The Athletic: Do the Flames have an elite defenceman in waiting in Adam Fox?

[JFK]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

for a 20 game stretch at the end of 2015 in games that were playoff-like important- the 31 year old Wideman and Russell were the best Flame defensive pairing perhaps in the history of the Flames.

very short and selective memories by various posters here.

Can we report posters for just being flat out loonies?
This is ridiculous.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

for a 20 game stretch at the end of 2015 in games that were playoff-like important- the 31 year old Wideman and Russell were the best Flame defensive pairing perhaps in the history of the Flames.

[Zulu29]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

Yep who wants someone who was a major force in carrying the Flames playing 27+ minutes a game into the playoffs and actually winning a playoff series in 2015 for the first time since 2004.

for a 20 game stretch at the end of 2015 in games that were playoff-like important- the 31 year old Wideman and Russell were the best Flame defensive pairing perhaps in the history of the Flames.

very short and selective memories by various posters here.

It's official. You've lost it.

[VilleN]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

Yep who wants someone who was a major force in carrying the Flames playing 27+ minutes a game into the playoffs and actually winning a playoff series in 2015 for the first time since 2004.

for a 20 game stretch at the end of 2015 in games that were playoff-like important- the 31 year old Wideman and Russell were the best Flame defensive pairing perhaps in the history of the Flames.

very short and selective memories by various posters here.

Are you kidding me? The best pairing in the history of the Flames was obviously Chris Butler and Anton Babchuk.

[Calgary4LIfe]

I do think that the Russell-Wideman (especially Wideman) have been criminally underrated on these boards during their good seasons, but considering who the Flames have had - even the last two straight years with the Giordano - Brodie and Giordano - Hamilton pairings, how can someone claim Russell - Wideman have been the best?

People do forget that Wideman was AWESOME for the Flames for 2 years in Calgary. He did play 27/28 minutes a game (was leading the league in TOI for a while IIRC), scored at a very good clip and made the PP dangerous, and played EXCELLENT defence. However, you have to have been a very recent fan of the team to not bring up Suter, MacInnis, Macoun, McCrimmon and probably another 5 or 6 defencemen that I just can't think of. Heck, I thought the Regehr - Leopold combo was money for about 2 seasons too.

I think Wideman faded and faded quickly, and I do really believe people actually forgot that he performed REALLY well, but claiming he and Russell formed the best pairing in the HISTORY of the Flames? That's just... bonkers. This is coming from a fan that was very appreciative of what Wideman brought to the team for a few seasons. Bonkers!

[Huntingwhale]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

for a 20 game stretch at the end of 2015 in games that were playoff-like important- the 31 year old Wideman and Russell were the best Flame defensive pairing perhaps in the history of the Flames.

Not even kidding when I say this is literally the most ######ed thing ever posted in CP's history. And that includes all the Springs1 and Option84's crap.

#1 dumbest thing ever posted in CP's history, right here folks.

[GioforPM]

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

Wow.

The stats for February/ March 2015 until the Flame clinched a playoff spot with 1 game left.

games 19

Flames record 12:4-3

Wideman 3 goals 19 pts +11 27+ minutes / game
Russell 5 goals 14 pts +8 26+ minutes a game

-----

Brodie, who would would likely get the fan favorite best d-man award that season was great playing 25+ minutes a game:

1 goal 6 pts -8

Hamilton and Giordano played great for the Flames down the stretch last year but were not carrying the team to the same extent.

Perhaps I get carried away with the exploits of Wideman/Russell 2015 but after Gio got hurt that year I was writing the Flames off and Wideman/Russell far exceeded the wildest expectations.

I was used to Bouwmeester playing significantly less than expectations year after year in similar situations.

What pairings do you feel played better for the Flames over a 20 game stretch?

[AC]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

What pairings do you feel played better for the Flames over a 20 game stretch?

As mentioned above, the best was Suter-Macinnis.

http://flameslegends.blogspot.ca/200...ary-suter.html

During his years in Calgary, Suter roomed with and manned the point alongside Hall of Famer Al MacInnis. Together, they provided one of the best defensive pairings (if not the best) in the NHL. Said former Flames Assistant GM Al MacNeil, "[both Gary and Al] were magic on the powerplay." While Big Al's booming slapshots tended to overshadow Suter's floating wrist shots, Suter was still respected as one of the best defensemen in the league. When he left Calgary in 1994, he ranked second all-time in team scoring behind MacInnis (making Calgary the only club ever to, at any particular time, have two defensemen as its top two all-time scorers).

[JFK]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

Perhaps I get carried away with the exploits of Wideman/Russell 2015 but after Gio got hurt that year I was writing the Flames off and Wideman/Russell far exceeded the wildest expectations.

You get carried away with literally every thread and topic you post about.

