Don't agree on the dialogue, thought it was some of the best of all the Star Wars, the much improved acting quality helped with that too.
Agree on it being a little rushed though. Feel like they could have added 5-10 minutes of run time just to give things a bit more pause and let things set up a little better.
Agree on Luke as well, but think a lot of it was that they let it linger too long which ruined the effect. They should have ended it right when he turned around and had the pained look on his face, or even just end it with her seeing a cloaked figure on the mountain top.
No need for the 360 degree pan of the exchange at the end of the movie.
I would agree with the Luke scene. If it had been 20 seconds shorter, it would have been perfect. Throw the hood up and credits.
I actually think it was a little too long. I would have been fine with them not finding Luke at all, just the path two him. The few minutes of epilogue where Rey finds Luke is what felt really rushed. That whole thing could have been an adventure all on it's own.
Unfortunately, by typing a character's name in Google the other day, it autocompleted with:
"...dies...killed..." etc. Not definitive, but I had a bad feeling about it. Not sure if there was any surprise left in that scene. When he goes out, defenceless on the bridge, it seems inevitable.
So based on what we know now, Kylo Ren took down Luke's Jedi training facility. What if Luke had a daughter, and Kylo 'saved' only her (while killing all the other young Jedi), and left her on Jakku. Certainly the movie hinted a bit at a connection between Kylo Ren and Rey. And of course that final lingering scene between Luke and Rey, I thought their father-daughter connection would be revealed. So, if it is all just red herrings, well, had me fooled.
Also, noticed in the credits that Ben Schwartz and Bill Hader were 'voice consultants' or something for BB-8. Reminded me of this Conan clip:
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Probably because you knew it would happen just from being a fan. The only way Luke's reveal would have held any surprise is if he was the bad guy somehow.
In the forest scene, when Kylo tried to pull the lightsaber from the snow and it instead flew past him, I thought (well the fanboy in me) it was going to land in the hand of Luke, who would show up to save the day and confront his traitor padawan. That would've IMO made for a badass appearance. But then I remembered he would've been in recluse for a reason and leaving maps only to show up in the middle of a battle wouldn't make sense. But that would've made for a great reveal.
The actual one was way more open ended and makes for a lot of intrigue. But if I had written the scene I would've had Rey searching for a couple days, and eventually becoming exhausted and nearly giving up, before Luke having stalked her the entire time decides to show up just as nightfall comes about, clearly having lost some of his humanity, and acting very hostile at first (maybe even force-pulls her to him and starts to choke her) until she shows him the lightsaber in desperation. Then have him collapse, and ask all shocked sounding "who are you?.." and then cut to the credits. That's kind of how I imagined it would go down. Oh well!
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In the forest scene, when Kylo tried to pull the lightsaber from the snow and it instead flew past him, I thought (well the fanboy in me) it was going to land in the hand of Luke, who would show up to save the day and confront his traitor padawan. That would've IMO made for a badass appearance. But then I remembered he would've been in recluse for a reason and leaving maps only to show up in the middle of a battle wouldn't make sense. But that would've made for a great reveal.
The actual one was way more open ended and makes for a lot of intrigue. But if I had written the scene I would've had Rey searching for a couple days, and eventually becoming exhausted and nearly giving up, before Luke having stalked her the entire time decides to show up just as nightfall comes about, clearly having lost some of his humanity, and acting very hostile at first (maybe even force-pulls her to him and starts to choke her) until she shows him the lightsaber in desperation. Then have him collapse, and ask all shocked sounding "who are you?.." and then cut to the credits. That's kind of how I imagined it would go down. Oh well!
Well done! That thing with the lightsabre would have indeed been badass. I actually had a similar idea when they were at the planet where Maz was and Rey was running through the forest. She would stumble across his temple somehow. Like a "he's been here the whole time!" thing, and the map was just to throw everyone off.
I like your version, that would have been great.
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I would agree with the Luke scene. If it had been 20 seconds shorter, it would have been perfect. Throw the hood up and credits.
I actually think it was a little too long. I would have been fine with them not finding Luke at all, just the path two him. The few minutes of epilogue where Rey finds Luke is what felt really rushed. That whole thing could have been an adventure all on it's own.
Yep. Some things that were given a bit of extra time maybe for impact shouldnt have been stretched out as long as they were, like the Han/Kylo scene and the Luke reveal (360 pan of them just standing and exchanging glances.. lol I guess it looks pretty but come on now..).
