The Flames need to recall Matthew Phillips

[Sandman]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

Patrick Kane is 5'10 - 175lbs and won 2 cups in those years along with a Conn Smyth. skill also matters A LOT.

Oh yeah,so does speed. But say you had 2 Patrick Kanes-each one is exactly the same, same speed, same game-breaking skill, same hands. The only difference is that Kane #1 is 5'10", and Kane #2 is 6'2"-who would you want to take on your team? Theo Fleury said a few times that he always wondered how much more he could accomplish if he was even 6ft tall.

Similarly, if you're GM of a rebuilding team, if you could fill your roster with speed and skill, you would be better off filling it with speed, skill, and some size. Like I said, look at the last 10 years of SCF, and tell me size and grit is not a factor. Look at last year's trade deadline, and look at the prices teams were paying for size and grit. Tampa paid a first for Barclay Goodrow, and another first plus Nolan Foote for Blake Coleman. Brendan Dillon fetched a second, and a third, then signed a 4 year, 15.6M deal.

Look at most of the top teams around the league right now too-Colorado,Vegas, Washington, Tampa, Florida, are all HUGE teams. Even Carolina has a lot of big guys. Not all players have to be big, of there's plenty of small guys in the league who can play, but other than having lower centers of gravity, they are excelling DESPITE their size. When Vegas came into the league, they picked plucky but small guys, then surrounded them with beef. What has Vegas been doing since? Aquiring bigger and bigger players, and they are one of the best in the league.They didn't think they could win it all with that roster, despite mking it to the finals. Fun fact: the average size in the NHL is 6'1", 199.3lbs. That's the AVERAGE.

And BTW, when Kane won those cups, he was playing on a team with a lot of size and grit.

[Rick M.]

Originally Posted by Sandman

I've heard of him, but never got to see him play. I'm 46, may I ask how old you are?

I don’t know if it’s available online, but Jonathan’s fight with the much bigger tough guy, Bouchard of the Habs is legendary.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Savvy27

I'm not getting your point. You've established that he's small, but what is the implication of that? Is it that he's so small that they shouldn't even give him a chance?

If he proves doubters such as yourself then great. The team has another good player. Overall make up of the team too small? Not a problem, trade some of that small skill for more size up front.

Can't play? Too bad, I guess give Ritchie another shot. Is there a downside that I'm missing?

Philips is a very skilled offensive guy...no question.

So. knowing this, that requires he play an offensive role in the top 6, if not the top 3.

So where do you put him in?

There is zero chance you can plug him on the right side of 13/23, they need puck/board battling guys with size there (that also have a flair for scoring) as it is with JG unable to play that role that would waste his talents doing so.

So that leaves one option...on the right with 19/28, but that also now takes ice and demotes Mangiapane. Does that make any sense? Why should 88 take a hit? Has he not done everything the team has asked?

I know....lets play him on line 3 then....right? Great big guys when Bennett is C and Lucic on the left. OK...that now means Dube on line 1 (hasnt worked) or Dube on the 4th line which is a complete waste of what his talents provide. Nevermind the likely horrible fit that the Bennett/Lucic tandem would provide for Phillips game.

Bottom line is a guy that small has to have a certain size and skillset with him to provide him the best opportunity to succeed. There is just not a fit for him at this point as long as 13, 88, 29 are all on the roster.

Now if JG gets dealt this off-season as many suspect will happen, then yes MP will have a spot open up for him to try and earn. Right now though, he just isn't a fit. He is a smaller version of Tyler Ennis....would he be someone that would make a difference for the Flames?

The average NHL player is what....190 lbs? This guy, even if he has bulked up to 155....is giving away 35 lbs to every guy on every shift during every game on average. How effective will that be in contributing to linemates? Puck battles? I mean we watch JG get pushed off pucks and give them up literally 10 times a game as it is.

I like MP's game...a lot actually and I hope at some point he gets a shot. However if it isnt in the right spot with the right mix of guys, there is zero chance it will work. The NHL graveyard is littered with small uber offensive guys for a reason.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Sandman

I've heard of him, but never got to see him play. I'm 46, may I ask how old you are?

[Lanny_McDonald]

Tranny is right on the money. Phillips is a tiny guy. You have to pick your spots for him. With Gaudreau on the team it is hard to imagine another player smaller than him in the lineup. Where do you play him? Who does he bump? And please don't suggest he is bumping anyone with defensive or puck retrieval responsibilities because that is not his game. So for Phillips to get into the lineup that means you have to bump Mangipane or Dube on the second or third lines. Which of them do you take out of the lineup to accommodate Phillips?

[Sandman]

Phillips worries me a bit, because, while he’s a great skater, he doesn’t possess the slippery kind of elusiveness that Johnny has. He’s definitely improved quite a bit in this area, but I’ve been to training camp scrimmages, and seen him in pre-season games where he got knocked around a great deal, and a few times where he nearly got torqued. Johnny has a way of winning 50/50 battles with his stick, his edges, and his smarts.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Sandman

Phillips worries me a bit, because, while he’s a great skater, he doesn’t possess the slippery kind of elusiveness that Johnny has. He’s definitely improved quite a bit in this area, but I’ve been to training camp scrimmages, and seen him in pre-season games where he got knocked around a great deal, and a few times where he nearly got torqued. Johnny has a way of winning 50/50 battles with his stick, his edges, and his smarts.

In fact, you could argue that Johnny has gotten a little less elusive and a little less effective over the last year. He also has worn down a bit from the abuse he does inevitably take.

[Wolfman]

It's time to unleash Bubba

[Monahammer]

Bring up both Phillips and Ruzicka. They deserve it.

IMO we could use Ruzicka even more than Phillips.

