubleF

My only issue with the powerline adapter is that it's a product for a specialized purpose that likely becomes obsolete and money out the window very fast. It's like paying a lot of money for an ethernet extension cord which likely will not be necessary/useless within a few years with the way wifi network gear is improving and decreasing in price.

For $310, you can get this set with 3 units which has power line built in. It can improve the performance if you pull an ethernet cable to each node, but it's not necessary.

https://www.amazon.ca/TP-Link-Deco-P.../dp/B081ZWJ6FX

The version without power line is $175 (still 3 units) and at worst you need to spend an extra $20 to give your desktop wifi.

https://www.amazon.ca/TP-Link-Deco-W...C3D9XAD4SCZVK8


NOTE: I don't think the powerline back haul aspect of the mesh system is actually necessary to extend signals. It just makes the system even more powerful/robust than without the powerline built in.

Not saying that power line is a bad idea, but if you ever change things to negate the need of the power line to the garage, there's a high likelihood it will collect dust (money out the door). For slightly bit more, ($200-300) you will have a system that will have overflow benefits to the stability and signal strength to the remainder of your home and future networking upgrades your system may need in the future may likely already be done just by having this system. Heck, even if you are thinking you just want a patch solution because you might move or something, you just bring the mesh system with you and still reap the benefits vs powerline adapter may become pointless at another location.


Actually, now that I have stumbled upon this, the Deco P9 looks like the perfect lazy option my parents' place. The built in powerline backhaul is perfect as a lazy option to address the lack of ethernet backhaul option at their place. I just don't have the time to sort things out, so that tiny bit of premium to do it lazy style is something I will consider.

Thought I'd bump this both to thank you for the information (didn't know there was a Powerline version) and to let you know this kit is Amazon's Deal of the Day, selling for $229.

[EldrickOnIce]

We bought the Deco E4 (non powerline) a few weeks ago, as old router simply had too many devices connected and we kept having problems. Very pleased with speed and connectivity so far. Value for the dollar is excellent

[Raekwon]

I use the Telus extenders but my first leg from the basement is wired so its gets pretty good signal overall but if I didn't have the option to wire the first leg this Deco option seems like a really good option.

[DoubleF]

Originally Posted by Jawbone Hill

Thought I'd bump this both to thank you for the information (didn't know there was a Powerline version) and to let you know this kit is Amazon's Deal of the Day, selling for $229.

Sweet! Trigger pulled!