[Signing] Flames sign Erik Gudbranson (1 yr, $1.95 mil)

[Major Major]

So today the depth chart looks like this then:

Hanifin - Tanev
Zadorov - Andersson
Valimaki - Gudbranson
Mackey - Stone
Kylington

Thursday it was:

Hanifin - Tanev
Zadorov - Andersson
Valimaki -Mackey
Kylington


The issue with the 7 d one is that there is nothing out there Beyond Kylington. Meaning the team is 2 mere injuries to being in a bad spot. Even if there were only 1 injury to the top 4, they are in an extremely uncomfortable and virtually untenable position with 3 young mostly unproven d men in big roles.

I think the 2 signings yesterday were overkill, but no question this team is cautious when it comes to d men injuries and having enough guys. I think this makes competition for the bottom pair actually makes more sense now. Before it was valimaki locked in and the 2 others going for spot 6. Now I don't think there is a lock. Vet vs vet and kid vs kid vs kid. Either way every pairing is lefty/righty, stay at home/PMD. For anyone who can't see the method behind this, it seems plain as day to me.

[Igottago]

Originally Posted by Bingo

This isn't a contending hockey team. There are a tonne of ifs for this team to go anywhere this year.

I don't like the Gubranson signing, wish it didn't happen.

But I'm not going to wallow in it. It isn't the defining moment of a failed season. This team is going to win more than we expect, or lose as much as some predict based on the play of about 7-8 players, and Gudbranson isn't one of them.

So yeah we can hash out the misery of a signing that nobody likes for 18 pages, but it just doesn't move the dial for me all that much.

This is a team with a flawed core that if anything got worse this off season. I certainly won't debate that.

But I just can't get into the muck and wallow for days on end. Can't believe how many people seem to love misery so much. There is reason for it sure, but I just can't fathom being a fan and removing all optimism and hope.

Yet time and time again you post in support of the current GM. 7-8 years into his rebuild and no closer to being a contender, and potentially got worse this offseason, by your own admission. If the Flames aren't actually getting better, why so resistant to a change?

[Calgary4LIfe]

I was reading the Gubranson signing thread over at HF, and it had mixed-results. Ottawa and Vancouver fans both hated him there and thought he was useless. The fans from American teams seemed to almost universally like him. Judging by that, perhaps the issue isn't with Gudbranson but the teams themselves - Vancouver and Ottawa were regularly playing him in their top 4, while he was getting reduced minutes and responsibility on the American squads.



Perhaps he will only really see the bottom pairing here and be reliable? Reliable defensively, clearing the net, physical with the occasional fight to keep the opposing teams honest - then he easily earns his contract. That's the key though - will he play reliable minutes on the bottom pair? We will soon find out I guess.


At worst, this is going to just be about 1 million dollars' worth of waste if it doesn't turn out (which is not nothing - the accumulated cap savings at the end of the season is important after all, as is having the flexibility to make a deal when a desperate team comes calling), but that's what it will be as a worst-case scenario. I can't imagine Sutter having much patience with Gudbranson if he is making costly turnover and turnover or being walked (which has more to do with his IQ than his skating - he does move around quite well for a big man). Sutter likes and seemed to trust Stone - a couple bad moves, and Gudbranson starts to sit. Sutter seemed to like Mackey too last season. Kylington has no hope in this case it seems, so I look at him as '3 injuries to our defence safety'.


I hate it less today. I still don't love it, even though I am glad that it is fitting into the identity of the Flames, but the downside is lessened for me. Sutter will either get him to play reliably, or Sutter will get Stone to take his minutes. From what I gather, he has been playing reliable minutes with the right partner, especially on the bottom pairing.

[ForeverFlameFan]

^ I just hope he can bring a LITTLE bit of what Engelland brought. One thing I like about the moves Treliving made is bringing back the grit that won us a playoff series in 2015. Engelland was a huge factor in the Vancouver series.