[genetic_phreek]

All this talk about small guys and their inability to have puck retrieval from the boards is ridiculous. There's plenty of small guys that are great at board battles. On the other side there are big guys that are so weak on board battles. Not saying size doesn't add it's advantages but I'll take speed over size any day of the week.

[Hot_Flatus]

Originally Posted by Mitch

Agreed that bottom 6 needs to be shaken up but Phillips is definitely not the answer IMO. He would get bullied at his size.

To be quite honest, most of the NHL play has been glorified pre-season quality this season and I've seen no indication that there is any physical play in the league this year that would be a detriment to a guy like Philips playing over the clowns that currently comprise the fringes of the Flames roster.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Philips is a very skilled offensive guy...no question.

So. knowing this, that requires he play an offensive role in the top 6, if not the top 3.

So where do you put him in?

There is zero chance you can plug him on the right side of 13/23, they need puck/board battling guys with size there (that also have a flair for scoring) as it is with JG unable to play that role that would waste his talents doing so.

So that leaves one option...on the right with 19/28, but that also now takes ice and demotes Mangiapane. Does that make any sense? Why should 88 take a hit? Has he not done everything the team has asked?

I know....lets play him on line 3 then....right? Great big guys when Bennett is C and Lucic on the left. OK...that now means Dube on line 1 (hasnt worked) or Dube on the 4th line which is a complete waste of what his talents provide. Nevermind the likely horrible fit that the Bennett/Lucic tandem would provide for Phillips game.

Bottom line is a guy that small has to have a certain size and skillset with him to provide him the best opportunity to succeed. There is just not a fit for him at this point as long as 13, 88, 29 are all on the roster.

Now if JG gets dealt this off-season as many suspect will happen, then yes MP will have a spot open up for him to try and earn. Right now though, he just isn't a fit. He is a smaller version of Tyler Ennis....would he be someone that would make a difference for the Flames?

The average NHL player is what....190 lbs? This guy, even if he has bulked up to 155....is giving away 35 lbs to every guy on every shift during every game on average. How effective will that be in contributing to linemates? Puck battles? I mean we watch JG get pushed off pucks and give them up literally 10 times a game as it is.

I like MP's game...a lot actually and I hope at some point he gets a shot. However if it isnt in the right spot with the right mix of guys, there is zero chance it will work. The NHL graveyard is littered with small uber offensive guys for a reason.

This point only stands if you insist on having useless plugs in your 4th line.

Mangiapane started on the 4th line with Ryan and Hathaway under Peters and he had success there and it gave him an introduction to NHL hockey. But this team prioritized skill back then.

No reason you couldn't do the same thing now with Phillips, only problem is we insist on having Nordstrom and other grinders in the lineup for the 4th line.

Don't even have to change that much of the lineup, just tweak the lines from tonights game slightly.

Gaudreau - Monahan - Leivo
Tkachuk - Lindholm - Dube
Lucic - Backlund - Mangiapane

Top three from tonight remain untouched.

But I think a line of Bennett - Ryan - Phillips could be a lot more effective than Nordstrom-Ryan-Ritchie.

[Geeoff]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

This point only stands if you insist on having useless plugs in your 4th line.

Mangiapane started on the 4th line with Ryan and Hathaway under Peters and he had success there and it gave him an introduction to NHL hockey. But this team prioritized skill back then.

No reason you couldn't do the same thing now with Phillips, only problem is we insist on having Nordstrom and other grinders in the lineup for the 4th line.

Don't even have to change that much of the lineup, just tweak the lines from tonights game slightly.

Gaudreau - Monahan - Leivo
Tkachuk - Lindholm - Dube
Lucic - Backlund - Mangiapane

Top three from tonight remain untouched.

But I think a line of Bennett - Ryan - Phillips could be a lot more effective than Nordstrom-Ryan-Ritchie.

Leivo would look great on the top line...for the Heat

[djsFlames]

Ruzicka could be this year's Hathaway.

Phillips drives the net more than Gaudreau.

[Reggie Dunlop]

Not happening with Darryl Sutter. Sorry Bubba.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Yup, close this thread. Matthew Phillips career aspirations just got crushed in one hiring.

[SuperMatt18]

The only way it could happen is if Sutter uses Phillips similar to how Hartley used Byron.

If the guy who is 5.5" and weighs 150 pounds will go battle hard in the corner and in front of the net then there is no reason everyone else on the roster shouldn't be doing the same.

Phillips does play that type of style, he's small but he doesn't shy away from Physical play and isn't afraid of the dirty areas of the ice.

And I do think Byron used to drive that mentality for this group in the 14-15 season. He would go out and go to the dirty areas and then I think the rest of the guys get motivated to do it when you see the little guy doing it.

[Tkachukwagon]

I was playing around on the expansion draft simulator from Cap Friendly (it’s great by the way) and I realized that Phillips is expansion draft eligible.

https://www.capfriendly.com/expansion-draft/seattle

What type of season does Phillips need to have that Seattle may be interested? I’m sure they are more likely to take someone more established but if Phillips continues this heater in the AHL, he could draw some attention.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Tkachukwagon

I was playing around on the expansion draft simulator from Cap Friendly (it’s great by the way) and I realized that Phillips is expansion draft eligible.

https://www.capfriendly.com/expansion-draft/seattle

What type of season does Phillips need to have that Seattle may be interested? I’m sure they are more likely to take someone more established but if Phillips continues this heater in the AHL, he could draw some attention.

If the Flames have too expose Kylington or Bennett they are more obvious choices.

[Cycling76er]

The title of this thread needs to change. Every time I see it bumped I read it as "The Flames have recalled Matthew Phillips".