Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community
Old 09-14-2017, 03:32 PM   #2441
dammage79
Franchise Player
 
dammage79's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Calgary
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinny01 View Post
Depends what people really think of Fox.

Also how many teams can take on $6M while sending back less than $2M?

At the end of the day I think a team like Nashvillemor Montreal or Columbus will cough up the pieces the Avs want. Flames can't offer much more than prospects at this point

Duchene also scored 30 goals once, had 41pts last year and only has 2 years left on his deal. He is not worth what the Avs are asking.
41 point on that team is a big deal. That was the hottest garbage I've ever seen. And I watched the Oilers under Eakins.

I agree with Fox. I think his value is high around the league even if he is still a magic bean. Flames would have to compensate the Avs by sending some cap space over. So an extra assets on top of what I would assume would be a Brouwer or Stajan. With Stajan the most likely since Jankowski is literally kicking down the door.
dammage79 is online now  
Old 09-14-2017, 03:33 PM   #2442
Vinny01
Franchise Player
 
Vinny01's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: CGY
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoJetsGo View Post
That may be true, but that's still an extremely underwhelming offer you just put together. It was Ferland and two question marks. No chance that gets it done, and as I said, could easily be out-matched by a multitude of other teams.
Flames sent 3 question marks to the Bruins for Dougie and the isles for Hamonic. Fox is quickly becoming one of the best D prospects not in the NHL. Gillies is closer to making it in the league than many other prospects and Ferland is still full of potential. All the While the Avs save $4.25M each of the next 2 years.
Vinny01 is offline  
Old 09-14-2017, 03:35 PM   #2443
GoJetsGo
Lifetime Suspension
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Exp:
Default

I think the real problem in landing Duchene is our lack of picks in the next couple drafts and our unwillingness to give up young core pieces the Avs would likely want.

I just don't see a piece like Ferland (as good as I think he is) and a couple of prospects coming close to getting it done with what several other teams can offer.

Fair or not, the Avs are likely asking for the moon.
GoJetsGo is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to GoJetsGo For This Useful Post:
Old 09-14-2017, 03:36 PM   #2444
GoJetsGo
Lifetime Suspension
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinny01 View Post
Flames sent 3 question marks to the Bruins for Dougie and the isles for Hamonic. Fox is quickly becoming one of the best D prospects not in the NHL. Gillies is closer to making it in the league than many other prospects and Ferland is still full of potential. All the While the Avs save $4.25M each of the next 2 years.
Those were all high picks, of which we have none in the next few years.

I know all about Fox. He's still a ways away from cracking a roster if he ever does. It's still a very underwhelming proposal.
GoJetsGo is offline  
Old 09-14-2017, 03:36 PM   #2445
Vinny01
Franchise Player
 
Vinny01's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: CGY
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by dammage79 View Post
41 point on that team is a big deal. That was the hottest garbage I've ever seen. And I watched the Oilers under Eakins.

I agree with Fox. I think his value is high around the league even if he is still a magic bean. Flames would have to compensate the Avs by sending some cap space over. So an extra assets on top of what I would assume would be a Brouwer or Stajan. With Stajan the most likely since Jankowski is literally kicking down the door.
Both Stajan and Brouwer have trade protection that likely blocks a move to the Avs.

If the Flames sent Ferland's $1.75M they could squeeze in the $6M on Duchene correct?


Treliving stated goal scoring was going to keep him up at night. Duchene is the best goal scorer on the trade market. No doubt he is staying close to it.