And other parts should've been given a little more time and attention. I think they could've put a few more minutes of running time just focusing on the new baddies and just how ruthless they are to help us buy into the idea that they are menacing and should be feared. We were introduced to Starkiller base and then a big ol' Hitler-esque speech came out of nowhere, and immediately after that planet is destroyed. Definitely a moment of "well that escalated quickly"..when they could've built up to it by just giving us a few more exchanges between Kylo and Hux, maybe discussing said weapon and their plan. That would also help further build chemistry between those leads. The thing they made sure of in the OT was to give us a really good idea of what the Empire was about from the get go, and their plans/motives, and we were clearly made to feel that they were this unstoppable force that should be hated. I wish they did a bit more of that here with the first order.
We're floating a theory around our office that Rey is a clone of Luke. Not overly detailed theory, but perhaps. Because Luke's original Lightsaber plays a role, you could assume that Luke's hand was also recovered.
We're floating a theory around our office that Rey is a clone of Luke. Not overly detailed theory, but perhaps. Because Luke's original Lightsaber plays a role, you could assume that Luke's hand was also recovered.
That's all there is to the theory.
Great movie, I liked it.
That seems like a stretch to me. But I do think she's connected to the Skywalker's in one way or another. I have a feeling that she's Luke's daughter.
So did Kylo "Ben" Ren lead a coup against Luke, turning his Jedi in training into the Knights of Ren, subsequently anointing himself their leader? How did he come under the wing of Supreme "Plaguies" Snoke? Where in the #### was Snoke during the events of the previous movies?
These are the things we need answers to, like before 2017... :/
Trivial. There's a huge gap in Obi Wans life between episodes 3 and 4, and no Jedi order to forbid romances.
We might meet Reys grandmother, Obi Wans lover, who probably was the one who started calling Obi Wan "Ben".
I have another speculation, which if I'm right will spoil surprises from the next film, which is why I'm putting it in spoiler tags.
Spoiler!
First of all, there's going to be a romance between Rey and Kylo, which I think will will lead to Rey or both abandoning the light/dark dichotomy of the Force. That's what "Bringing balance to the Force" will be. No more war between the light and the dark, because they will be united.
That's not the speculative spoiler though. This is The "I am your father moment" will be between...
Spoiler!
Luke and Kylo.
Or, Luke and "Darth Vader" with a role reversal.
Luke gave his son to be brought up by Leia (his sister, so a natural choice) and Han. They consider themselves his parents, but biologically Luke is Kylos real father. (The mother is yet unknown. Probably dead.)
The biggest hint to this:
- Kylos real name is Ben, clearly after Ben Kenobi. That makes no sense for Han and Leia, as they barely knew the man and knew him as Obi Wan. (It's also unnecessarily complicated to be just a random detail.) But to Luke, Obi Wan was Ben Kenobi, his mentor and a father figure. Ben is the obvious name of Luke's son.
This is why Luke blames himself so much for Kylos betrayal; it was his own son who destroyed the Jedi. Like his father did. No wonder he wants to disappear.
Kylo also looks much more like Luke, and not at all like Leia or Han. Usually modern films pay attention to stuff like this.
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I may be missing something stupidly obvious, but why was there a "map" to Luke anyway? R2 obviously had one piece of it and BB-8 the rest, but if Luke's intent was to bugger off, why leave a trace in that way? Where did the map come from? Did Luke foresee that someone like his daughter (if he has one) would find him one day?
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I may be missing something stupidly obvious, but why was there a "map" to Luke anyway? R2 obviously had one piece of it and BB-8 the rest, but if Luke's intent was to bugger off, why leave a trace in that way? Where did the map come from? Did Luke foresee that someone like his daughter (if he has one) would find him one day?
Luke left it with R-2 and then put R2 into sleep mode. He was waiting until some event, where he would be needed.
The rebels discover he other piece on Jakku, which happens to be the planet Rey (potentially Luke's daughter) is on.
Luke clearly split up the map. Left one piece with R2 and the other with Rey. Rey meeting with R2 triggers R2 to wake up, and they can bring Rey to Luke.
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Just took my wife and kids to see it. Thought it was great. The opening sequence too me back to being 7 years old in 3rd grade. That music is powerful. They killed off the coolest movie character of all time. Very sad. Liked the new guys, though Kylo Ren is kind of a weenie sans mask.
