Las Vegas Shooting: 50+ Dead 500+ Injured at Jason Aldean Concert

[OMG!WTF!]

Originally Posted by Wormius

Yeah. I mean, obviously if the hotel did something the massacre might not have happened or to the extent it did - but I could just foresee if the hotel told him to get out, they would have the wrath of the NRA come down on the hotel for violating his something or other.

Not at all. You can ban guns wherever you want. Most casinos will ask you to leave your gun in their safe or just ask you to leave. It's not uncommon. A hotel room is still their property and I would assume an unreasonable amount of weapons would absolutely cause concern. A hand gun or something more reasonable would likely pass the test but 22 machine guns and 1600 rounds would never fly.

[Northendzone]

has there ever been a picture published of his arsenal that he used?

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Northendzone

has there ever been a picture published of his arsenal that he used?

People seem to think it should have been obvious he was taking this stuff up to his room. Nothing could be further from the truth.

What he did was conceal all this stuff in suitcases. All the weapons used, break down into pieces. He would go down to his vehicle, break down 2 or 3 weapons, put them into a suitcase, take them to his room, put them into drawers/cabinets/leave them in suitcases, until that fateful day. Same with the ammunition, the bump stocks, and the magazines.

This dude had been in that room for 8 days IIRC. All it took was a couple trips a day down to his vehicle to fill empty suitcases, back upstairs, unload em all and repeat.

In other words, like everything else associated with this thing, he planned and executed it really really well. Never drew attention to himself (walking through a 3500 suite hotel with suitcases is going to get the attention of exactly no one) stayed very under the radar in regards to his behaviour, acted like he had been there before (because he had), and stealthily pulled off the biggest massacre in US history for no apparent reason.

This one will have behavior analysts and psychologists of all stripes, befuddles for a long long time.

[Flash Walken]

I'm envisioning a scenario where a couple of hotel security guards with flashlights asks the guy with a thousand rounds to leave the hotel.

Probably goes well.

Yeah, that's the real problem here, no one noticed the uncomfortable amount of legally obtained weapons this private citizen had, not the fact that he had an uncomfortable amount of legally obtained weapons.

The Honduran woman making $6 an hour picking the towels off the floor in the bathroom should've known better.

[OMG!WTF!]

You can't conceal these kinds of firearms in Nevada so had he been caught he would have been arrested. The maids wouldn't have to arrest the guy.

Honestly Vegas catches people being a lot stealthier than this guy. Suspicious activity comes in all shapes and sizes. I don't blame the hotel at all but if a hundred guys pack a thousand guns into a dozen hotels I'm betting several of them would get caught.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by OMG!WTF!

You can't conceal these kinds of firearms in Nevada so had he been caught he would have been arrested. The maids wouldn't have to arrest the guy.

Honestly Vegas catches people being a lot stealthier than this guy. Suspicious activity comes in all shapes and sizes. I don't blame the hotel at all but if a hundred guys pack a thousand guns into a dozen hotels I'm betting several of them would get caught.

im really at a loss as to how they would be caught. Again, suitcases. Why would anyone suspect a guy carrying a suitcase through a hotel? Every single guest has at least one of them.

[OMG!WTF!]

Originally Posted by transplant99

im really at a loss as to how they would be caught. Again, suitcases. Why would anyone suspect a guy carrying a suitcase through a hotel? Every single guest has at least one of them.

Sure I get that. And this is why some hotels have already brought in metal detectors for baggage. But it's simply a matter of priority. You can't blink on the gaming floor without someone making a note of it. One guy carrying one suitcase isn't weird but I'm guessing several suitcases over several days combined with what they already know about gambling habits of the guy might catch some attention.

[Flash Walken]

Yeah, the guys at the front desk should've been keeping an eye out for a balding middle aged white guy with suitcases.

THAT is the issue here.

[Northendzone]

say he made three trips down to his car over the course of 7 days - seems to me like he would just blend in as another guy rolling thru the hotel with a bag.

if his cache was stashed in various places out of plain sight, then chances are housekeeping never notices.

it will be interesting to see how this lawyer makes out with this suit.

I suppose you could set up airport style detectors at key point sof the hotles, but would people want to deal with that.

I would aslo assume that at some point this will inspire copy cats

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by OMG!WTF!

Sure I get that. And this is why some hotels have already brought in metal detectors for baggage. But it's simply a matter of priority. You can't blink on the gaming floor without someone making a note of it. One guy carrying one suitcase isn't weird but I'm guessing several suitcases over several days combined with what they already know about gambling habits of the guy might catch some attention.

This is the part i don't understand.

who would notice? I mean at Mandalay Bay itself,, they have upwards of 6000 guests at any one time, more on weekends. The place is almost the size of the Stampede grounds. (exaggerated, but not a lot) Im just not sure who would ever notice the same guy carrying suitcases up to a room...nevermind he was going from the parking garage on an elevator straight up to his floor.

As far as gambling habits, he did what almost every other person does, and sat at a machine hitting buttons. He was a video poker player. The whales of that game simply play up to 100 hands per game, but with higher stakes per.
Nothing he does while gambling stands out, its only through the player cards that you insert in the machines that got him, and others like him, their comps and perks. They know how much money he is putting the machines. Its a very anonymous existence if he wants it to be. Now, the big rollers at tables and such...yeah they are well known to security etc, but sitting at machines? Not so much.

I will see if i can find that article.