Lastly the Avs have had a weird affinity with Flames players under Sakic. Perhaps that overvaluing would continue in this deal?
Vinny01 is offline  
Old 09-14-2017, 03:37 PM   #2446
Poe969
Franchise Player
 
Poe969's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Thunder Bay Ontario
Exp:
Default

At this point it's not about value or what team can outmatch the other. It's about what GM can whisper in Sakic's ear. Sakic has shown that he isn't a GM so he can probably be convinced to do whatever. I like our chances.
__________________
Poe969 is offline  
Old 09-14-2017, 03:38 PM   #2447
calumniate
Franchise Player
 
calumniate's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: A small painted room
Exp:
Default

Not sure where to put this - MacArthur fails his medical.. maybe not a good thing even after 3 months rest?

http://www.tsn.ca/senators-macarthur...dical-1.856648
calumniate is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to calumniate For This Useful Post:
Old 09-14-2017, 03:39 PM   #2448
dammage79
Franchise Player
 
dammage79's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Calgary
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinny01 View Post
Both Stajan and Brouwer have trade protection that likely blocks a move to the Avs.

If the Flames sent Ferland's $1.75M they could squeeze in the $6M on Duchene correct?


Treliving stated goal scoring was going to keep him up at night. Duchene is the best goal scorer on the trade market. No doubt he is staying close to it.

Lastly the Avs have had a weird affinity with Flames players under Sakic. Perhaps that overvaluing would continue in this deal?
Maybe for Brouwer but Stajan would waive I think. There's an increased role for him there.
dammage79 is online now  
Old 09-14-2017, 03:40 PM   #2449
Vinny01
Franchise Player
 
Vinny01's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: CGY
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoJetsGo View Post
Those were all high picks, of which we have none in the next few years.

I know all about Fox. He's still a ways away from cracking a roster if he ever does. It's still a very underwhelming proposal.
Agree to disagree. I don't think the Avs want picks for Duchene and a team is not giving up an elite prospect for him.
Vinny01 is offline  
Old 09-14-2017, 03:44 PM   #2450
calgaryblood
Lifetime Suspension
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Hmmmmmmm
Exp:
Default

I hate agreeing with GoJetsGo but the Avs would seriously hang up the phone and laugh at Ferland, Fox, and Gillies for Duchene. A third line RWer and two long shot prospects for Duchene?

If that's all it took they'd have traded him long time ago.
calgaryblood is offline  
Old 09-14-2017, 03:49 PM   #2451
GoJetsGo
Lifetime Suspension
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinny01 View Post
Agree to disagree. I don't think the Avs want picks for Duchene and a team is not giving up an elite prospect for him.
I think a first is very likely to be a part of the deal, in addition to another valuable piece or pieces, all of which will likely be more established than Ferland/Fox Gillies. Agree to disagree indeed, as I said... that is a very underwhelming offer.
GoJetsGo is offline  
Old 09-14-2017, 03:58 PM   #2452
Poe969
Franchise Player
 
Poe969's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Thunder Bay Ontario
Exp:
Default

I guess it depends on point of view. As time goes on, I think the value goes down and Sakic takes less. Maybe everyone else made offers and he said no and they moved on so now he's stuck holding the grenade. I"m willing to bet he gets a lot less than what most think.
__________________
Poe969 is offline  
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Poe969 For This Useful Post:
Old 09-14-2017, 04:21 PM   #2453
Vinny01
Franchise Player
 
Vinny01's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: CGY
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by calgaryblood View Post
I hate agreeing with GoJetsGo but the Avs would seriously hang up the phone and laugh at Ferland, Fox, and Gillies for Duchene. A third line RWer and two long shot prospects for Duchene?

If that's all it took they'd have traded him long time ago.
Fox can be swapped with any Flames D prospect Valimaki included. To say he is a long shot is underrated how high his stock has risen since being drafted.

3rd line winger and 2 long shot prospects. One way to spin it.

I can say a 6'2 25 year old winger signed for less than $2M who is big, mean, and has an elite shot. Ended the season on the first line. In addition they are getting a Dman who has the best ppg in the NCAA since Leetch and has performed well internationally for the US. Lastly a 6'5 goalie who rode incredible numbers to a national championship in the NCAA and had a very nice first pro season after recovering from injury.

My spin is over the top but yours sells the players short.

