Survivor 40 - Winners at War

[Barnes]

I don’t mind it but I also would prefer Jeff to be able to have a discussion with the Survivors. That can’t happen if 3/4 of them aren’t listening.

Maybe it should be the survivors can ask for a sidebar and if it’s granted can get up and whisper.

If you do it during the questioning what you say is fair game for Jeff to question you about it.

Also, it would be incredibly frustrating for the jury. This is the only time they are able to see the tribe interact.

[CaptainCrunch]

Maybe treat scrums like poker where you get one time out during tribal, that's it, and you can only select one person to talk to on the time out.


I guess I'm old, but one of the things that I miss about this show that before the game shifted to this whole voting block, loyalty jumps in terms of padding resumes, there were some great calculating players who could see ahead two or three moves in a row.


Richard Hatch had his game figured out after one period of observing, he knew who he could use, who he could play, who were the weak points in his alliance.


When Amber won, she was very much the same, you could see her going through variables in her mind.


Pavarti formed the Black Widows early on and was planning who they were targeting days in advance.


Survivor was a game of chess. Now its a game of checkers with a lot of flailing and making big moves not for long term strategic considerations but to build a resume.


The only guy that came close to touching on that bought up that Jeremy would be death in front of a jury.



All of the other players are so random and deceitful that its 50/50 that the person that they're sending to the jury is a vote in play anymore.


I mean Ben is in the game, but he's out of the running to win anything, his game is awful. Tony has done a good job on outplay and outlast, but again he's so erratic and he's drawing a big target on his back, and last night he let out that he had a idol, there's no way that a smart group of players isn't going to do everything possible to draw that out.



The game has become so random and chaotic and the players just short sighted. The real thoughtful strategic players are gone, replaced by resume padders and chaotic evil players that don't have a plan.

[Weitz]

I think you romanticized the game a little too much. A lot of the older seasons were pretty boring because everyone just sort of plodded along. There was what a couple exciting moments in each season total? There was barely any excitement. I think part of what you see changing is encouraged by producers because they want the show to stay relevant.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

Maybe treat scrums like poker where you get one time out during tribal, that's it, and you can only select one person to talk to on the time out.


I guess I'm old, but one of the things that I miss about this show that before the game shifted to this whole voting block, loyalty jumps in terms of padding resumes, there were some great calculating players who could see ahead two or three moves in a row.


Richard Hatch had his game figured out after one period of observing, he knew who he could use, who he could play, who were the weak points in his alliance.


When Amber won, she was very much the same, you could see her going through variables in her mind.


Pavarti formed the Black Widows early on and was planning who they were targeting days in advance.


Survivor was a game of chess. Now its a game of checkers with a lot of flailing and making big moves not for long term strategic considerations but to build a resume.


The only guy that came close to touching on that bought up that Jeremy would be death in front of a jury.



All of the other players are so random and deceitful that its 50/50 that the person that they're sending to the jury is a vote in play anymore.


I mean Ben is in the game, but he's out of the running to win anything, his game is awful. Tony has done a good job on outplay and outlast, but again he's so erratic and he's drawing a big target on his back, and last night he let out that he had a idol, there's no way that a smart group of players isn't going to do everything possible to draw that out.



The game has become so random and chaotic and the players just short sighted. The real thoughtful strategic players are gone, replaced by resume padders and chaotic evil players that don't have a plan.

I actually think the main part of this is the production side factors that are introduced into the game.

An early tribe swap into 3 tribes to shake things up makes long term planning complicated and unnecessary.

Exile Island limits the finality and removes 'blood' from people's hands. By removing that element it lowers the threat level for people back at camp. It used to be if you demonstrated that much power at a tribal, the time back at camp afterwards would have everyone identifying how threatening you were. You used to see someone wield power at a tribal and then have someone in their alliance targeted at the next one as a result. Not as revenge, but to damage that person's power.

After Tony's last tribal, and the rest of the tribe being able to hear him and Sarah talking afterwards, Sarah should've been target #1 for the rest of the tribe after Tony won immunity, if only to damage Tony's numbers.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

I actually think the main part of this is the production side factors that are introduced into the game.

An early tribe swap into 3 tribes to shake things up makes long term planning complicated and unnecessary.

Exile Island limits the finality and removes 'blood' from people's hands. By removing that element it lowers the threat level for people back at camp. It used to be if you demonstrated that much power at a tribal, the time back at camp afterwards would have everyone identifying how threatening you were. You used to see someone wield power at a tribal and then have someone in their alliance targeted at the next one as a result. Not as revenge, but to damage that person's power.

After Tony's last tribal, and the rest of the tribe being able to hear him and Sarah talking afterwards, Sarah should've been target #1 for the rest of the tribe after Tony won immunity, if only to damage Tony's numbers.

Yeah, I agree, things like adding fire tokens, exile island, and all of the other stuff like hidden immunity idols changed the game monumentally.



And they were idiots to not go after Sarah, As Rob said, Tony is the boss and everyone knows it, his alliance is the strategic vote. Not only would voting her out damaged Tony's alliances and games, but on top of it, after hearing that fight everyone would know that Sarah would be toxic to Tony on the jury. It would have been a double win, and if anyone was suspicious of Tony having another idol, it would have drawn it into play leaving him exposed for next week.


