Training Camp Day 2 Notes

[gvitaly]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

He already earned it last year. He just did. I get Sutter is an incredible coach, but Pelletier is a top-5 AHL prospect there is.

I don't think think he has. Phillips deserves more of a spot than Pelletier, and so does Ruzicka. They were both more productive in the AHL. However it just shows you the level difference between the two leagues. Gawdin had a similar production to Pelletier but couldn't stick with the team.

I agree he is a top prospect in the AHL, but Emile Poirier seemed like a top prospect in the AHL after his first season. I just don't see the rational of simply giving Pelletier a spot on the team. If Jooris could have a great camp and make the team, then so can Pelletier if he's ready. So unless Pelletier does something to force his way onto this team he can stay in the AHL, and I don't think that will hinder his development.

[CroFlames]

I'm still waiting for the Kylington workout hype video like he did 2-3 years ago.

[Canada 02]

iirc from last years camp, Kirkland, Duehr and Mackey were among the last three cuts; they all started out in the second group, and earned games and practice time with the main group

This is Sutters' MO. It's your right to disagree with it, but nobody should be surprised by it

[stemit14]

Over the years seeing Sutter as a coach, he is very tough on younger players trying to make the team. This is not a criticism… it’s just how he likes to build his team. Older vets always have a much longer leash than young guys. This can be said of lots of coaches in the NHL but even more so with Sutter. It’s fine with a team trying to contend (like the flames are) but it would be frustrating with a younger team trying to rebuild.

Virtually every first overall pick makes their prospective NHL team right out of training camp… I honestly believe Sutter is likely the only coach in the league that would not do that. He’s just really tough with young players. In the long run, it can be good for the development of young players. But it would be tough sometimes as fans that want to see young guys make the team over older vets.




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[Flamesfan05]

I would say no rookie is going to make the club

I would even say Valimaki and Ruzicka would be lucky to make it to the starting roster and not waiver

[Kovaz]

I don't think Sutter believes in the concept of "earned it last year" no matter how good he was. If Pelletier is a no-brainer to make the team then he'll look like it in camp.

[Naitix]

I think this year we will see way more AHL players get play time with the big club. The roster looks very different, and it will take a while to find the right player combinations. There are no negatives in giving PTOs a first chance to impress, Pelletier will get his chance, he just might need to wait a bit and that's fine. As far as I remember, last night Sutter said that Pelletier will get 1 or 2 pre-season games

[Paulie Walnuts]

Kylington made the team last year and got top 4 ice time. He has said on many occasions that guys got gifted spots on the team, and he wants to change that. So its not surprise he's not slapping Pelletier on the 2nd line right away. We might not like it, but no sense complaining when we know the coach has stated that's not how he operates.

If Pelletier wants to make it he will have to stand out in his group and force his way onto the team.

[gvitaly]

Originally Posted by stemit14

Over the years seeing Sutter as a coach, he is very tough on younger players trying to make the team. This is not a criticism… it’s just how he likes to build his team. Older vets always have a much longer leash than young guys. This can be said of lots of coaches in the NHL but even more so with Sutter. It’s fine with a team trying to contend (like the flames are) but it would be frustrating with a younger team trying to rebuild.

Virtually every first overall pick makes their prospective NHL team right out of training camp… I honestly believe Sutter is likely the only coach in the league that would not do that. He’s just really tough with young players. In the long run, it can be good for the development of young players. But it would be tough sometimes as fans that want to see young guys make the team over older vets.




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In my opinion the main reason behind it is that a rookie can be better than veterans in spurts. However, as soon as the grind of the season sets in rookies often taper off, start making more mistakes, and lose their confidence. This applies to vets too, but they have the experience to limit the mistakes and the mental fatigue side of things. Again, that's just the way I see it.

[Flaming Horse]

Originally Posted by Goriders

That sucks. I was hoping to take my kids to one of the TC sessions. Not sure what the benefit is to closing practices all season. Teams will have game tape.

It is very frustrating and not right. This policy needs to change.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Reggie Dunlop

Bad PR move by the organization.

Do you really think so? How much appetite is there from the fanbase to attend practices? How much impact does this really have on the team's bottom-line?

I seriously doubt that this will have any effect at all. Most people are not that bothered about not seeing practices.

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[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

I would rather have fewer PTOs ...

Remember, minimum number of vets needed in pre-season games. You're already holding out Kadri and Tanev until the start of the year, so you're two vets down. Having two or three PTOs should not be a hindrance if you truly are a top prospect.

Chill...

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

I would rather have fewer PTOs ...

And more injuries to veteran players forced to play 6 of 8 preseason games to meet vet quotas?

No thanks!

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by gvitaly

I agree he is a top prospect in the AHL, but Emile Poirier seemed like a top prospect in the AHL after his first season.

Sorry to take this off the rails a bit, but these sorts of uninformed revisions of history are annoying. Poirier absolutely looked like a stud that first year, and the only reason he fell short was because of how deeply, tragically his personal life interfered with his hockey career. Since there is no reason to think that Pelletier is similarly plagued by his own demons, then I don't see how this is at all a relevant comparison.


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[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

Sorry to take this off the rails a bit, but these sorts of uninformed revisions of history are annoying. Poirier absolutely looked like a stud that first year, and the only reason he fell short was because of how deeply, tragically his personal life interfered with his hockey career. Since there is no reason to think that Pelletier is similarly plagued by his own demons, then I don't see how this is at all a relevant comparison.


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They're both French. How did you miss that?!

[KootenayFlamesFan]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1573361505730695168

[TheScorpion]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

Remember, minimum number of vets needed in pre-season games. You're already holding out Kadri and Tanev until the start of the year, so you're two vets down. Having two or three PTOs should not be a hindrance if you truly are a top prospect.

Chill...

Instead of expressing my counterargument, I'll defer to Arnold:

[Johnny Makarov]

Originally Posted by Electricprez

Iiiiiinteresting.
Dube clearly putting in the work.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1573342722593001472

thats nice and all but who were the unfittest Flames?

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

Do you really think so? How much appetite is there from the fanbase to attend practices? How much impact does this really have on the team's bottom-line?

I seriously doubt that this will have any effect at all. Most people are not that bothered about not seeing practices.

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It's not cool though. It most impacts younger fans who would enjoy seeing their idols play and may not otherwise be able to attend many games. I have fond memories of my Dad taking me to an occasional Flames or Stamps practice.

Is it going to have an impact on the organization in any meaningful way? No I don't imagine it will. But they're worried about the Oilers watching their training camp? Really? These aren't military secrets.

It is a bad move for a community minded club.

[joejoe3]

Originally Posted by stemit14

Over the years seeing Sutter as a coach, he is very tough on younger players trying to make the team. This is not a criticism… it’s just how he likes to build his team. Older vets always have a much longer leash than young guys. This can be said of lots of coaches in the NHL but even more so with Sutter. It’s fine with a team trying to contend (like the flames are) but it would be frustrating with a younger team trying to rebuild.

Virtually every first overall pick makes their prospective NHL team right out of training camp… I honestly believe Sutter is likely the only coach in the league that would not do that. He’s just really tough with young players. In the long run, it can be good for the development of young players. But it would be tough sometimes as fans that want to see young guys make the team over older vets.




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This is accurate, last year Sutter also mentioned some kids were rushed when they should've been in the AHL longer to build their game (I believe Dube was used as an example?)