Was Gudbranson worth 2m? Hell no. But, we all said Engelland wasn’t worth what we paid him either, but surprisingly became a solid guy as a 4/5/6.

[mennoknight]

the stages of grief on full display in this thread. good to see we've reached acceptance.

[FlamesAddiction]

It's never a good sign when a player plays for 4 teams over 2 seasons, although it seems like Pittsburgh liked him and then he bombed in Vancouver and Ottawa. Was injured in Nashville I think.

A one year deal isn't anything to worry about if it even if it is an over payment by about $1 million.

Barring any trade, it seems like at least 2 of Mackey, Kylingston, or Stone will start in Stockton this year.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

Thank you, I am correct in my analysis.

Pull the other one. Show your analysis, in detail, comparing Gudbranson to each and every rookie defenceman in the Flames' system, or else admit you didn't do it.

Now, to the signing, since I haven't contributed my wooden nickels yet:

I agree with those who say it's a headscratcher. I think those who imagine Treliving offered $1.95 million to a player he could have signed for half the price are just looking for something to blame him for. The player has never been out of work, and has been able to command a cap hit between $2.5m and $4m on every contract between his rookie deal and this one. Clearly, for whatever reason, there is a market for this player and the Flames paid the going price.

So why is that the going price?

After taking a look at the highlight reel posted earlier, I see a player with very limited skill (which is why the analytics crowd hate him) who will do pretty much anything to stay in an NHL lineup (which is probably why coaches want him). He reminds me of a bigger, more physical Kevin Dahl.

Back in '92, when Dave King became coach of the Flames, the team was nearly as soft (in relative terms, compared to teams from that era) as the Flames have been in recent years. King wanted to change that. The players needed a wakeup call; they needed to know that they couldn't just coast through the season on pure skill. So the team went out and acquired Kevin Dahl, who had played for King on the Olympic team.

Dahl wasn't much of a defenceman – a classic tweener, not big enough to be a stay-at-home D and not skilled enough to be a puck-mover. But he had one thing: he would do whatever his coach asked of him. King wanted his players to block shots, and most of them wouldn't do it. Dahl was the first man to block a shot on that team, and King rewarded him by giving him regular ice time. After that, everybody on the team started blocking shots, because they knew that was what they had to do to stay on the coach's good side.

Shot-blocking is a lot less fashionable now, for good reasons grounded in analytics. But defence still involves hitting and physical play, and that is the one thing Gudbranson brings in spades. By himself, he won't make a positive impact on a game any more than Kevin Dahl did. But if Sutter can say to his young defencemen, ‘Look, if you want to push Gudbranson out of the lineup, you have to hit and punish and lay your body on the line,’ that could have a ripple effect through the entire D corps.

It's my guess that this guy was signed to be a poster boy. He will play Sutter hockey, and any defenceman who wants to stay in the lineup will have to play Sutter hockey to keep up.

[saillias]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

People are not just upset because of Gud. We were hoping for bigger and better changes. This signing probably signifies the end to that hope. That’s why it’s disappointing. You just don’t waste cap space on this type of player unless there is no other choices

Pretty much my read on this as well. It's not just a meltdown because Gudbranson. There's also that rumor circling around that these recent signings are because we're out on Eichel. Whether you believe that or not, it's the caphit as well, and all the open problems and questions left unaddressed. It's just a boiling point for a lot of valid frustrations people have

[Burning Beard]

All I know is that this fanbase seems even softer than the team was before these signings when everyone complained they were too soft all the time.

[gvitaly]

The negative side of me really doesn't get this signing. It also thinks this cap space is better used elsewhere and we got ourselves a replacement level player. All while not addressing the need for an offensive defensemen. I'm worried about his salary dictating he is given a roster spot. I am really glad Mackey is waiver exempt this season, I wouldn't want him to become the new Byron. I really liked him last season and hope we see more of him.