Like I said for the most part, the current survivors aren't great strategic players. There are also some incredibly bad players dragging their way through because of the last minute scrambling that's happening.



Though in hind sight, if I was playing this game, I would absolutely want Ben facing the jury with me, the guy has a completely F'd up social game has no strategic game, and couldn't think his way out of a room with an open door and three open windows.

[calgarybornnraised]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

Yeah, I agree, things like adding fire tokens, exile island, and all of the other stuff like hidden immunity idols changed the game monumentally.



And they were idiots to not go after Sarah, As Rob said, Tony is the boss and everyone knows it, his alliance is the strategic vote. Not only would voting her out damaged Tony's alliances and games, but on top of it, after hearing that fight everyone would know that Sarah would be toxic to Tony on the jury. It would have been a double win, and if anyone was suspicious of Tony having another idol, it would have drawn it into play leaving him exposed for next week.


Like I said for the most part, the current survivors aren't great strategic players. There are also some incredibly bad players dragging their way through because of the last minute scrambling that's happening.



Though in hind sight, if I was playing this game, I would absolutely want Ben facing the jury with me, the guy has a completely F'd up social game has no strategic game, and couldn't think his way out of a room with an open door and three open windows.

Thanking you for calling out Ben. What a whiny bitch.

[Weitz]

His dumb look after the vote was great though

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by calgarybornnraised

Thanking you for calling out Ben. What a whiny bitch.

I don't know the guy, I don't remember him winning, but for some reason, I just have a irrational hatred for him.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

I don't know the guy, I don't remember him winning, but for some reason, I just have a irrational hatred for him.

it's because you don't support the troops

[CaptainCrunch]

Yer just mean Flash

[Cheese]

2 hour episode tonight, make sure you have the VCR programmed correctly to record.

[CMPunk]

Originally Posted by Cheese

2 hour episode tonight, make sure you have the VCR programmed correctly to record.

You are old

[mile]

Tony still has 0 votes cast against him. Amazing how him and Sarah have put themselves in a position to be the swing votes each time, people are still coming to them instead of trying to vote against them.

I hope the EOE returnee doesn't gonna win the game. A repeat from season 38 occurring for an amazing season like this one would be a travesty.

[KootenayFlamesFan]

I’m confused with the game Denise is playing. I guess she thinks she can make it to the final 3 somehow out of the 4 running the show. She won’t beat Tony. She might beat Sara. She can beat Ben. But if she would have somehow aligned with Michele and Nick she would easily beat both of them. Just seems like an easier path for her, especially when Jeremy was still around to have the numbers. She seems like she’s in no-mans land right now. I kinda hope Sophie is the one to return, mainly since she is tight with Sara we would see some fireworks between her and Tony.

[Cheese]

Bigtmac19, savardandjokinen and Weitz all get the golden boot from last nights double elimination.

[GreenLantern]

I didn't mind the guy who won his season returning from EOE. He had the whole I survived there thing going on, which obviously those on the jury who were there with you can sympathize to.. however he pulled one of the ballsiest moves in Survivor history by putting himself on the line to win that fire challenge. Had he not done that, he didn't deserve to win, knowing he had to do that to deserve to win is what won him the game, beyond the simple fact he even did it. He was able to articulate this well to the jury which just furthered his knowledge/love for the game and ultimately won him the season. I think in a stronger season though he wouldn't have, which is what we have right now. The strongest season (arguably) of Survivor history.. and ya I just can't see an EOE person coming in and winning this one. Unless they are sitting next to just Michelle.. and maybe Ben, because Ben has pissed off a lot of people lol.

[savardandjokinen]

I really hope Tony wins. He's been my favorite player since Cagayan. I didn't think he had a shot this season based on his target level and the type of player he is. He doesn't have a single vote against him, he's won 3 immunities, has an idol, he's gotten rid of the people who have tried coming for him/his personal threats, and yet no one wants him out. To play at this caliber in the biggest season of all time is crazy. To me if he wins this season there's no debate on who the GOAT of survivor is.

[Weitz]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern

I didn't mind the guy who won his season returning from EOE. He had the whole I survived there thing going on, which obviously those on the jury who were there with you can sympathize to.. however he pulled one of the ballsiest moves in Survivor history by putting himself on the line to win that fire challenge. Had he not done that, he didn't deserve to win, knowing he had to do that to deserve to win is what won him the game, beyond the simple fact he even did it. He was able to articulate this well to the jury which just furthered his knowledge/love for the game and ultimately won him the season. I think in a stronger season though he wouldn't have, which is what we have right now. The strongest season (arguably) of Survivor history.. and ya I just can't see an EOE person coming in and winning this one. Unless they are sitting next to just Michelle.. and maybe Ben, because Ben has pissed off a lot of people lol.

Pretty sure whoever comes back is going right away with a strong 4.

It’s basically a given whoever gets back in wins at the end if tony isn’t there.

Also the whole edge of extinction is flawed and stupid. The first person voted out has the best chance to get back in? So dumb.

[CaptainCrunch]

Ok, Michele has kind of grown on me, she's a fighter, and she's playing hard.

[Fuzz]

This was a 2 hour episode of Nick's slow motion suicide. What a dummy.