02-26-2018, 07:40 AM
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#1
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Some kinda newsbreaker!
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Learning Phaneufs skating style
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Sens trade Ian Cole to BJs for a 2020 3rd and Nick Moutrey
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02-26-2018, 07:50 AM
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#2
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#1 Goaltender
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Seems cheap consider its a 2020 pick?
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02-26-2018, 07:51 AM
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#3
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: SW Calgary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neo45
Seems cheap consider its a 2020 pick?
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That's what I thought too# but if they desperately wanted to flip him maybe their wasn't much interest
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02-26-2018, 08:48 AM
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#4
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Franchise Player
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Pretty much establishes the value of Stone.
Did the Flames have to pay a premium to get Stone to stay in Calgary? or was it just a bad evaluation of his talent.
Stone sure is not 1.4 M better than Cole if at all.
If the Flames were to be thinking about moving Stone they would have to retain 1.5M salary to get a 2020 3rd round pick and a 2nd level prospect.
With the disastrous off season: Hamonic and Stone. The Flames should be looking at whether the Burke / Trevling team is the right management team going forward.
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02-26-2018, 08:49 AM
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#5
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Powerplay Quarterback
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: CGY
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when you come across a post like this ^ and wonder what is going on... then. O I forgot to sign in!
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02-26-2018, 08:51 AM
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#6
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First Line Centre
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ricardodw
Pretty much establishes the value of Stone.
Did the Flames have to pay a premium to get Stone to stay in Calgary? or was it just a bad evaluation of his talent.
Stone sure is not 1.4 M better than Cole if at all.
If the Flames were to be thinking about moving Stone they would have to retain 1.5M salary to get a 2020 3rd round pick and a 2nd level prospect.
With the disastrous off season: Hamonic and Stone. The Flames should be looking at whether the Burke / Trevling team is the right management team going forward.
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I must have missed the memo..... since when was Stone such a terrible defenseman?
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02-26-2018, 08:53 AM
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#7
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#1 Goaltender
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ricardodw
Pretty much establishes the value of Stone.
Did the Flames have to pay a premium to get Stone to stay in Calgary? or was it just a bad evaluation of his talent.
Stone sure is not 1.4 M better than Cole if at all.
If the Flames were to be thinking about moving Stone they would have to retain 1.5M salary to get a 2020 3rd round pick and a 2nd level prospect.
With the disastrous off season: Hamonic and Stone. The Flames should be looking at whether the Burke / Trevling team is the right management team going forward.
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Did you brush your teeth or eat breakfast yet before you started your usual I hate the Calgary Flames bs.
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02-26-2018, 08:57 AM
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#8
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ricardodw
Pretty much establishes the value of Stone.
Did the Flames have to pay a premium to get Stone to stay in Calgary? or was it just a bad evaluation of his talent.
Stone sure is not 1.4 M better than Cole if at all.
If the Flames were to be thinking about moving Stone they would have to retain 1.5M salary to get a 2020 3rd round pick and a 2nd level prospect.
With the disastrous off season: Hamonic and Stone. The Flames should be looking at whether the Burke / Trevling team is the right management team going forward.
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Stone is fine . What's your beef with Hamonic? If anything this deadline is showing flames really didn't overpay for him. A #4 cost controlled dman does not come cheap. I truly believe that some posters think a 1st round pick gets you Malkin.
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02-26-2018, 08:57 AM
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#9
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kukkudo
Did you brush your teeth or eat breakfast yet before you started your usual I hate the Calgary Flames bs.
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I don't hate Calgary... What do the Flames need more ... a 20 goal RW or a good journeyman #5 D-man?
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02-26-2018, 08:59 AM
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#10
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Powerplay Quarterback
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Calgary, AB
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It's typical Ricardo. A lot of shortsightedness and lack of understanding that market value changes every year.
Oh yes, and lets judge Stone. Have you even watched him this season?
