Dude, read through the articles and actually try to change your mind. I know it's going to be hard, but you should at least try.
Eventually the boomers will die. Or they'll get old and won't be able to take care of themselves and will have to sell.
The boomers have children. All that money has to go somewhere. Try to think in macroeconomic terms.
And I read the exact same analyses in papers when I was young. This isn't a new thing. The problem with being 18-35 is that you're going to school and just starting out. You have little to no experience, and no one trusts you.
Fer christ's sake, I made $8000/year working three jobs while I was in university. Lots of fellow students did the same. Yeah hey that's going to drag down that median income huge.
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Eventually the boomers will die. Or they'll get old and won't be able to take care of themselves and will have to sell.
The boomers have children. All that money has to go somewhere. Try to think in macroeconomic terms.
And I read the exact same analyses in papers when I was young. This isn't a new thing. The problem with being 18-35 is that you're going to school and just starting out. You have little to no experience, and no one trusts you.
Fer christ's sake, I made $8000/year working three jobs while I was in university. Lots of fellow students did the same. Yeah hey that's going to drag down that median income huge.
You didn't read the articles.
This is going to make the problem far worse.
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And don't feel bad if you rent. Only 63% of Canadians own their place.
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Totally off topic, but kind of related.
How much does the type of rhetoric of 'owning' a home play in this. Let's be real, you don't come anywhere close to 'owning' it for a long time after you start payments.
Even at 3%, 5 years into a 400k 25 year mortgage, you still owe 340K.
I'll admit to a bias, so please feel free to dispute. But after 10 years, you've paid 100k to carry that mortgage.
So if after 10 years, you've paid a quarter million dollars to owe 275K on a 440K asset, you would need to be able to sell that house for 525K to break even. To say nothing of the opportunity costs of pulling out 40K for the down payment, or any of the other costs associated with home 'ownership'.
Totally simplistic, and you would need to factor in Rent and the difference in costs + savings interest vs debt servicing to get a better idea. But I really don't think reinforcing the notion that you 'own' a home because you're tied into a very costly loan is helping.
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It's expensive to own property. You have to save and sacrifice to own property. You have to have a good job. You might need a mate with a good job. It has always been like this. Yeah hey back in the 70s you could buy a place for $30K, but you made $8000/year. And eggs were 50 cents a dozen. Yes kiddies, inflation is a real thing.
Except your numbers are wrong. In the early to mid-70s when you could by a detached house in a major city for $30K the median family income was more like $13-15K.
Inflation has driven incomes up by about 5 times, but in the same time period house prices have increased by about 15-30 times (depending on the city).
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Well, you can still purchase a multi-family unit fairly cheaply in Calgary. There's a lot of supply. No, you might not get your dream SFH. But you know, the policy of the city for quite a while now has been to price out new SFH development. Which of course raises existing SFH pricing.
No, you don't have a "right" to a SFH. No, you don't automatically "deserve" one.
BTW, all those things you mentioned (except #2)? They all contribute to asset inflation...
Oh yeah, the cost of living always goes up. For fark's sake, you guys keep electing politicians that keep raising fees and taxes, what did you expect? Is your garbage being picked up better? Your water bill has gone up 100% because the city can't build a treatment plant on budget. * shrug *, right?
Your argument is just so poor here. You're saying that inflation happens...yes...but you haven't, in any way, taken into account the rise in housing prices (or any other living expenses) relative to incomes, or even considered any change in the availability of employment.
Your argument is just so poor here. You're saying that inflation happens...yes...but you haven't, in any way, taken into account the rise in housing prices (or any other living expenses) relative to incomes, or even considered any change in the availability of employment.
Shazam's argument has been poor everywhere in this thread. Lack of specifics, uncharitable readings of the others arguments, and dismissive of other posters.
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Sure, it's going to be harder for Millennials to buy their own homes. But on the plus side, it's so much easier to get quality porn now. Do you know how hard it was to get good porn in the 70s? And it was expensive! Now you can get as much as you want for FREE!
Some things in life get worse, some get better. That's just the way it is.
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I read the articles. You however, presume that the problem is a recent phenomenon, when it is not.
OTOH, you also think inflation doesn't exist. Which means your whole understanding of anything economic is wrong.
