Sam Bennett Value: Have the Flames held on TOO long? OR is he awesome?

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

One major reason Peters likes Ryan on the PP is that he is a good guy on faceoffs, and your odds of succeeding increase if you start with the puck.

So it is not as simple as who is playing better.

If Sam works on this and becomes consistently strong on faceoffs, he has a better chance of getting that time

Sam actually is a strong face-off guy. He could take left side draws, or Backlund could - and Czarnik could take the right side draws.

Clearly winning face offs with Ryan isn’t doing anything for PP2 so far this year.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Sam actually is a strong face-off guy. He could take left side draws, or Backlund could - and Czarnik could take the right side draws.

Clearly winning face offs with Ryan isn’t doing anything for PP2 so far this year.

Depends what you mean by strong. Average (50 percent) or above, say 55+

I agree on Ryan not being enough of an overall offensive threat. Career, he is over 55 percent on draws, and Peters trusts him.

Sam has one decent year on faceoffs which, on the positive side was last year, but that was 54% on only 219 faceoffs all year

Backlund is generally around but not over 50 percent and Czarnik as well. These guys are fine but not great

Your main point I agree with. Comparing what amounts to an extra draw here or there versus a player who is a stronger offensive threat, I would rather see the better player

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

One major reason Peters likes Ryan on the PP is that he is a good guy on faceoffs, and your odds of succeeding increase if you start with the puck.

So it is not as simple as who is playing better.

If Sam works on this and becomes consistently strong on faceoffs, he has a better chance of getting that time

Bennett was the Flames best face off guy last year of guys that took a good chunk of draws. He was 54.3% on 219 draws (Versteeg was 59% on 78 draws). Stajan and Monahan were back 2.5 to 3%.

[David Struch]

Things haven't exactly been going Sam's way lately. A couple goal posts on Bennett's most recent chances and last nights uninspiring attempt on the break away and penalty shot.

His confidence is shattered here, I really think he needs a change, whole new team and line mates. He could be a producing top six left winger on many other teams with a change of scenery.

[EVERLAST]

∆∆yes. I love Bennett but he needs a change for sure. The thing I hate about it is hell turn into something out of this world once it happens.

God help us if it's another situation of Marty StLouis, Brett Hull, JS Giguere, ......sad but true.

[bubbsy]

I always thought Bennett would have a trajectory similar to kadri, where once he had a reduced 3rd line with edge role, it would allow the natural offense to finally shine thru.

What this year and the past year or so show is that even when he's playing well and getting high danger chances, he just doesn't have the offensive finishing skill to score on nhl level goaltending.

I'd like to think it is just a confidence issue, but given the sample size, and just the complete lack of any kind of creativity whatsoever last night in that penalty shot attempt, i don't know what it would even take for him to find his offensive confidence again. It's getting to the point where where I'd be shocked to see him as a flame next year, heck, perhaps as early as this year's trade deadline.....

[Ozy_Flame]

Originally Posted by David Struch

His confidence is shattered here, I really think he needs a change, whole new team and line mates. He could be a producing top six left winger on many other teams with a change of scenery.

I honestly don't want to see him flounder, I want him to personally succeed and reach better heights and if it's not with the Flames, so be it. I really want the best to happen to this kid, he's obviously trying anything he can to improve on the ice, but the confidence just isn't there.

I think this would work better in the Flames favor anyways, with Mangiapane waiting in the wings.

[The Original FFIV]

Originally Posted by David Struch

Things haven't exactly been going Sam's way lately. A couple goal posts on Bennett's most recent chances and last nights uninspiring attempt on the break away and penalty shot.

His confidence is shattered here, I really think he needs a change, whole new team and line mates. He could be a producing top six left winger on many other teams with a change of scenery.

Just hope he gets moved out east. In the event he does finally pop, don’t want us to be haunted by him.

[Split98]

I can't wait until we have high FPS 4K cameras around the rink to pinpoint exactly why Bennett isn't scoring.

