[News] Sean Monahan done for the season. Needs hip surgery. Will be ready for training camp

[Hanna Sniper]

Originally Posted by Classic_Sniper

Never heard it from me. I’ve never been interested in trading Gaudreau because I’ve known since the day I saw him in a Flames jersey that he was an elite play driver. Much like how Kiprusoff hid the Flames’ flaws defensively, Gaudreau hides the flaws of his team. He does the job of a center despite being a diminutive winger. His ability to play with the puck through the middle of the ice and distribute effectively to either side helps to break down the opposition’s defensive structures. He also has a little bit of McDavid in him where he can back up defenses with his quickness and freeze them while finding his trailing linemates. I never once questioned his talent or questioned who the drive on his line was.

It’s obvious by your hatred for Monahan

[Classic_Sniper]

Originally Posted by FanIn80

Monahan is a C with a $6M contract and there are only a handful of players in the entire league who have scored more goals than him since he played his first game.

He was playing like a whole new man at the start of the year. Hitting, scoring, defending... he looked like a man possessed out there at times. Who knows for sure when he screwed up his hip (and/or whatever else we don't know about). Monahan is notorious for playing through injuries that would sideline most people (even going all the way back to junior).

This notion that he has no value is laughable. I saw enough of what I was looking for out of him at the start of the year, and Sutter has come out and talked about how he's "done everything that was asked of him and more." I'm pretty interested in seeing what Sutter can do with him during a full, normal, season - with fans, proper practices, non-compressed schedules, etc.

Monahan definitely looked better at the beginning season vs now. But let’s be honest here, none of the lines were getting it done and that’s the real reason Geoff Ward was fired. There was no chemistry anywhere In the line up because they went with the stupid 3 pairs thing for too long. Players may like Gaudreau and Monahan may have been producing, but it was all on the powerplay, not 5 on 5 and that was a huge problem because once the powerplay dried up, they couldn’t score enough to win.

Only now in the last 15 games or so has the even strength scoring been up to par. Too bad they didn’t change up the lines earlier because they basically had no margin for error by the time they did. Just two extra wins and this team probably would be on track for 4th place.

[Classic_Sniper]

Originally Posted by Hanna Sniper

It’s obvious by your hatred for Monahan

I don’t hate Monahan, I hated James Neal and Brian Elliott. But people gave Monahan far too much credit for the success of that duo in my opinion. The amount of Gaudreau hate and criticism was sickening. I always knew that there’d be a day when Gaudreau and Monahan were split up for good that the truth would show. I’m not surprised at the success #13 is having, but I won’t lie, I figured Monahan would be better than what he’s displayed. Now some of that may be due to the injury, but like I said many times now, I haven’t liked his game since the end of 2018.

[Snuffleupagus]

Originally Posted by Hanna Sniper

Elias Lindholm has been the team's No.1 center since opening puck drop and the top scoring line

Yet they stuck the teams best offensive player with Monahan even when he's playing injured. I'm not blaming Monahan I'm blaming the coaching staff.

BTW, since training camp I stated I wanted the top two lines as:

Gaudreau - Lindholm - Tkachuk
Monahan - Bennett/Backlund - Mangiapane

Yes, I wanted Monahan to play wing and maybe take strong side draws.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

But you are trying to justify his contract based on current production of certain players who are not producing to their current contract.

And ignoring many who are.

Are you really suggesting that if Monny was a UFA today he’d get anywhere close to his current contract?

The questions about his future health and production suggests that there is likely no team that would be willing to take on his current contract without sending back some risky cap.


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Define who a $6M centre is. Hint - it’s not Mackinnon - he’s a $10M centre making $6. That’s my point. The cross-section at that amount includes a lot of guys with Monahan’s production, especially if it’s, say, a 3 year span. And there’s a lot of guys who are busts at their contracts and a lot of bargains.

And yes, Monahan would get close to his current contract if he was a UFA.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Define who a $6M centre is. Hint - it’s not Mackinnon - he’s a $10M centre making $6. That’s my point. The cross-section at that amount includes a lot of guys with Monahan’s production, especially if it’s, say, a 3 year span. And there’s a lot of guys who are busts at their contracts and a lot of bargains.

And yes, Monahan would get close to his current contract if he was a UFA.

If he was a UFA, no one would look at his 3 year stats, they would look at his current health and his huge declining stats. He would get a show me 1 year contract.

A UFA centre that would get say, a 6M, 6 year contract is likely a defensively responsible 50 point 2nd line centre who is healthy.

Right now, Monny is none of those things.

Until he proves himself healthy and productive, people will be cautious.