Had you honestly read the articles, you would have known that almost all of the comparison statistics compared for when boomers were at a similar age as millennials. So your counter argument that 'of course boomers own more they are older' is entirely null and shows you did NOT real the articles.....
You claim to be gen x, but regardless, crap like this is why OK Boomer is now a thing. Y'all need to start listening.
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I think essential items got more expensive, but a lot of luxury items got cheaper, and hence why people now have way more luxury items or engage in a lot of luxury spending. Traveling, electronics, and other toys were way more expensive back in the day. Now with globalization making a lot of items cheaper to produce, I feel like consumption has gone way up.
That and nowadays, parents have a ton of options to stimulate their kids. I feel like kids these days are up to their eyeballs in enrolled extracurricular activities. That's gotta cost a lot. Not saying right or wrong, just saying I never had close to that much stuff growing up. Summers and weekends, my brother and I were pretty much left to our own devices. Not sure if that was normal for other kids back then though, that's just my anecdotal experience.
Your argument is just so poor here. You're saying that inflation happens...yes...but you haven't, in any way, taken into account the rise in housing prices (or any other living expenses) relative to incomes, or even considered any change in the availability of employment.
Just laughable that he thinks the change in home prices is due to inflation.
$16k for a 13 year old???? WTF is going on? Why are schools spending money on this? You know where we went on our school trip? Crowsnest ####ing Pass. A cruise. Come on.
I like that they're using a discount cruise line but its still $16k. What is this? 'Lionel Hutz Cruise Lines?'
Who is the Tour Guide? Troy McClure? Captain Ol' Gil?
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Had you honestly read the articles, you would have known that almost all of the comparison statistics compared for when boomers were at a similar age as millennials. So your counter argument that 'of course boomers own more they are older' is entirely null and shows you did NOT real the articles.....
You claim to be gen x, but regardless, crap like this is why OK Boomer is now a thing. Y'all need to start listening.
Maybe this is an aside, but it raises an interesting point. There is an historicism which deals with this a little. It used to be ( probably over a 100 years ago now) parents would tell their children what to expect from the world, and they would more or less be correct. Their children would be living in a world that was very similar to their parents. This is no longer the case. Things change so rapidly that a parent can hardly tell their child what their life will be like.
Baby Boomers have a lot of life experience and knowledge. The issue is that this knowledge is about a world that no longer exists. Millennials to a degree were raised in a world of unknowns. The generations after are even more out of touch with the world that boomers know having not experienced a little of it in their youth. The generational gap has never been larger.
Last edited by TheIronMaiden; 11-05-2019 at 12:02 PM.
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$16k for a 13 year old???? WTF is going on? Why are schools spending money on this? You know where we went on our school trip? Crowsnest ####ing Pass. A cruise. Come on.
How many people do you lose on a normal Cruise?
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You mean older people have more property, and young people have less? That's sorta how it goes.
I hope you provide yourself the same derision when you're older.
Wow. Structural issues doesn't mean old people have houses and younger people don't.
It means there are systemic issues that make it harder for young people to get ahead than it was for the previous generation. The cost of education, the cost of living, etc have all skyrocketed while wages have remained the same.
And yes, I understand what inflation is. If you control for inflation these costs have still skyrocketed while wages have not.
I'm a millennial and I'm lucky to be fairly well off. I have a good career, as does my wife, and we're certainly not in the 47% this thread is about. Hell, I just got back from taking a year off from working to travel around the world and have come back fairly comfortably with savings and into a new career. I'm privileged. But I also recognize there are a lot of younger people that don't have it as good as I do and that are really struggling to make ends meet and get ahead.
It's a very different world than the Boomers grew up in and while yes, there are people that are irresponsible with their money, I don't think it's a stretch to say that a portion of the 47% that are drowning in debt is because of the increasing cost of living and challenges for young people.
Seems odd to resist the notion that there are systemic issues in place making things harder for younger people to get ahead in life.
Seems like something most people would be in favor of acknowledging.
They just need to work harder and pull themselves up by their bootstraps. Millennial are so lazy and entitled. We didn't have avocado toast when I was younger!
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They just need to work harder and pull themselves up by their bootstraps. Millennial are so lazy and entitled. We didn't have avocado toast when I was younger!
We didn't have the latest smartphone, we just had a garage for my shopwork and my two vehicles.