[frodo_t_baggins]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

The stats for February/ March 2015 until the Flame clinched a playoff spot with 1 game left.

games 19

Flames record 12:4-3

Wideman 3 goals 19 pts +11 27+ minutes / game
Russell 5 goals 14 pts +8 26+ minutes a game

-----

Brodie, who would would likely get the fan favorite best d-man award that season was great playing 25+ minutes a game:

1 goal 6 pts -8

Hamilton and Giordano played great for the Flames down the stretch last year but were not carrying the team to the same extent.

Perhaps I get carried away with the exploits of Wideman/Russell 2015 but after Gio got hurt that year I was writing the Flames off and Wideman/Russell far exceeded the wildest expectations.

I was used to Bouwmeester playing significantly less than expectations year after year in similar situations.

What pairings do you feel played better for the Flames over a 20 game stretch?

Gio and Brodie had a better 20 game stretch statistically than that to start the season. In the first 25 games to start the 14/15 season Gio had 25 points and was a +14 and Brodie had 21 points and was a +16. They were ranked 1 & 2 in defenseman scoring respectively.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

...What pairings do you feel played better for the Flames over a 20 game stretch?

Why focus on such a small sample size of games?

There have been numerous much better defence pairings in Flames history than Russell and Wideman circa 2015. I think Brodie and Engelland were better than Russell and Wideman in the playoffs that season. In just the past three years both Brodie and Giordano and Giordano and Hamilton were FAR better defense pairings over the course of full seasons. Hell, Giordano and Hamilton were both top-ten in Norris voting last year. Giordano placed sixth in Norris voting in 2015 and Brodie placed 18th. Dennis Wideman did manage to garner some Norris votes that season placing him 20th, but it seems patently obvious that he was never regarded among the "historically best Flames defensemen" at any point in his time in Calgary.

[killer_carlson]

I see what Ricardo's is trying to say, but don't agree with the suggested extent. Sometimes players catch lightning in a bottle and tear it up unexpectedly. The duration is short due to injuries, playoffs or trades.

Wideman Russel is an example

Bure Stillman Nazarov was totally dominant for a stretch which let us trade Nazarov for good value

Roberts niewendyk stern had one of the best playoffs ever, but we lost in 7.

But there are much better pairings, long term in the organization's history. I don't know if the Wideman Russel pairing is even top 10 in the last 10 years,

[Five-hole]

Originally Posted by AC

As mentioned above, the best was Suter-Macinnis.

http://flameslegends.blogspot.ca/200...ary-suter.html

NO no no. You have such a short memory to think anyone was better than two guys were in 14-15.

[Gaudreau is a Ninja]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Such a great pp combo also wish Reinhart would have stayed a Flame

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by killer_carlson

I see what Ricardo's is trying to say, but don't agree with the suggested extent. Sometimes players catch lightning in a bottle and tear it up unexpectedly. The duration is short due to injuries, playoffs or trades.

Wideman Russel is an example

Bure Stillman Nazarov was totally dominant for a stretch which let us trade Nazarov for good value

Roberts niewendyk stern had one of the best playoffs ever, but we lost in 7.

But there are much better pairings, long term in the organization's history. I don't know if the Wideman Russel pairing is even top 10 in the last 10 years,

The general tone that I am pushing against is that Wideman was a pile of poo for his whole time on the Flames. He was not. For 20 games plus playoffs he was a hero.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

Why focus on such a small sample size of games?

.

Because over the length of his 5 year contract Wideman had 2 good years in general and one terrific stretch where he played a huge part getting them into the playoffs.

[JFK]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

Because over the length of his 5 year contract Wideman had 2 good years in general and one terrific stretch where he played a huge part getting them into the playoffs.

1/5, 2015-2016 that's it.

[Knut]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

The stats for February/ March 2015 until the Flame clinched a playoff spot with 1 game left.

games 19

Flames record 12:4-3

Wideman 3 goals 19 pts +11 27+ minutes / game
Russell 5 goals 14 pts +8 26+ minutes a game

-----

Brodie, who would would likely get the fan favorite best d-man award that season was great playing 25+ minutes a game:

1 goal 6 pts -8

Hamilton and Giordano played great for the Flames down the stretch last year but were not carrying the team to the same extent.

Perhaps I get carried away with the exploits of Wideman/Russell 2015 but after Gio got hurt that year I was writing the Flames off and Wideman/Russell far exceeded the wildest expectations.

I was used to Bouwmeester playing significantly less than expectations year after year in similar situations.

What pairings do you feel played better for the Flames over a 20 game stretch?

What are your thoughts on Hamilton-Giordano for the entire second half of last year? They were widely considered on of the top 2 pairings in the league.

[Redlan]

So...I come into this thread...going to read me some (Adam) Fox news! Start by reading the whole last page, exit, see the thread for Adam Fox...go back in because I literally forgot that what I just read because it had nothing to do with Fox.