Luke Skywalker has vanished.
In his absence, the sinister
FIRST ORDER has risen
from the ashes of the Empire
and will not rest until Skywalker, the last Jedi,
has been destroyed.
With the support of the REPUBLIC,
General Leia Organa leads a brave RESISTANCE.
She is desperate to find her
brother Luke and gain his
help in restoring peace and
justice to the galaxy.
Leia has sent her most daring
pilot on a secret mission
to Jakku, where an old ally
has discovered a clue to
Luke’s whereabouts . . . .
They killed off the coolest movie character of all time.
This may be well known to most, but was something that I only really became aware of recently is that besides episodes 7, 8, 9, they are also making some standalone Star Wars universe movies. And the Han Solo origin movie is under production, set for a 2018 release. So the character will be back in some fashion.
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So did Kylo "Ben" Ren lead a coup against Luke, turning his Jedi in training into the Knights of Ren, subsequently anointing himself their leader? How did he come under the wing of Supreme "Plaguies" Snoke? Where in the #### was Snoke during the events of the previous movies?
These are the things we need answers to, like before 2017... :/
Don't think you'll be getting any more answers before May 2017. Hell you may not get those answers until Episode 9
Luke made out with Leia several times before figuring out she was his sister two years later on Dagobah.
Yeah but let's be honest -- Lucas and the other writers didn't know they were related until they were writing Jedi lol. I'm sure this new trilogy has been planned to a 'T'.
Luke gave his son to be brought up by Leia (his sister, so a natural choice) and Han. They consider themselves his parents, but biologically Luke is Kylos real father. (The mother is yet unknown. Probably dead.)
The biggest hint to this:
- Kylos real name is Ben, clearly after Ben Kenobi. That makes no sense for Han and Leia, as they barely knew the man and knew him as Obi Wan. (It's also unnecessarily complicated to be just a random detail.) But to Luke, Obi Wan was Ben Kenobi, his mentor and a father figure. Ben is the obvious name of Luke's son.
This is why Luke blames himself so much for Kylos betrayal; it was his own son who destroyed the Jedi. Like his father did. No wonder he wants to disappear.
Kylo also looks much more like Luke, and not at all like Leia or Han. Usually modern films pay attention to stuff like this.
Spoiler!
I was thinking this too.
The movie was very quick to say Kylo was Han's son, and for Leia & Han to call him their son. There was no big reveal moment with that; it was repeated many times and felt like a red herring.
Kylo didn't call Han father at any point, and did call Vader grandfather which of course would still work if he's Luke's son. I think he actually knows that Luke is his real father.
Awesome, gratifying , more words to express joy and relief. Thanks JJ for not "Star Trekking" it. An excellent Homage and setup for the lovers of the OG and what the Future will bring.
Thoughts.
Rey:
Left on Jakku to be hidden. And to be raised early on by Max Von Sydow (Who I assume was an apprentice but too old or weak to fully become a Jedi) and then watched over from afar (Much like Obi Wan did with Luke). I suspect Luke has familial ties to her. Perhaps not through the Skywalker side though. Maybe Padme's. I say this because in that time span Luke and R2 were tight. R2 may have caught Luke up on all he knew from the Clone wars. He never had his memory wiped. Leia after they returned and hugged her, it didn't feel mother and daughter like, more like an Aunt, at least thats what my mind immediately went to.
EDIT: More on Rey. I loved at the end when she looked so desperate to just give that lightsaber to Luke and get the heck out of dodge. The reluctant Jedi. She doesn't want any part of it, but in the end I think she understands that it is something that MUST happen. I find that trait in how Daisy Ridley portrayed the character the most admirable and the most incorruptable. I think she's certainly my favorite new character, but I've always been a fan of Jedi.
All in all, I think she takes over as head of the Jedi at the end of the Trilogy.
As for the lightsaber knowledge people are questioning, as Obi Wan once said "Use he Force, let it flow through you." The knowledge for anything is in the force, just need to be mindful of it, and that is when the tables turned in her fight with Kylo. She took whats her names advice and closed her eyes, focusing on the Force, letting it guide her.
I got to go , but I'll chime in on the rest later.
Last edited by dammage79; 12-18-2015 at 08:06 PM.
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