You can't compare players from different eras but you can compare them to their peers. Crosby has been great but he's only lead the league in scoring a few times and he's always been close to other top players in most stats every season.
Gretzky obliterated the competition.
For instance in 2006/7 Crosby score 120 points. Joe Thornton was next with 114 and Lecavalier third at 108.
In 1985/6 Gretzky score 215 points. Mario was second with 141 and Coffee was third with 138.
Gretzky was head and shoulders above his peers while Crosby was much closer to his peers.
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Gretzky and Lemieux would have scored 160-180 points in today's NHL in their prime.
Not as good of heights as they reached, but absolutely demolishing everyone else.
The talent level is simply not the same. Training can only do so much.
That season Lemieux came back, he was on pace for 145 points and over 110 the following seasons. In 00-01, only Jagr and Sakic had 100+ at 121 and 118 respectively. Those guys were in their prime as Crosby is now and he destroyed the pair. He was on pace for 66 goals that year. Only 3 had more than 45.
It was crazy.
Watching Lemieux was always an odd experience. He would glide around on his ankles, his stick way out in front of him, head on a swivel. The puck would be on his stick for an instant, he'd make some weird choppy motion and the puck would be in the net. The game moved so slowly for him - the closest I've ever seen a modern player come to Lemieux is Getzlaf - obviously not to the same degree, but every now and again, he does something that makes you sit up and go "That was very Mario".
His assist on the Kariya goal in 2002 remains the best fake in the history of the game. IMO.
Sorry for the music and lack of Bob Cole.
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I agree that nobody else is as good, although McDavid and Matthews are putting up a case for being in that conversation.
The whole NHL though is lacking in that upper tier of talent. There is no generational player right now. There is no Howe, Gretzky, Lemieux, Orr, Hasek, Roy or Dryden. That's not a slight towards anyone. They are supremely talented, but not quite as much as those others.
No. This is a common misconception, it isnt that its lacking in upper tier talent its that the gap in talent is much, much smaller.
Current AHLers are miles better than most of the bottom 6 players in the NHL from 1970-1990.
In Gretzky's day the bottom 6 players would be asking why there are knives on the bottom of their shoes.
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You can't compare players from different eras but you can compare them to their peers. Crosby has been great but he's only lead the league in scoring a few times and he's always been close to other top players in most stats every season.
Gretzky obliterated the competition.
For instance in 2006/7 Crosby score 120 points. Joe Thornton was next with 114 and Lecavalier third at 108.
In 1985/6 Gretzky score 215 points. Mario was second with 141 and Coffee was third with 138.
Gretzky was head and shoulders above his peers while Crosby was much closer to his peers.
In fairness to Mario, that was only his sophomore year. On a crappy team. Mike Bullard was the next highest scorer. And Moe Mantha was third! Gretzky had some decent teamates around him. Luckily, one of them was Steve Smith.
No. This is a common misconception, it isnt that its lacking in upper tier talent its that the gap in talent is much, much smaller.
Current AHLers are miles better than most of the bottom 6 players in the NHL from 1970-1990.
In Gretzky's day the bottom 6 players would be asking why there are knives on the bottom of their shoes.
Gretzky, Lemieux and Jagr were the only Art Ross winners for two decades. Regardless of era the gap between them and their elite peers (Sakic, yzerman) was greater than the gap now between Crosby and whoever the fourth best player in the league is.
So is this due to a compression of the talent gap or just a lack of talent gap.
If like you are saying that the bottom pairing / 3/4 liners were terrible than why weren't other players able to take advantage. Same as defensive systems why weren't the other stars as dominant as Gretzky, Lemieux and Jagr?
So to be it isn't just the quality of player and training that differentiates the elite Talent today from history.
One reason is that we could be worse at identifying and maximizing talent. The cash required to become a midget hockey player limits the pool of elite athletes who have a chance in the NHL. So rather than pulling from all kids on the frozen pond we only pull from upper middle class families.
If you want to see dominance in a modern era sport just look at Lebron James who still has a huge gap between him and the next best player.
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His whining would be just as good.
I remember his first year in the NHL with the Oilers. Gretzky was an in between periods TV guest and talked about how he, Lafluer and other star players at the time should get preferential treatment from the refs. Gretz didn't like to get hit and players around the league knew it.
In 1985/6 Gretzky score 215 points. Mario was second with 141 and Coffee was third with 138.
Coffey would have probably had around 70 points without Gretzky. Mario would have probably had around 30 more points, as a second year player, if he played on a team that didn't completely suck. Those two were on a different level than the rest of the league, it wasn't even close.
I think Gretzkys' hockey I.Q was blown out of the water. He was great for his time. He had more time and space . 75 % of the players where plugs.
His mind was ahead of his time . I think if he played today in his prime he would still be one of the best players in the game but only equal to todays best players.
Dmen don't just aim for the big hit any more and are much better skaters. Goalies don't play 15 feet out of the net, flop around as much and are 10x more athletic. He was fast for his time but there are lots of players who are just as fast and a dozen who are faster.
He dosnt get half the stats he did in todays game . No body traimed as hard as he did back then. Now every one is pretty much is in fantastic shape. I think him today in his prime would be equal to everyone else fitness wise.
Gretzky in his prime today if he trained into days nhl would be equal and consistently battling the likes of Crosby, Ovie and Stamkos. Equal but not a tier above them.
Hes not getting %60 of these poimts into days game even with the same training as todays players.
Last edited by combustiblefuel; 12-11-2017 at 06:47 PM.
Luckily, one of them was Steve Smith. 
