Who was the other team that offer sheeted RoR back in 2013?

[Calgary4LIfe]

Originally Posted by CaptainYooh

Exactly. NOT picking Monahan was not in cards. Even with this forum’s collective very limited knowledge, Monahan was clearly a poll winner to be picked over Lindholm. If anything, Feaster did a lot more damage than good trading away Iginla and Bouwmester for the first round picks that turned out wasted on bad choices and for the lame prospects he was able to get along. No doubt, our scouting team f...ed up big time then (as they have been for the past 20 years), but Feaster, as a GM gets to share the biggest blame for that year.

As for Gaudreau - easy to credit Feaster now, but if he or anyone else had clearly seen Johnny’s potential then, Gaudreau would have been picked much much earlier. They didn’t. Pure luck. More like a Datsyuk or Zetterberg situation.

Not necessarily.


It is fairly well known now that the Flames try and figure out who is interested in certain prospects, and try to guess at where they will be taken.



Of course, if they were 100% sure of Gaudreau's development, he probably would have been taken higher by the Flames, but the Flames were very high on him (and Kucherov). Button was thinking that Kucherov would have fallen to the 4th round, but once he got selected, he told Feaster that Gaudreau has to be selected with their next pick.


The same kind of thing with Jankowski. Flames wanted Jankowski long before draft day. Flames had often multiple scouts in attendance at his games, and they kept an eye out for how much other teams liked him. Apparently, that is why they felt comfortable dropping down in the draft and recouping a 2nd round pick, but they didn't want to drop down further in the round. Montreal, New Jersey and I believe Florida were the three other teams that showed a lot of interest in Jankowski (though I may be misremembering here).



I remember Weisbrod talking about the Culkin and Kulak picks, and how they personally had them in reverse order of how they were picked, and their reasoning was that they noticed some teams showing a lot of interest in one of them. They gambled that they could select both, and they got them both.

[SeanCharles]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

I would trade Monahan, Lindholm, Lazar, Poirier, Shinkaruk, and Klimchuk for Nathan MacKinnon. He's an elite talent.

The trade offer was for our 1st round picks so Monahan, Poirier and Klimchuk for Mackinnon which I think I would do as Mackinnon is going to be a superstar for many years.

But throwing Lindholm into the equation just to make a point.. I don't think that's fair.. I think having both Monahan and Lindholm could arguably be more valuable than having just Mackinnon.

Monahan and Mackinnon are the top 2 point producers from that draft with Monahan the top goal scorer.

Lindholm has the 4th most points after Barkov.

I love Mackinnon but I just don't know if its fair to make your original statement as Monahan is an elite goal scorer and could conceivably remain the best goal scorer from that draft. Mac has an all around elite skillset so he gets an edge but when you toss in another top 6 player that plays center and RW? I dunno.

I just think it's not as cut and dry as you perceive it to be.

[powderjunkie]

The Flames were never losing everything in this mess. Unless the NHL actually wanted the team to re-locate.

[activeStick]

Originally Posted by d_phaneuf

Dont think they had the picks

The compensation was a first and a third, which the Canucks had at the time of the offer sheet in February.

[Jacks]

I don't think Feaster was a great GM, he wasn't even a good GM but he certainly wasn't the worst we've had. He inherited a fairly disfunctional team full of aging vets on bad contracts (with lots of trade clauses) and a pretty mediocre prospect pool. He cleared out the bad contracts and over the hill players, made some good signings (Hudler, Wideman before he sucked) and loaded up the prospect pipeline. If he hadn't done that groundwork then Treliving wouldn't have been able to do the work he's done, Treliving inherited a pretty clean slate. Feaster made a few mistakes along the way and 2 big near misses but he left the team in much better shape then he found it so I just think he deserves a bit of credit, or at least a little less abuse.

[getbak]

Here's the thread from when the signing was made: https://forum.calgarypuck.com/showthread.php?t=125301


MMF nails it...

Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm

Hopefully the Flames can use the draft pick on a guy that gets 50+ points by the age of 21.

Yup, they definitely blew that out of the water. Monahan had 50+ goals before his 21st birthday.



At the time, it was reported that it was Vancouver who had given the other offer, but it was later denied by their GM...

Originally Posted by JurassicTunga12

Vancouver Canucks also issued an offer-sheet but O'Reilly signed the Flames one instead.

Dan Tencer ‏@dantencer
Sportsnet 960 Calgary reports that the Vancouver Canucks also issued an offer sheet to Ryan O'Reilly.

[IamNotKenKing]

Originally Posted by Johnny Makarov

With Jay we almost lost Monahan for a guy who couldn't play in the NHL for the rest of that year! Thank god the Avs matched.

Didn't he also want to trade every pick in that draft for MacKinnon?

This. Never. Would. Have. Happened.
Give it a rest.
The Feaster MOU interpretation was correct, as written, hence the change in the actual CBA, to what was meant.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by Jacks

I don't think Feaster was a great GM, he wasn't even a good GM but he certainly wasn't the worst we've had. He inherited a fairly disfunctional team full of aging vets on bad contracts (with lots of trade clauses) and a pretty mediocre prospect pool. He cleared out the bad contracts and over the hill players, made some good signings (Hudler, Wideman before he sucked) and loaded up the prospect pipeline. If he hadn't done that groundwork then Treliving wouldn't have been able to do the work he's done, Treliving inherited a pretty clean slate. Feaster made a few mistakes along the way and 2 big near misses but he left the team in much better shape then he found it so I just think he deserves a bit of credit, or at least a little less abuse.

