The Legend of Sam Bennett

[TheoFleury]

He's no better than Feaster or Sutter. He just had a dad who taught him the ways of the smooth talking empty corporate suit

[Jiri Hrdina]

You've made your point. You aren't offering any actual thoughtful criticisms, just baseless remarks and cliches.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

As an aside, the whole founded his own minor league and merged with another doesn’t get talked about much. All I have ever heard about that is basically just wikipedia level detail. Seems like there would be a movie in there somewhere with hockey teams in Waco, Texarkana among other places.

I really have no idea what his role was or what he learned from that. But probably not someone I want investing my money if he thought it was actually a good idea.

It expanded from 6 teams to 18 in 4 years, then merged with another league. Seems like a pretty decent venture.

But whatever it was, it’s pretty clear that all the posters who constantly refer to Jim Treliving having anything to do with whether Brad Treliving is a good GM or not are just stretching. He’s played or managed hockey continuously since 1987. Went straight from WHL to ECHL to working that WPHL and then getting hired by Maloney to run the AHL team. When exactly was he at Jim T’s knee?

[OldSam]

Perhaps Benny can have dinner with his best bud McBaby on Wednesday and tell him how totally cool it would be for him to ask for a trade out of the hellhole.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

It expanded from 6 teams to 18 in 4 years, then merged with another league. Seems like a pretty decent venture.

Good luck finding those teams now. But I admire your dedication to arguing everything GioforPM. I just hope that wasn’t your money.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by TheoFleury

He's no better than Feaster or Sutter. He just had a dad who taught him the ways of the smooth talking empty corporate suit

I mean he was a pro hockey player himself...you can scoff at the WHL, AHL,ECHL, and the IHL but its still the top 1% of hockey players. Its not like his dad just paid someone to give him a job. You are getting a little too personal here.

[Sylvanfan]

If Sam Bennett scores 4 goals tomorrow night, I think I will quit watching hockey for the rest of this decade, taking solace in thinking that it's just going to be that type of decade for the Flames.

I figured the guy would play a lot better after getting away from Calgary and the pressure cooker it might have been for him. But I'd much rather seem him have an off night tomorrow and than make it up agains the Oilers.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Good luck finding those teams now. But I admire your dedication to arguing everything GioforPM. I just hope that wasn’t your money.

Well, a bunch are now in the NAHL. As for the others, I’m not sure how the ending of the CHL has much to do with Treliving, who was AGM in Phoenix by then.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Well, a bunch are now in the NAHL. As for the others, I’m not sure how the ending of the CHL has much to do with Treliving, who was AGM in Phoenix by then.

The NAHL is a junior league, the WPHL was pro.

In this case you're the one trying to argue that Treliving had something to do with the "success" of the WPHL. I'm commenting on what happened to the league.

[Gaskal]

I'm astonished that Tre didn't think to ask Sam if he wanted to stay after he fired Ward, his main reason for wanting a change of scenery. Given how Francis bungled the Seattle expansion draft I don't think he was a risk to be selected either.

I was under the assumption that he just didn't want to play for Treliving specifically and thats why he got dealt.

But yeah if Sam was willing to have a crack at it with Darryl and still got dealt, that's the level of shortsightedness I'd expect from Chiarelli and not Tre.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by Gaskal

I'm astonished that Tre didn't think to ask Sam if he wanted to stay after he fired Ward, his main reason for wanting a change of scenery. Given how Francis bungled the Seattle expansion draft I don't think he was a risk to be selected either.

I was under the assumption that he just didn't want to play for Treliving specifically and thats why he got dealt.

But yeah if Sam was willing to have a crack at it with Darryl and still got dealt, that's the level of shortsightedness I'd expect from Chiarelli and not Tre.

I am trying to think of the last player that requested a trade and wasn’t eventually dealt?

Public trade requests are typically a slap in the face of an organization. Flames decided to make a change

Also I don’t see why Seattle wouldn’t have selected Sam if he was available they are obviously in a longer term build so why not take the 25 year old former top 5 pick who wants a change of scenery or the 38 year old Dman who doesn’t want to leave?

The true correct and gutsy play would have been protecting Bennett and exposing Monahan. That type of gesture may have rebuilt Sam’s trust that the organization is committed to his success

[dustygoon]

Should Tre have known that Monahan had debilitating injuries to this extent when he protected him?

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by dustygoon

Should Tre have known that Monahan had debilitating injuries to this extent when he protected him?

2 seasons of sharp decline prior and he knows the full medical history. I am sure they hoped he would bounce back but his lack of speed and grit make him a poorer fit for Darryl than Sam is/was

[dustygoon]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

2 seasons of sharp decline prior and he knows the full medical history. I am sure they hoped he would bounce back but his lack of speed and grit make him a poorer fit for Darryl than Sam is/was

That's where I am. He didn't know for sure, but the medical history and decline should have been a red flag. And now knowing how Ron Francis picked his team (like badly), he likely wouldn't have taken Monahan with that high contract number.

