Nova Scotia Active Shooter Dead

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by btimbit

We know he wasn't a legal firearms owner but can you remember if it said he did have a license at one point? If that's the case I'm really curious if the weapons used were his own that he purchased with a license that he lost 18 years ago. That'd be a pretty damning oversight of the system and I'd be pretty pissed to hear it

I have to admit some confirmation bias as well, guns are hard to access if you are not either an active criminal or are a legal owner, for almost every one else they are impossible to obtain and this guy didn't seem to be in the hood rat biker gang member sphere.

[CaptainCrunch]

From everything I've read this wasn't the usual rat. He was well respected in his community, was a professional, people described him as friendly. There was a CTV news story of him donating dentures to a woman with cancer and she described him as an angel.


So either he snapped (Which I have my doubts because nothing about what he does seems to be spontaneous)


Or he was a monster under a good guy mask, who was smart enough to create a positive public image while he planned this thing so he wouldn't draw attention.

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

I have to admit some confirmation bias as well, guns are hard to access if you are not either an active criminal or are a legal owner, for almost every one else they are impossible to obtain and this guy didn't seem to be in the hood rat biker gang member sphere.

They're pretty easy to buy illegally sadly. I know a moron I used to work with that sold a gun to another guy, who didn't have a license. Illegal guns are a massive problem in this country, reserves close to the border are notorious for bringing them from the US, illegal guns from China are showing up on the west coast like crazy. Which is part of the reason I get so upset when the gun control debate comes up and lazily targets the people following the rules rather than go after those that don't

[EldrickOnIce]

Originally Posted by Reaper

This sounds like a cheap shot that is needlessly dismissive considering that btimbit took the time to articulate that he is pro gun control.

Yeah. I'm pro gun control.

But...
Don't take my guns.
I'm a responsible gun owner.

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

They didn't say anything about that. But that would be a law enforcement issue instead of a legislative issue.


I always thought that if the courts imposed a no fire arms condition, that there would be an enforcement order to take the guns into custody. If the police failed to do that, or the courts failed to do that, yeah, I'll be really upset at that.

That's why I'm really curious if AFC is right and he did have a PAL at one point. Would be a massive failure by the system if these guns were actually his

[CaptainCrunch]

Illegal guns are a fairly big business in this country.



https://www.cbc.ca/news/national-gun...arms-1.5126228


We know that because of the lax gun laws in the States a lot of guns are bought down there and sent up here, where gangs make huge profits. Also the Chinese pretty much turn a blind eye to guns manufactured in their factories that make their way into Canadian Ports.


The disturbing thing is we are starting to see a rise in a home grown home made weapons market in this country. We are also seeing an increase in legally bought guns being illegally sold.


Its two key areas of focus, and they're both enforcement issues instead of changing policy for legal gun owners. The laws are there to deal with these issues, for some reason though we chose to ignore it.

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

Illegal guns are a fairly big business in this country.



https://www.cbc.ca/news/national-gun...arms-1.5126228


We know that because of the lax gun laws in the States a lot of guns are bought down there and sent up here, where gangs make huge profits. Also the Chinese pretty much turn a blind eye to guns manufactured in their factories that make their way into Canadian Ports.


The disturbing thing is we are starting to see a rise in a home grown home made weapons market in this country. We are also seeing an increase in legally bought guns being illegally sold.


Its two key areas of focus, and they're both enforcement issues instead of changing policy for legal gun owners. The laws are there to deal with these issues, for some reason though we chose to ignore it.

And that's 100% my issue. These are real problems that I really hope we can work toward solving, and if any good can come out of tragedies like this it's my hope that this is one thing we learn and work toward.

Instead, the Government continues to just go after gun owners as a political feel-good exercise to buy votes. And sadly it creates an unnesesary divide in the public (like we're seeing in this thread with some posters just making drive by posts) between gun owners who start to feel unjustly targetted, and people who want all guns banned thinking it would somehow stop things like this.

So hopefully this gets politicians focused on the real issue. I had hoped we'd see that after the Danforth shootings but nothing changed

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by btimbit

They're pretty easy to buy illegally sadly. I know a moron I used to work with that sold a gun to another guy, who didn't have a license. Illegal guns are a massive problem in this country, reserves close to the border are notorious for bringing them from the US, illegal guns from China re showing up on the west coast like crazy. Which is part of the reason I get so upset when the gun control debate comes up and lazily targets the people following the rules rather than go after those that don't

They are easy to buy if you have a connection to criminals but for every one else they aren't, I agree within the criminal community guns are easy to obtain but they stay within that community, you or I couldn't pull up at a peeler bar in Surrey and buy a gun from some hood rat

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

They are easy to buy if you have a connection to criminals but for every one else they aren't, I agree within the criminal community guns are easy to obtain but they stay within that community, you or I couldn't pull up at a peeler bar in Surrey and buy a gun from some hood rat

Unfortunately you could very very easily just look through classified listings and eventually find a seller who doesn't care to check if you have a license.