Here it is...i honestly had no idea people could play 700 hands of poker a minute.

https://www.reviewjournal.com/crime/...ambling-world/

[OMG!WTF!]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

Yeah, the guys at the front desk should've been keeping an eye out for a balding middle aged white guy with suitcases.

THAT is the issue here.

Vegas hotel security is world leading when it comes to spotting abnormal activity. There's an average number of bags per guest. Then there's an abnormal number of bags. There's routine gambling and then there is a disruption of routine gambling. I would not for a second be surprised if, they decided to focus their attention outside of the casino, Paddock stood out like a sore thumb. But is that reason to search his suite? No. Would a courtesy visit from security have changed his plans? Maybe. Would that sort of thing anger and drive away freedom loving and right thinking Americans? Yes. It's a simple fix though...stay at the Wynn. They run everything through metal detectors now.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by OMG!WTF!

Vegas hotel security is world leading when it comes to spotting abnormal activity. There's an average number of bags per guest. Then there's an abnormal number of bags. There's routine gambling and then there is a disruption of routine gambling. I would not for a second be surprised if, they decided to focus their attention outside of the casino, Paddock stood out like a sore thumb. But is that reason to search his suite? No. Would a courtesy visit from security have changed his plans? Maybe. Would that sort of thing anger and drive away freedom loving and right thinking Americans? Yes. It's a simple fix though...stay at the Wynn. They run everything through metal detectors now.

Except he didn't.

From all reports he was entirely non-descript. Those who did interact with him found him remarkably unmemorable.

He was really really good at not making himself known to anyone at the hotel. Thats what allowed him, as much as anything, to get away with all this. He had to be a complete sociopath (obviously but you know what i mean) to plan this attack as well as he did, in the details and execution of it, and never raise one single red flag.

Again, this will be a case study for years and years in all aspects of criminal justice and associated fields.

[Mr.Coffee]

blaming this on the hotel at all is completely asinine. What kind of world are we in when a guy can go purchase that many machine guns and shoot 59 people, and then the hotel he does it from gets blamed?

This has gotten beyond the point of idiotic for Americans. If you're an American and are still unsure if gun control measures should be taken then I'm sorry, there's just no helping you. You're an idiot.

This would be like blaming the school for what happened with Columbine. Why couldn't the school have prevented that?

[transplant99]

A bunch of new information released today...

-

- Officials told reporters Friday that investigators determined 422 people suffered injuries as a direct result of gunfire, while another 851 individuals suffered other injuries during the attack. The report says all 22,000 people who attended the festival that night are recognized as victims.

-31 victims were pronounced dead at the scene. The rest were pronounced dead at medical facilities they were taken to afterward. Police have previously said that 58 people died in the attack.

-Investigators have chased 1,965 leads in the case. They've also reviewed more than 21,000 hours of footage and issued 1,062 legal notices during the investigation.

- Investigators recovered "several hundred images of child pornography" on Paddock's hard drive. The investigation into the images in ongoing, the report says. CNN previously reported that Paddock's brother was charged with possession of child pornography.

- Paddock paid off all his gambling debts before the shooting. It's already been reported that Paddock, a notorious gambler, was completely funded by his gambling habits and real estate transactions.

And some other stuff as well

http://www.cnn.com/2018/01/19/us/las...ils/index.html

[Snuffleupagus]

Originally Posted by transplant99

And some other stuff as well

http://www.cnn.com/2018/01/19/us/las...ils/index.html

Still no apparent motive, very troubling.

Also quite interesting. "the FBI is investigating an individual of federal interest related to the case. Charges could be brought within 60 days, he said."

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

Still no apparent motive, very troubling.

Also quite interesting. "the FBI is investigating an individual of federal interest related to the case. Charges could be brought within 60 days, he said."

Most middle aged men (myself included) are angry, crotchety old b*t*rds shouting at the kids on the lawn, foreign drivers or some other nonsense, I wouldn't trust myself with a gun most days, that's all the motivation people need.

Humans are not nice, we are savage, repressed effed up cannibals with a mm thin veneer of civilisation covering up our warts, give us a gun and no reason to care and we'll blow away anyone.

[Mr.Coffee]

Jesus.

Uhhh ya I don’t think most middle aged men are constantly on the brink of unleashing machine guns on thousands of people... like I’d like to think society isn’t being held together by flimsy scotch tape preventing a fallout into Mad Max becoming reality.

[CrunchBite]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

Most middle aged men (myself included) are angry, crotchety old b*t*rds shouting at the kids on the lawn, foreign drivers or some other nonsense, I wouldn't trust myself with a gun most days, that's all the motivation people need.

Humans are not nice, we are savage, repressed effed up cannibals with a mm thin veneer of civilisation covering up our warts, give us a gun and no reason to care and we'll blow away anyone.

Seek help.

[sun]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

Most middle aged men (myself included) are angry, crotchety old b*t*rds shouting at the kids on the lawn, foreign drivers or some other nonsense, I wouldn't trust myself with a gun most days, that's all the motivation people need.

Humans are not nice, we are savage, repressed effed up cannibals with a mm thin veneer of civilisation covering up our warts, give us a gun and no reason to care and we'll blow away anyone.

Who hurt you?

[mrdonkey]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

Most middle aged men (myself included) are angry, crotchety old b*t*rds shouting at the kids on the lawn, foreign drivers or some other nonsense, I wouldn't trust myself with a gun most days, that's all the motivation people need.

Humans are not nice, we are savage, repressed effed up cannibals with a mm thin veneer of civilisation covering up our warts, give us a gun and no reason to care and we'll blow away anyone.

You're not invited to any of my get togethers.