Bennett has brought the physical game we salivated over when he was drafted (and BeardBennett) and it feels like he is a legit scoring threat most nights. Maybe not steadily throughout the game, but he always seems to provide a threat at some point in the game. I'm sure that he and Peters knows exactly what went wrong every scoring chance we've seen miss the mark, and the ice time Bennett is getting seems to indicate that he's close to figuring that out.

Would be pretty fun (for some) if we could analyze his shot and find out that his big issue is settling the puck (for example).

[Hackey]

Not sure if it ever had a chance or not but a deal surrounding Bennett and Domi this off season sure would have been nice.

[Split98]

Originally Posted by David Struch

Things haven't exactly been going Sam's way lately. A couple goal posts on Bennett's most recent chances and last nights uninspiring attempt on the break away and penalty shot.

His confidence is shattered here, I really think he needs a change, whole new team and line mates. He could be a producing top six left winger on many other teams with a change of scenery.

I'll bet it is, but there really is a chance that this is the year he starts working towards where we hoped he could be.

Posts and scoring chances are really good signs. His confidence is shot as most would be but he's contributing elsewhere which makes him valuable on the ice. He's also noticeably improved his game in the "Stupid Sam!!!!" category as well, so he's playing a lot smarter this year which is good to see. While it's not a night and day difference, as I think he's gotten away with a couple, there's growth to be excited about.

I'm just really happy to see physical Sam out there. He can be a pretty punishing guy, and we need a lot more of that right now.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by The Original FFIV

Just hope he gets moved out east. In the event he does finally pop, don’t want us to be haunted by him.

At this point even the loudest supporters of Bennett have to be seeing the truth here. Unfortunately, it's painfully obvious. Bennett needs a new home.

All the excuses are gone, it's the coaches fault, it's his line mates fault, he's unlucky, etc etc. It has been talked about openly that the Flames (Peters Treliving) are trying to find a way to find a role, a purpose, for Bennett. He's getting as good of a chance right now as he should. He has taken some strides forward, but we need to see more. He's on pace for 19 points. 19 (rounding up).

Granted the optics of the penalty shot are bad (holy sh*t, that was not an NHL calibre attempt. I have little doubt Andrew Mangipane would have been more dangerous). Part of Bennett's game has to be offensive contributions. If his ceiling with the Flames is to essentially be Garnett Hathaway, both sides are likely going to want to move on. Once again, he is just is not producing offense to warrant his spot on a team that is looking to become consistent playoff competitors.

I have to think even Bennett and his agent/family are thinking a change is scenery might be best. I would be shocked if he and the Flames haven't at least addressed the scenario.

[cam_wmh]

Originally Posted by Bingo

Bennett was the Flames best face off guy last year of guys that took a good chunk of draws. He was 54.3% on 219 draws (Versteeg was 59% on 78 draws). Stajan and Monahan were back 2.5 to 3%.

Monahan, had one hand.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by cam_wmh

Monahan, had one hand.

And is .4 worse so far this season with two.

[Kasi]

The Bennett detractors here are really stretching to think they have any idea of his mental
state or how he feels in the dressing room there. A very common sports term is to separate process vs results. We all know results are not there for him now but as long as he, his teammates and his coach are on the same page about the process and how he feels (including support from his teammates) that’s really all that matters.

And really counting stats at this point are a weak argument. How many posts has he hit or
scoring chances he’s set up that have been missed are there? Just 3 of those go in and his stats are just fine. Anyway he’s getting good ice time, he’s not making stupid penalties and he’s driving play. I don’t think there is much more you can ask right now and any trade right now would be 1. Selling low and 2. Would almost certainly make the Flames a worse team.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Split98

I'll bet it is, but there really is a chance that this is the year he starts working towards where we hoped he could be.