It's not always criminal masterminds causing the issues it can also just be careless pieces of crap who don't follow the system

[afc wimbledon]

I bow to your knowledge on the shady side of 'legal' guns, no drug dealer would look at you twice, too much too lose

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

I bow to your knowledge on the shady side of 'legal' guns, no drug dealer would look at you twice, too much too lose

Sadly these are real flaws in the system I would love to have addressed. Seems nobody is interested though. Whatever loophole Wortman used to get access to his firearms, I hope they close it

[CaptainCrunch]

I still remember when I moved to Dallas, and one day me and my buddy were in a drug store and we went to the back and they had a wide selection of guns. Remember we were Canadians so we were stunned by the selection.


I was also just out of the military.



Anyways I saw a beautiful Desert Eagle gold plate. It came with an instruction video called the invasion of the Melons which was 10 minutes on the care and feeding of your Pistol followed by a short movie of people shoot water melons.


Anyways I remember kind of falling in love, and I was curious, and I went up to the clerk and asked him what I needed to take this thing home that day. Thinking US ID, or some kind of background check, nope he simply said Cash or Check.


I was kind of amazed at that, but not surprised.


Now I will be very clear here. I've never purchased a fire arm. My dad purchased a handgun back when I was a kid, but my mom hated having it in the house, so he eventually took it to the police.


I think a gun of any type for home defense is just a bad idea, I think that the best weapon for home defense is the telephone and having a evasion play out of the house. I don't have problems with hobby shooters or hunters. I have no problem with farmers having rifles or shot guns.


I don't see a need for a civilian to have a weapon with a 10 or 15 round magazine or more. I think that civilian weapons shouldn't be semi automatic to be honest. I do think that there should be some gun sanity.


I also believe that people that use firearms in the commission of a crime need to be harshly punished.


Guns are not a tool, guns are a weapon, if you point it at another person or animal and pull the trigger we might as well say that your intent is killing, and while the old saying is that guns don't kill people, people kill people, guns are designed to be lethal, they really have no other purpose but to send a potentially lethal projectile down field at fantastic velocities.


But honestly I do firmly believe that the rules that we have in place in this country in terms of buying and owning firearms make sense right now as it stands. You can't go out and buy assault weapons legally in this country, that prohibition has been around for 2 decades. Its not easy to buy hand guns and you can't simply carry them with you, and you are responsible for that weapon.


Its the old saying, the laws and rules are in the place, now fracking enforce them.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by btimbit

Sadly these are real flaws in the system I would love to have addressed. Seems nobody is interested though. Whatever loophole Wortman used to get access to his firearms, I hope they close it

the weird thing is I am way less worried about a criminal with a gun than I am a 'legal' gun owner, not because I think all legal owners are likely to do anything wrong but when they do it tends to be towards wives neighbours bosses etc, in all my years of working with criminals they have only ever killed each other, I'm not saying that's right but I do tend to feel less horrified by it

[CaptainCrunch]

I have more fear AFC with some home owner with a gun hearing a bump in the middle of the night then anything else. I have more fear of a guy at home being confronted by the bump and a lack of tactical awareness, an over flow of the wrong part of fight or flight hormones, and general panic then anything else.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

I have more fear AFC with some home owner with a gun hearing a bump in the middle of the night then anything else. I have more fear of a guy at home being confronted by the bump and a lack of tactical awareness, an over flow of the wrong part of fight or flight hormones, and general panic then anything else.

I don't disagree, criminals with guns do actually have a loose set or rules they tend to apply, not out of honor or the like but just self preservation, you can kill another gang member and the police will investigate but if it isn't immediately obvious chances are you will get away with it, the police are happy to wait until you are inevitably ratted out by someone down the road, there is little public pressure to find who shot some hood.
You shoot a civilian though and all hell breaks loose so criminals tend to restrict their violence to their own.

[Red Potato Standing By]

Other problem with people using guns for home protection is there are quite a few people who think it is ok to shoot someone if they steal something and are fleeing. Yes it sucks they stole your quad, no that does not mean you can shoot them.

[troutman]

Another sad story in Lebanon:

Man shoots dead wife and eight others in Lebanese town

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-52380503

[missdpuck]

Shooting a dead wife is a waste of ammunition.

[Scroopy Noopers]

I don’t mean to be a whiner here, but can we stick to the thread topic? It’s a horrible incident that is still unfolding.

[CaptainCrunch]

It came out this morning that this mutt had created a target list.



Pretty methodical