This is why I'm waiting for more traditional car makers to release EV vehicles before jumping on that bandwagon
I'm still thinking plug-in hybrids are the way to go if you want the best of all worlds. I just see those guys with their Teslas plugged in at Lake Louise and that looks like hell. I'd have way too much range anxiety and I'm too impatient to stop mid-road trip to charge up my batteries. Or get to the mountains, wait my turn to charge, then run back to the car to move it so somebody else can charge. Ugh. With a hybrid, you bring your own little electricity generator with you everywhere you go.
I am softening on PHEVs. Just sounds like twice the things that can go wrong and more expensive repairs and maintenance. Maybe somebody who is driving a PHEV can provide some insight into relative cost vs purely gas or purely electric.
Yup. I'd actually look at a plug-in hybrid. The repairs/maintenance would be worth it IMO.
Without *massive* advances, full electric and quick road trips basically become a thing of the past. At the very least getting from Calgary to Vancouver or Seattle in a single day sure dues. A layover in Coeur d'Alene just to charge sounds super fun. Lineups at the Petro west of Calgary already take 30 minutes on the weekends, and that's with a 5 minute fill-up...
The Mazda rotary range extender sounds intriguing, given it's small size, smooth running, and efficiency.
What kinda blows my mind is that gas is one of the most energy dense fuels around that is plentiful, and yet the best we can come up with to extract that energy is blowing it up. I've read about a few fuel cells, but not a lot of progress on them. Maybe one day someone will find a better way to extract that energy that would be much more efficient.
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I am softening on PHEVs. Just sounds like twice the things that can go wrong and more expensive repairs and maintenance. Maybe somebody who is driving a PHEV can provide some insight into relative cost vs purely gas or purely electric.
The RAV4 PHEV will no doubt be reliable but it's nearly impossible to buy one. It has some weird issues in cold weather, below a certain temp there is no cabin heat at all don't know if Toyota has solved this.
Either way PHEV is a compromise you get low electric range, vehicle is heavy and like you say complicated. I don't see a future for this type of car.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuzz
What kinda blows my mind is that gas is one of the most energy dense fuels around that is plentiful, and yet the best we can come up with to extract that energy is blowing it up.
What other way is there besides rapid oxidation? The problem is energy lost to heat.
The RAV4 PHEV will no doubt be reliable but it's nearly impossible to buy one. It has some weird issues in cold weather, below a certain temp there is no cabin heat at all don't know if Toyota has solved this.
Either way PHEV is a compromise you get low electric range, vehicle is heavy and like you say complicated. I don't see a future for this type of car.
What other way is there besides rapid oxidation? The problem is energy lost to heat.
Yeah, the mystical RAV4 and the Subaru Crosstrek PHEVs were what we were thinking for a next vehicle, but I am having some doubts, and it sounds like the Sube also has some weird idiosyncrasies involving switching between EV and gas.
I have been looking into PHEVs as well as I'm living in a condo without charging infrastructure but I can charge for free at work.
The problem is they are all expensive and rather pedestrian for the most part. And it is totally the complication of two types of automotion with added weight and failure.
The cabin heat thing is probably because heat is taken from the cooling of the electric components and they don't have heat pumps which Tesla just introduced this year.
I was thinking about this, and the bigger the vehicle, the less useful it is for long distances.
"Plug into a 150-kW DC fast charger and the battery can fill from 15 to 80 percent charge in just 41 minutes, gaining as much as 54 miles in 10 minutes. With the extended-range battery and dual-charger plugged into an 80-amp Ford Charge Station Pro charger, the system can take the battery from 15 to 100 percent charge in 8 hours, or roughly 30 miles per hour of charging."
With a max range of 300 miles, and towing losses in the 30-50% range, with 40 minutes to get 65% more charge, how far can you really go on camping trip?
It kinda feels like, given the limited supply of batteries, this would be better used on small vehicles, and use hydrogen on large ones. Has anyone tried for a hydrogen pickup? The storage tank issue would be less of a problem than in a car.
I was thinking about this, and the bigger the vehicle, the less useful it is for long distances.
"Plug into a 150-kW DC fast charger and the battery can fill from 15 to 80 percent charge in just 41 minutes, gaining as much as 54 miles in 10 minutes. With the extended-range battery and dual-charger plugged into an 80-amp Ford Charge Station Pro charger, the system can take the battery from 15 to 100 percent charge in 8 hours, or roughly 30 miles per hour of charging."
With a max range of 300 miles, and towing losses in the 30-50% range, with 40 minutes to get 65% more charge, how far can you really go on camping trip?
It kinda feels like, given the limited supply of batteries, this would be better used on small vehicles, and use hydrogen on large ones. Has anyone tried for a hydrogen pickup? The storage tank issue would be less of a problem than in a car.
They are already working on charging systems for large trucks that can charge at 800 kW, or even more than a megawatt.
I am softening on PHEVs. Just sounds like twice the things that can go wrong and more expensive repairs and maintenance. Maybe somebody who is driving a PHEV can provide some insight into relative cost vs purely gas or purely electric.
I have a Chrysler Pacifica Hybrid. For the first 3 months we didn't use a single tank of gas, and I calculated per km the cost per mile was anywhere between 1/4 and 1/6th the cost to use electricity. So far, we have only had to do 2 oil changes after 2 years because most miles are electric but once every 12 months is mandatory for warranty. Overall it's more expensive to purchase because you're paying for the electric motor and the gas motor, but cost of ownership is still cheaper than gas alone.
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Just heading home from Edmonton where we picked up a RAV4 Hybrid. Wanted a Prime but gave up on that idea. This is a 3-4 year vehicle for us while the market and infrastructure get sorted out. Some concern about increased complexity but there’s a 5 yr/100k warranty on drivetrain which covers my timeline.
Just heading home from Edmonton where we picked up a RAV4 Hybrid. Wanted a Prime but gave up on that idea. This is a 3-4 year vehicle for us while the market and infrastructure get sorted out. Some concern about increased complexity but there’s a 5 yr/100k warranty on drivetrain which covers my timeline.
There's no need for infrastructure for the plug-in hybrid. You wake up every morning and your battery is full, and you use the gas for trips longer than 60km only. Works great and you really get used to the quietness and smooth driving when on electric driving. My next vehicle will absolutely be fully electric.
Once we got the van it really hit home just how little the charging infrastructure matters for anyone with a driveway/garage/parking. You get up and your "tank" is full so you're literally never looking for a place to charge ever because you don't need one. It's only a concern on long trips (over 300km away), but stopping for 45 minutes every 3-4 hours or so is not really a big deal (and over the next 3-4 years this will change drastically). For those worried about the longer trips, I can see in Alberta that the plug in hybrid makes sense as there's really nothing there for charging infrastructure yet.
Being an F-150 owner and a person who was planning to get the Hybrid. The Lightning excites me beyond belief. I'm going to wait about 4 years to look at a new vehicle and if the reviews are positive and the bugs are somewhat worked out then that vehicle is at the top of my list.
Last edited by csnarpy; 05-22-2021 at 10:50 PM.
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Probably won't be seeing many of these make it to Lake Louise in the winter. With a 300 mile range(482km), Lake Louise is about 180km, so 360km round trip. Winter driving cuts about 20% range, so that's 385km. Doesn't leave much left. Unless LL installs loads of chargers, even the long range version is going to come up short.
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