There is no doubt Feaster took the job at a bad time and was dealt a poor hand. The mandate was to still try and win so he wasn’t allowed to tear it down until Iggy was in his last year.

Hudler proved to be his best free agent signing and might be the best Flames free agent signing in recent memory. Wideman was a bad contract the day it was signed. Fortunately he did have one excellent year in the 5.

Clean slate? He made bad trades for our 2 biggest contracts and our third biggest retired. He inherited a team that would fight for a playoff spot and turned them into a bottom 5 roster.

This team would still be paying Brad Richards $7M if Feaster got his way.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by getbak

Here's the thread from when the signing was made: https://forum.calgarypuck.com/showthread.php?t=125301


MMF nails it...

Yup, they definitely blew that out of the water. Monahan had 50+ goals before his 21st birthday.



At the time, it was reported that it was Vancouver who had given the other offer, but it was later denied by their GM...

Interesting he chose the Flames over the Canucks but at the time he would be the Flames 1C and the Canucks 3C. Vancouver was a 2x Presidents trophy winner the year the offer sheet was signed.

[CaptainYooh]

Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen

https://forum.calgarypuck.com/showth...light=lindholm

Coin toss, Lindholm with slightly more votes.

This one was close, yeah. I clearly recall an overwhelming voting advantage towards Monahan. Could be the beginning of this one or I could be thinking of a different poll, where we were voting on the overall draft pick preferences. There were a few with all of the excitement about the three first rounders.

[Krynn]

From what I remember,there was like at least 6 or 6

7 teams that had the same understanding as the flames did in the whole RoR situation

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

Hucker proved to be his best free agent signing

OK, I'm drawing a blank. Who was Hucker?

[MrMike]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

Interesting he chose the Flames over the Canucks but at the time he would be the Flames 1C and the Canucks 3C. Vancouver was a 2x Presidents trophy winner the year the offer sheet was signed.

The way we structured the deal was so after his second year in his RFAyear he would have had to be at least qualified with something like 6 million a year, so I’m sure that’s why he went with that offer.

[Gaskal]

I'm going to guess it was Kevin Lowe encouraging Steve Tambellini to be his puppet moron.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

OK, I'm drawing a blank. Who was Hucker?

I'm guessing Hudler.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by IamNotKenKing

This. Never. Would. Have. Happened.
Give it a rest.
The Feaster MOU interpretation was correct, as written, hence the change in the actual CBA, to what was meant.

The league said it was incorrect. The fact they changed it doesn't mean they agreed with Feaster. It means they wanted to avoid the situation. So the best case scenario is that Feaster had to go to an arbitrator (Bettman) to get a ruling and then appeal that.

Maybe a prudent GM would have checked out his interpretation with the league. Just like accountants can check an interpretation on a tax issue with CRA.

Feaster' explanation that he had a different interpretation always smelled like backfilling to me.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

There is no doubt Feaster took the job at a bad time and was dealt a poor hand. The mandate was to still try and win so he wasn’t allowed to tear it down until Iggy was in his last year.

Hucker proved to be his best free agent signing and might be the best Flames free agent signing in recent memory. Wideman was a bad contract the day it was signed. Fortunately he did have one excellent year in the 5.

Clean slate? He made bad trades for our 2 biggest contracts and our third biggest retired. He inherited a team that would fight for a playoff spot and turned them into a bottom 5 roster.

This team would still be paying Brad Richards $7M if Feaster got his way.

This.

I can forgive all the other Feaster moves in hindsight, but if he actually managed to sign Richards to that 10 year contract, well, that would have been unforgivable. I remember hearing the proposal thinking "This isn't going to work out the way he wants". Either way, I was right.

[FireGilbert]

This agent of ROR seems like a bit of a dick. He gives us a hint of something interesting and then says nope I'm never going to tell neener neener. Not to mention the entire thing is causing CP to argue over Feaster when there are far more interesting things to argue over.

[stang]

Originally Posted by IamNotKenKing

This. Never. Would. Have. Happened.
Give it a rest.
The Feaster MOU interpretation was correct, as written, hence the change in the actual CBA, to what was meant.

https://www.nhl.com/news/oreilly-off...lames/c-658088

I don’t know about that.

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by CaptainYooh

This one was close, yeah. I clearly recall an overwhelming voting advantage towards Monahan. Could be the beginning of this one or I could be thinking of a different poll, where we were voting on the overall draft pick preferences. There were a few with all of the excitement about the three first rounders.

There was never an overwhelming voting advantage for Monahan over Lindholm.

Unless you're confused by a poll like this:
https://forum.calgarypuck.com/poll.p...lts&pollid=857
Where Monahan was the huge favourite...because the top 5 picks were off the table.

The general consensus at the draft was the big 4 (or big 3 + Barkov) and then Lindholm and Monahan at 5/6 with Nuchishkin a wildcard. Lindholm, being the generally more consensus top 5 pick was often leading (slightly) by Flames fans at the time.

Here's a blog that hasn't held up the best but was not that uncommon of opinion at the time.
https://flamesnation.ca/2013/05/13/r...omment-page-1/

If MacKinnon, Jones, Barkov, Drouin and Lindholm all go in the top-5, the only apparently remarkable talent who will be left on the board is Valery Nichushkin
...
if the big-5 are gone by 6, the Flames likely drop down to the obvious second tier of talent populated by guys like Sean Monahan, Hunter Shinkaruk, Darnell Nurse, etc.