[SuperMatt18]

I do find all the "Bennett is the second coming" and "Monahan was never good" takes kind of funny.

Bennett is on pace for 40 goals and 65 points right now this season. He's shooting 14% which is way above his career average of 10%, so that probably comes down a little but he's probably good for 35 goals and 60 points this year.

Monahan who was supposedly never good, and always was carried by Gaudreau averaged 30 Goals and 66 Points for the 5 seasons between 14-15 and 18-19.

So this "amazing" season from Bennett, is about what Monahan was able to average for most of his career as a Flame until the injuries started to pile up.

Bennett was misused in Calgary, and Bennett probably deserved a better look at center with wingers that were actual NHL caliber, but let's not absolve Bennett of all accountability here.

He was mostly average in Calgary with some flashes at times, but especially late in his tenure he also didn't really earn himself much of an opportunity, especially his regular season play in 19-20 where he had the worst impacts on the roster. The biggest mistake remains that Dube-Bennett-Lucic deserved a look to start the 20-21 season after their great playoff, and that was just Ward being a horrible coach that triggered this whole thing.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

The NAHL is a junior league, the WPHL was pro.

In this case you're the one trying to argue that Treliving had something to do with the "success" of the WPHL. I'm commenting on what happened to the league.

The WPHL teams that went to the CHL converted into NAHL teams when the CHL ended (years after Treliving was done with it). I was answering your question.

The WPHL neither succeeded nor failed under Treliving. The point is that Treliving wasn't some silver spoon guy propped up by his daddy, as some would have it. He's been in hockey this whole time.

[Buff]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

I do find all the "Bennett is the second coming" and "Monahan was never good" takes kind of funny.

Bennett is on pace for 40 goals and 65 points right now this season. He's shooting 14% which is way above his career average of 10%, so that probably comes down a little but he's probably good for 35 goals and 60 points this year.

Monahan who was supposedly never good, and always was carried by Gaudreau averaged 30 Goals and 66 Points for the 5 seasons between 14-15 and 18-19.

So this "amazing" season from Bennett, is about what Monahan was able to average for most of his career as a Flame until the injuries started to pile up.

Bennett was misused in Calgary, and Bennett probably deserved a better look at center with wingers that were actual NHL caliber, but let's not absolve Bennett of all accountability here.

He was mostly average in Calgary with some flashes at times, but especially late in his tenure he also didn't really earn himself much of an opportunity, especially his regular season play in 19-20 where he had the worst impacts on the roster. The biggest mistake remains that Dube-Bennett-Lucic deserved a look to start the 20-21 season after their great playoff, and that was just Ward being a horrible coach.

This reminded me of something... I believe there a comment from Bennett after Sutter was hired. It came after word was out that Sutter talked to players individually and Bennet said something along the lines of it was good to actually know what the coach expects from him and to have a plan laid out for him by the coach.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by Buff

This reminded me of something... I believe there a comment from Bennett after Sutter was hired. It came after word was out that Sutter talked to players individually and Bennet said something along the lines of it was good to actually know what the coach expects from him and to have a plan laid out for him by the coach.

I hated it at the time, and was vocal about it when Ward was hired full time, but hiring Ward was probably one of Trelivings biggest mistakes as GM.

Just not an NHL calibre coach and I think this team's 20-21 season would have been much more successful if Sutter or Boudreau were here as coach from day 1.

No idea how they thought bringing Ward back was a good idea with how he butchered that Dallas series.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

The WPHL teams that went to the CHL converted into NAHL teams when the CHL ended (years after Treliving was done with it). I was answering your question.

The WPHL neither succeeded nor failed under Treliving. The point is that Treliving wasn't some silver spoon guy propped up by his daddy, as some would have it. He's been in hockey this whole time.

Well to be pedantic, these teams didn't convert from pro teams to junior teams. How would you do that? I do believe a few owners ended up owning a team in the junior league which maybe is what you mean.

I have never claimed anything about a silver spoon so maybe you meant to argue with someone else. I was merely commenting on the failure of the WPHL and how putting teams in Monroe, Texarkana (although I guess that was CHL), Waco, Tupelo is Jamaican bobsled team kind of stuff.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Well to be pedantic, these teams didn't convert from pro teams to junior teams. How would you do that? I do believe a few owners ended up owning a team in the junior league which maybe is what you mean.

I have never claimed anything about a silver spoon so maybe you meant to argue with someone else. I was merely commenting on the failure of the WPHL and how putting teams in Monroe, Texarkana (although I guess that was CHL), Waco, Tupelo is Jamaican bobsled team kind of stuff.

The WPHL didn't fail under Treliving is the point. It grew.

And yes, what happened with the NAHL was that the pro team was replaced, with junior teams with the same owners, the same arenas and the same name.