Posts and scoring chances are really good signs. His confidence is shot as most would be but he's contributing elsewhere which makes him valuable on the ice. He's also noticeably improved his game in the "Stupid Sam!!!!" category as well, so he's playing a lot smarter this year which is good to see. While it's not a night and day difference, as I think he's gotten away with a couple, there's growth to be excited about.

I'm just really happy to see physical Sam out there. He can be a pretty punishing guy, and we need a lot more of that right now.

100% agree with this. Bennett has already made huge strides in his game this year and I think the change of scenery posts are poorly timed. If he was showing no signs of improvement, absolutely, but since he is actually improving his overall game I want to see where it takes him, not ship him out with the odd assumption that the improvement is just going to stop.

People are just reacting poorly to a bad game that highlighted an area of his game he still needs to work on.

Sam Bennett, as he is TODAY, is a player I want on the Flames long-term. If he keeps improving, it’s just going to strengthen that feeling for me.

You look at a guy like Byron who was known for blowing breakaway after breakaway, but he kept improving and working on his game, and look at him now. Giving up on Sam when we’re just now seeing him improve and really become a valuable player is crazy to me.

We’ve already been patient. Let’s continue to be.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Kasi

The Bennett detractors here are really stretching to think they have any idea of his mental
state or how he feels in the dressing room there. A very common sports term is to separate process vs results. We all know results are not there for him now but as long as he, his teammates and his coach are on the same page about the process and how he feels (including support from his teammates) that’s really all that matters.

And really counting stats at this point are a weak argument. How many posts has he hit or
scoring chances he’s set up that have been missed are there? Just 3 of those go in and his stats are just fine. Anyway he’s getting good ice time, he’s not making stupid penalties and he’s driving play. I don’t think there is much more you can ask right now and any trade right now would be 1. Selling low and 2. Would almost certainly make the Flames a worse team.

Your last sentence is pure speculation. If the Flames are 'certainly a worse team' without Sam Bennett, they are not a very strong team.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by TOfan

At this point even the loudest supporters of Bennett have to be seeing the truth here. Unfortunately, it's painfully obvious. Bennett needs a new home.

All the excuses are gone, it's the coaches fault, it's his line mates fault, he's unlucky, etc etc. It has been talked about it openly that the Flames (Peters Treliving) are trying to find a way to find a role, a purpose, for Bennett. He's getting as good of a chance right now as he should. He has taken some strides forward, but we need to see more. He's on pace for 19 points. 19 (rounding up).

Granted the optics of the penalty shot are bad (holy sh*t, that was not an NHL calibre attempt. I have little doubt Andrew Mangipane would have been more dangerous). Part of Bennett's game has to be offensive contributions. If his ceiling with the Flames is to essentially be Garnett Hathaway, both sides are likely going to want to move on. Once again, he is just is not producing offense to warrant his spot on a team that is looking to become consistent playoff competitors.

I have to think even Bennett and his agent/family are thinking a change is scenery might be best. I would be shocked if he and the Flames haven't at least addressed the scenario.

I wouldn't be to sure of that.

Biggest reason is that its hard to know exactly what the "truth" is with him, but if we use only what he has done the last 2+ years, then its easy to find a starting spot.

Its the "what if" aspect with him that people disagree on. He is a better player right now than he was at any point the last 2 seasons, but he is still abysmally lacking in production.....again.

[activeStick]

I'm not nearly as hopeful as some others about Bennett breaking out and in fact, I don't think he will ever will, but his play had vastly improved this year. Much more disciplined, consistent energy and has a constant physical edge to his game. And this is alright for me. He won't get a big contract and his spot is on the third line in the NHL which is fine.

[Kasi]

Originally Posted by TOfan

Your last sentence is pure speculation. If the Flames are 'certainly a worse team' without Sam Bennett, they are not a very strong team.

Who could the flames trade for him that would be an upgrade on him? You’re trading a guy who drives play from the third line. Very unlikely anyone you trade for him would be able to reproduce that.