__________________
"You're a wizard, Johnny Tre"
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02-26-2018, 09:03 AM
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#11
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: SW Calgary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rohara66
I must have missed the memo..... since when was Stone such a terrible defenseman?
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No kidding. I've liked what Stone has brought to the table for Calgary. No issues with him at all.
We've been so lucky with injuries the dmen. Let's not throw away a guy that could step up to the 2nd pairing and not skip a beat just because he's not flashy
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02-26-2018, 09:04 AM
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#12
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kyuss275
Stone is fine . What's your beef with Hamonic? If anything this deadline is showing flames really didn't overpay for him. A #4 cost controlled dman does not come cheap. I truly believe that some posters think a 1st round pick gets you Malkin.
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A first round pick can get you Tkachuk and even a middle round first rounder should get you a Valimaki.
Either one one on their own is better than Hamonic.
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02-26-2018, 09:05 AM
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#13
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Franchise Player
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Who is a better d-man Stone or Cole?
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02-26-2018, 09:05 AM
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#14
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Franchise Player
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He's kind of right, though; I don't know that Stone has all THAT much more value than Ian Cole. He has a better shot and plays more minutes. Cole prevents shots better. Any incremental value is at least partially offset by the cap hit difference. I don't see a basis for suggesting that they would yield wildly different returns, unless you want to argue that the Pens got fleeced here.
Of course, the Flames don't have to trade Stone at all.
__________________
"The great promise of the Internet was that more information would automatically yield better decisions. The great disappointment is that more information actually yields more possibilities to confirm what you already believed anyway." - Brian Eno
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02-26-2018, 09:11 AM
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#15
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Springbank
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ricardodw
A first round pick can get you Tkachuk and even a middle round first rounder should get you a Valimaki.
Either one one on their own is better than Hamonic.
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You are talking about what they can turn into. In that case, a first round pick can get you Dylan Strome and even a middle round pick can get you Mark McNeill.
I can tell you this - I'm not trading Tkachuk for any first round pick in 2018. And you'd have to really sell me on a high pick for Valimaki. I know what I have in those guys, especially Tkachuk. Even Dahlin isn't a sure thing.
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02-26-2018, 09:12 AM
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#16
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ricardodw
A first round pick can get you Tkachuk and even a middle round first rounder should get you a Valimaki.
Either one one on their own is better than Hamonic.
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A first round pick can also get you Poitier or klimchuck.
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02-26-2018, 09:19 AM
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#17
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: The Bay Area
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02-26-2018, 09:21 AM
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#18
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague
He's kind of right, though; I don't know that Stone has all THAT much more value than Ian Cole. He has a better shot and plays more minutes. Cole prevents shots better. Any incremental value is at least partially offset by the cap hit difference. I don't see a basis for suggesting that they would yield wildly different returns, unless you want to argue that the Pens got fleeced here.
Of course, the Flames don't have to trade Stone at all.
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Minor point
Cole played 17:37 Min/game with the Pens. Stone 16:08 with the Flames.
I am saying that they are pretty much equivalent except that Cole actually played significant minutes (49 games) in the last 2 SC runs and was a +8
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02-26-2018, 09:30 AM
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#19
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kyuss275
A first round pick can also get you Poitier or klimchuck.
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They chance of success of 1st round picks is improving every year. Look at the 2015 draft 2 years later. Out of the 30 player drafted there would be 20 that are better than Hamonic right now and the other 10 are not write offs.
You picked 2 of the 7-8 bad picks out of the 2013 1st round. Flames traded for one more out of that class.
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02-26-2018, 09:33 AM
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#20
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Chicago
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Hamonic has been very solid for a long time now.
The 'value' of Stone is likely a 2nd round pick.
Is he worth more to the Flames down the stretch? Probably
If that second round pick helps get you a scoring right winger, does that make it worth it? Probably
Would I rather they moved Stone than one of the young D prospects? yes
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