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Old 05-06-2021, 03:48 PM   #121
ComixZone
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Originally Posted by Manhattanboy View Post
Hope they trade Kylington so we don’t have to hear about him anymore.

It’s obvious they view him much differently than many posters.
I think the frustrations on that side come from the fact that Kylington, even with his warts (which - let's be honest, they're the warts most young defencemen have), has a skillset that this team lacks and an ability to play at a pace that most of our other defencemen seem to greatly struggle with.

We are slow at skating with the puck, and we are slow at moving the puck. The number of odd man rushes that this team generats, at least from an eye test (not sure if it's tracked anywhere?), is pathetic. That's all due to a slow break out and inability to play with pace.
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Old 05-06-2021, 03:52 PM   #122
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His brand of hockey works well in the playoffs because the whistles get put away and they are already well versed at the grind required to win a cup but it makes for an trying 82 game regular season. It's why his cup winning Kings teams were only 8th seeds. I just don't know if the Flames have the horses to grind things out for a full season like those Kings teams did and even at that the Kings eventually broke.
That's not really a fair assessment. Sutter coached 5 seasons as the only coach in LA and they had: 101*, 100, 95, 102, and 86 points. You're probably right that the Flames do not resemble those Kings lineups, but there isn't much evidence in my opinion that Sutter can only coach those types of teams.

*48 game season in 2012-13 101 is pro-rated.

In his most successful regular season with the Flames 2005-06 (also, surprisingly, the best winning percentage he ever had as a coach since his rookie coaching season with the Blackhawks), the top forwards were: Iginla, Langkow, Huselius, Amonte, Kobasew, and Reinprecht. That's a pretty different group from: Kopitar, Carter, Williams, Richards, King, and Toffoli (or Brown).

This is all to say that I am still very happy that they hired Sutter and I think he'll right the ship. He doesn't seem to be any under illusion that this roster is good enough and I expect significant changes in personnel to go with a more consistent and effective playstyle.
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Old 05-06-2021, 04:11 PM   #123
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One thing about Darryl Sutter-coached teams is that they go DIRECTLY to the puck. They don't dawdle around waiting for the puck to come to them (how many of our D do that how many times a game?), they don't stop and wait for the forwards to be standing stock-still at the blue line (woah...can't keep up...wait for ME!) and they hit, hit, hit. Even the little guys. (One of the things I like about Mangi.) And they are well-drilled....they execute quickly.

This team is not able to execute quickly every game. They CAN, they just DON'T. We've seen games that are fast-paced, excellent passing, on the money hits and great chances, shots and goals. Then the next game they act like they just won the Cup and forget it all.

So attitude is what needs to change most it seems. Likely requires some new personnel to galvanize those who want to play that way into action. The other thing is their conditioning appears to be atrocious. Not sure why that is compared to other teams, but these guys are gassed WAY too often.

Oh, and they need to get participation medals for this year to make them feel good.
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Old 05-06-2021, 04:12 PM   #124
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^ is that copy-pasted from a month ago?
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Old 05-06-2021, 05:56 PM   #125
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Originally Posted by taxbuster View Post
One thing about Darryl Sutter-coached teams is that they go DIRECTLY to the puck. They don't dawdle around waiting for the puck to come to them (how many of our D do that how many times a game?), they don't stop and wait for the forwards to be standing stock-still at the blue line (woah...can't keep up...wait for ME!) and they hit, hit, hit. Even the little guys. (One of the things I like about Mangi.) And they are well-drilled....they execute quickly.

This team is not able to execute quickly every game. They CAN, they just DON'T. We've seen games that are fast-paced, excellent passing, on the money hits and great chances, shots and goals. Then the next game they act like they just won the Cup and forget it all.

So attitude is what needs to change most it seems. Likely requires some new personnel to galvanize those who want to play that way into action. The other thing is their conditioning appears to be atrocious. Not sure why that is compared to other teams, but these guys are gassed WAY too often.

Oh, and they need to get participation medals for this year to make them feel good.

I think there is a core of players that have dictated the outcomes of games rather than play as a team, or for one coach, or another. It appears, in order to change that culture, the Flames need to identify and move some or all of those players.

My concern is next season if several of the same group is here we will see a repeat rather than a bounce back. Too many players currently have too much influence and just choose to take nights off.

Conditioning could be a contributor.
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Old 05-06-2021, 06:17 PM   #126
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^ is that copy-pasted from a month ago?
Nope.
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Old 05-06-2021, 11:57 PM   #127
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I still see people saying that this isn't a Sutter team. Why?


Gaudeau isn't big enough? Seems to be excelling down the stretch. Same as Lindholm. Same as Mangiapane.


Tkachuk and Monahan are struggling. They have struggled all season, and one of them at least is playing through some injury (rumoured anyway).


Dube hasn't looked better, hasn't looked worse either. Ryan is getting old and wasn't productive under Ward either.


I don't think that many players are looking worse under Darryl. On the contrary, they are looking better. Horrible puck luck and shooting percentages for most of the team, but some of the team is responding.


There just needs to be change. I thought that under Ward, Gaudreau was an obvious "must trade" piece. Now? I think you try and keep him if you can extend him reasonably.



Monahan remains in the 'should probably look at trading' - really depends on the offer, though. If it is two 2nds, I would hope he is retained.


That's going to be part of the issue - what are the offers going to be?



Will GM (whomever it may be), be able to find better depth players and get this team faster and more skilled, and hopefully a bit bigger? Seems like a gigantic task at this point than 'working around the edges' of a 2nd overall team.


Sutter is the right coach for this team right up until there is a rebuild needed. I am 100% with a rebuild personally, but I don't pay the bills for the Flames. If they want to try a big retool, by all means. I can definitely be successful IMO, but it will be difficult too, and you aren't selling as much 'hope', and perhaps a more impatient season ticket holder base if things don't work out.


Tough times ahead for the Flames.



Ideally, they would have went from the Hartley Era right into the Sutter Era (though Sutter was employed of course, but you know what I mean). From really tough Hartley with a really good culture and work ethic, and a really good 'teaching coach', to an almost mild-mannered Darryl Sutter who could have taken the team to the next step.


Instead, this team kept taking a step down somehow, even when more talent was acquired, because I think the culture got ruined. I think Sutter can salvage it. I bet this team AS IS makes the playoffs next year, even in the same division, but I also bet that it isn't a contender too, so what's the point in that?


Major changes will happen. Who and to what extent, I have no idea and probably nobody else at this point really does either. All I know is that I am relieved that this team has a capable coach to figure out their way through this mess at least - one thing that you can cross-off the list of what may not be working.
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Old 05-11-2021, 06:24 AM   #128
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Post game links
http://sportsstats.cbc.ca/hockey/nhl...cap134419.html
https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/games/2300528
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