Again I have no idea what Aakic will take. He has overplayed his hand so I am very interested to seeing what he gets.
Vinny01 is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to Vinny01 For This Useful Post:
Old 09-14-2017, 04:24 PM   #2454
TheFlamesVan
Retired
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Back in Guelph
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by calgaryblood View Post
I hate agreeing with GoJetsGo but the Avs would seriously hang up the phone and laugh at Ferland, Fox, and Gillies for Duchene. A third line RWer and two long shot prospects for Duchene?

If that's all it took they'd have traded him long time ago.
Speaking of things to laugh at.
TheFlamesVan is offline  
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to TheFlamesVan For This Useful Post:
Old 09-14-2017, 04:28 PM   #2455
Vinny01
Franchise Player
 
Vinny01's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: CGY
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoJetsGo View Post
I think a first is very likely to be a part of the deal, in addition to another valuable piece or pieces, all of which will likely be more established than Ferland/Fox Gillies. Agree to disagree indeed, as I said... that is a very underwhelming offer.
I wouldn't trade Fox for a 1st round pick in the 21-31 range.

I am interested to see what team coughs up more valuable pieces to land a player that is a UFA in 2 years coming off a terrible season.

Flames are sending a possible starting goalie and top 4 D and a wongernwith top 6 upside. Also $8.5M of cash savings over the next 2 years.
Vinny01 is offline  
Old 09-14-2017, 04:41 PM   #2456
GoJetsGo
Lifetime Suspension
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinny01 View Post
I wouldn't trade Fox for a 1st round pick in the 21-31 range.

I am interested to see what team coughs up more valuable pieces to land a player that is a UFA in 2 years coming off a terrible season.

Flames are sending a possible starting goalie and top 4 D and a wongernwith top 6 upside. Also $8.5M of cash savings over the next 2 years.
There's really no point in discussing it any further when you label a prospect like Fox who has no pro experience a top four like that's what he should be valued at in a trade. It just doesn't work that way. Gillies had an average season in the AHL as much as I like him. He's far from being valued as a potential starter at this point.

Every team has players in their system like this they're high on.

Whether or not you'd trade Fox for a first round pick is irrelevant. I said there are teams that can beat that offer (player wise) *in addition to* a first. We can't do that.

It's really pie in the sky at this point unless something out of left field happens. Which I'll say, is where that Ferland / Fox / Gillies offer situates.

Last edited by GoJetsGo; 09-14-2017 at 04:45 PM.
GoJetsGo is offline  
Old 09-14-2017, 04:49 PM   #2457
Samonadreau
First Line Centre
 
Samonadreau's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: North
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFlamesVan View Post
Speaking of things to laugh at.
Hey man, i love Ferland as much as anybody but this is the year he can prove hes a top 6 winger. Up till now hes proven hes about a 3rd liner (with lots of potential). Hence getting 1.75m/per

Last edited by Samonadreau; 09-14-2017 at 05:25 PM.
Samonadreau is offline  
The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to Samonadreau For This Useful Post:
Old 09-14-2017, 04:55 PM   #2458
Jiri Hrdina
Moderator
 
Jiri Hrdina's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Exp:
Default

I'd be all in on buying low on Duschene if you actually are able to buy low on him. If the Avs want a price that reflects his potential and not his actual performance then it would not make sense. I'd also have to learn how to spell his name correctly - so there's that.
Jiri Hrdina is offline  
Old 09-14-2017, 04:59 PM   #2459
GreenLantern2814
Franchise Player
 
GreenLantern2814's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFlamesVan View Post
Speaking of things to laugh at.
Until Ferland puts up offensive numbers away from the two highest-paid players on the team, he's just that - a 3rd line winger. I love Ferly and everything he brings, but he might as well be Joe Colborne for all the offense he generates by himself.
GreenLantern2814 is offline  
Old 09-14-2017, 05:03 PM   #2460
Snuffleupagus
Powerplay Quarterback
 
Snuffleupagus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Exp:
Default

Backlund and Brodie

For

Duchene, 2018 2nd, 2019 1st

Snuffleupagus is offline  
Closed Thread

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:08 AM.

Calgary Flames
2017-18




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright Calgarypuck 2016