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[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

If he was a UFA, no one would look at his 3 year stats, they would look at his current health and his huge declining stats. He would get a show me 1 year contract.

A UFA centre that would get say, a 6M, 6 year contract is likely a defensively responsible 50 point 2nd line centre who is healthy.

Right now, Monny is none of those things.

Until he proves himself healthy and productive, people will be cautious.


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First, yes, GMs look at more than one year’s worth of work in evaluating a player for a contract. I think you haven’t looked at recent contracts. Look at what a guy like Henrique signed for a couple years ago as a UFA, with pretty mediocre production and not great defensive stats. Stastny signed for 6.5 after a season of 53 points over 82 games.

In fact, if you only look at one year of work, you end up with a Skinner or DuChene contract.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

If he was a UFA, no one would look at his 3 year stats, they would look at his current health and his huge declining stats. He would get a show me 1 year contract.

You mean like that one-year show-me contract Josh Anderson got the year after he scored one (1) goal?

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

You mean like that one-year show-me contract Josh Anderson got the year after he scored one (1) goal?

I didn’t realize that Anderson had a plethora of injuries including needing season ending hip surgery.

We are talking about a heavily injured player with a sharp decline in everything hockey related ( notwithstanding that he continued to get the premium ice time and pp time)vs. a player who you expected will produce more with better usage.


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[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

I didn’t realize that Anderson had a plethora of injuries including needing season ending hip surgery.

We are talking about a heavily injured player with a sharp decline in everything hockey related ( notwithstanding that he continued to get the premium ice time and pp time)vs. a player who you expected will produce more with better usage.


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True, he he didn’t have hip surgery. He did, however, have season ending shoulder surgery. Two years before - knee. Year before, an orbital fracture which required surgery.


Do you like Eichel’s contract?

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

True, he he didn’t have hip surgery. He did, however, have season ending shoulder surgery. Two years before - knee. Year before, an orbital fracture which required surgery.


Do you like Eichel’s contract?

Not particularly.

But if you trade for him, you are going all in, and it’s basically your only chance of realistically competing.

Me, I’d rebuild as I don’t see this team competing .

But if you aren’t rebuilding, there could be worse things than going all in for Eichel.

Although I doubt that Calgary is the best match.


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[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

Not particularly.

But if you trade for him, you are going all in, and it’s basically your only chance of realistically competing.

Me, I’d rebuild as I don’t see this team competing .

But if you aren’t rebuilding, there could be worse things than going all in for Eichel.

Although I doubt that Calgary is the best match.


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Well, by your “one year” criteria, you should hate Eichel’s contract.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Well, by your “one year” criteria, you should hate Eichel’s contract.

Money has been bad for more than one year.

But you need to look at the trends.

Eichel still priced close to a point per game, all the while when injured.

Monny has had many injuries, and ended the season with 8 points in his last 24 games.

If you think there is any valid comparison between Eichel and Monny, let’s end this discussion.

Let’s see if Treliving can flip Monny for a kings ransom.


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[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

Money has been bad for more than one year.

But you need to look at the trends.

Eichel still priced close to a point per game, all the while when injured.

Monny has had many injuries, and ended the season with 8 points in his last 24 games.

If you think there is any valid comparison between Eichel and Monny, let’s end this discussion.

Let’s see if Treliving can flip Monny for a kings ransom.


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I’m not comparing them at all, I’m saying your contract evaluation method is flawed (and you seem to have excuses why it doesn’t apply to all other examples). Eichel scored 2 goals in 21 games. And 11 of his 18 points were the first month (in fact 6 points in 3 games off the hop). He had an explainable bad year. So has Monahan. But GMs don’t just look at one year. They do look at trends, true, but they also look a history and potential for bounce back.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

I’m not comparing them at all, I’m saying your contract evaluation method is flawed (and you seem to have excuses why it doesn’t apply to all other examples). Eichel scored 2 goals in 21 games. And 11 of his 18 points were the first month (in fact 6 points in 3 games off the hop). He had an explainable bad year. So has Monahan. But GMs don’t just look at one year. They do look at trends, true, but they also look a history and potential for bounce back.

What was Monny’s reason for his bad year last year? And half the year before that?

I know the reason, it’s likely injury related.

But Monny has had some many injuries over the years that they may have become chronic. And now he needs surgery on his hip(s).

We don’t know what Monny is now. My point is that until GM’s know what he us now, it’s hard to access his value. For that reason, I doubt he gets moved this off season. Teams want to see him play.


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[CSharp]

D'amn Monahan should be nicknamed "Glass". Hands, shoulders, groin, hips - what's next season gonna be - knee, foot,...? Guess he'll be off the block for Eichel?