The positive side of me thinks we can always sell him at the deadline. We will get a 5th-7th round pick plus a prospect. In fact, if things don't go well I'm sure we can cash in on all the depth defensemen. We'll get a 2nd-3rd back for Zadorov and a later pick for Gudbranson. Moreover, if we don't make the playoffs, I'm pretty sure the team will start from a clean slate at the management level.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

21 goals in 10 years?! Lol

This is his 7th team. That’s hilarious.

Remember when I said earlier in the summer that the Flames plug up all their bottom roles and then rookies can’t really make it? This is exactly what I was talking about. Waste. The cap space is more valuable.

Well since he clearly wasnt signed to add offense, this isn't even a talking point.

I don't understand the signing either when Stone is also being added, but because a big bruiser doesn't score, doesn't mean there aren't other areas he can help in.

Its kind of what a stay at home defenseman means. One of the greatest defenders to ever wear the flaming C scored 24 goals while playing in 11 seasons (and WAY more games) in Calgary.

There's lots not to like about this off season and a couple of the signings, bt lack of offense from EG isnt one of them.

[dino7c]

Regehr played over 1000 games and had 36 goals total

[RedHawk12]

Originally Posted by gvitaly

The negative side of me really doesn't get this signing. It also thinks this cap space is better used elsewhere and we got ourselves a replacement level player. All while not addressing the need for an offensive defensemen. I'm worried about his salary dictating he is given a roster spot. I am really glad Mackey is waiver exempt this season, I wouldn't want him to become the new Byron. I really liked him last season and hope we see more of him.

The positive side of me thinks we can always sell him at the deadline. We will get a 5th-7th round pick plus a prospect. In fact, if things don't go well I'm sure we can cash in on all the depth defensemen. We'll get a 2nd-3rd back for Zadorov and a later pick for Gudbranson. In fact, if we don't make the playoffs, I'm pretty sure the team will start from a clean slate at the management level.

I agree with this. It seems to me with the signings the past few days that we are out on a players like Eichel and that we are going to give this core another shot, with a full year of Sutter. If we fail, I can see us trading everyone by the deadline. Johnny and Chucky can bring back big returns. Zadorov, Gudbranson, Lewis, Richardson etc can all bring back mid to late round picks. I can also see the org doing a complete teardown and firing the GM and the coach.

If Sutter can bring out the most with this group, we have a bunch of players that can play his style of playoff hockey and that bodes well for our chances if we make the playoffs.

I guess time will tell. I'm not particularly thrilled with this signing and I'm not particularly happy to go into the season with the same core, but I am at least curious enough to see what Sutter can do with this group.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by dino7c

Regehr played over 1000 games and had 36 goals total

Not for the Flames.

[CsInMyBlood]

Originally Posted by dino7c

I wouldn't trade one year of EG for 2 years of Hamonic

Yeah, I wouldn't either.

To be honest maybe Gudbranson will have a Tanev year under Sutter and then we can sign him to a 4x4.

[Gaskal]

I expect many faces to be caved in and countless cross-checks thrown with a the fury of a thousand suns.

[Chingas]

Originally Posted by bzoo02

Maybe the idea is to make the Flames a physically intimidating team to play against, kind of like Washington in the east.

Tkachuk
Lucic
Coleman
Ritchie
Lewis
Zadorov
Gudbranson

All have no problem dropping the mitts.

And hopefully tkachuck is now happy and knows that the team will finally have his back.

[powderjunkie]

I've always felt Andersson was the most likely roster player to be involved in an Eichel trade, so this actually makes me more optimistic in that regard.

[getbak]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

It's never a good sign when a player plays for 4 teams over 2 seasons

At least it means teams wanted him. Also, 2 of the trades were deadline deals where he was going from a non-playoff team to a playoff team, so they obviously felt he could help them.

If he was a much better player, he wouldn't have been traded so much, but if he was a much worse player, he also wouldn't have been traded as much because no one would have wanted him.

[flames_fan_down_under]

Hopefully he brings a much needed physical element to this Flames team.