Arena Negotiation Discussion v2

[Ducay]

After the Central Library opening, I can't take any more pictures of wood design features on my instagram. Please Ken King, find a way to ruin this one too!

[Mr.Coffee]

Originally Posted by bizaro86

From my perspective as a STH in the greens, the following things are likely to be true:

-my view of the game will be equal or worse
-my ticket prices will be way higher
-my property taxes will be slightly higher
-there will still be a wait to use the bathroom at intermission
-there will still be a Ram truck in my way in the concourse.
-the construction materials will be shinier

Doesn't seem like a net benefit to me...

but you're forgetting a key one:

-the team will exist

I was very staunchly anti-city pay for arena guy for a long time. Go read my posting history on this topic. Also, chalk it up on the record here that I am also somewhat anti-Flames owner. The majority owner, well, I can't get into too much specifics but suffice it to say I'm not a fan of his company's bullying and business tactics in O&G (I'll leave it at that). Meanwhile minority owners, I worked for one of them and... *shudder* I've seen how they operate an organization. It wasn't pretty to say the least.

But at some point the threat of leaving becomes a legitimate (and smart, frankly) business decision. It won't be so opaque as to "I'm going to just sell to a guy outside Calgary to make sure the threat of leaving is real" as it will be a "I"m going to sell my stake to... whoever will buy it". As it happens, billionaires don't grow on trees and so the pool of prospective buyers is not large. As expenses rise and revenues decline by the types of fans Enoch is talking about, you bet your ass the Flames will be in tough here.

Furthermore, the state of the economy, which again I've droned on this website ad nausem, but go do some research as to the state of things. Considering the state of the oilpatch, is there the requisite corporate support needed, further, the requisite corporate support that's willing to own a box? Today most definitely. In 10 years? I think Calgary's in trouble. You can thank BC and the Feds for that.

Also, I sure hope that none of the posters that were 'pro-Olympics' are 'anti-Flames rink' or you may want to check your logic.

The Olympics debate did a good deal of arguing about the merits of sports and entertainment and culture and dynasty and community fabric. Well the truth is that the Flames are very important to this city. Not just for the ticket payers or the fans who watch on tv but for the kids who occasionally follow things and have a sports icon to look up to and on and on and on.

Anyway on and on we go but at the end of the day I'd much rather be in a spot where the City is considering a $200-300 cash infusion that vitalizes an entertainment district and will last for 30 years then an Olympics that was poorly thought out and looked like it was going to be an economic catastrophe at several levels and then only last 2 weeks.

If we must pay for this infrastructure and it's the ONLY way then I can think about supporting it.

The trouble with the 'things are good' crowd is that 'things change' and owners and business people will move on because it makes sense from a business perspective and that's pretty much all the thought that'll go into it- fans be damned.

[Mr.Coffee]

Originally Posted by Sutter_in_law

There is no risk of relocation for Calgary while teams like FLA, ARI, and even OTT are still around and pulling in only a few thousand fans per game. And even if there were there would be a wealthy billionaire that would be willing to pay to bring another team here in a heartbeat.

I think this is true today and in the short term, but not the long term. And I think Calgarians better be real ####ing careful with the arrogance that we are some golden market that is infallible.

There is a LOT of ignorance about how bleak the horizon is for an industry that runs the show here.

[sleepingmoose]

Originally Posted by Tyler

Is the design the final approved design, or just a fancy placeholder? I ask because I LOVE the design!

If they’re starting construction in spring as they say, you’d like to think that they at least some level of formal functional plan already to decide where they need to start work/demo.

[NiklasSundblad]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

That is just such a sexy looking building. It reminds me of the Operahouse in my Norwegian hometown.

You're from Ksand? I'm up there all the time, I've played in Kilden a bunch of times.

Sent from my Mi MIX 2S using Tapatalk

[Muta]

This is not the final design at all. In fact, it likely will look very different from this. The design architect selected is a good one and will do something really awesome, I'm sure of it.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by NiklasSundblad

You're from Ksand? I'm up there all the time, I've played in Kilden a bunch of times.

Sent from my Mi MIX 2S using Tapatalk

I am not actually from Kristiansand. I lived there for three amazing years while doing my post-doc in Norway. It's my adopted Norwegian hometown, and one of my favourite places on Earth.

[getbak]

Originally Posted by sleepingmoose

If they’re starting construction in spring as they say, you’d like to think that they at least some level of formal functional plan already to decide where they need to start work/demo.

The initial phase of the expansion will be to add a new hall F between hall E and the casino. Once that is done, they'll demolish the Corral and hall A and start work on the larger expansion.

[Parallex]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

Not just for the ticket payers or the fans who watch on tv but for the kids who occasionally follow things and have a sports icon to look up to and on and on and on.

Well this part is just silly. I was born and raised in a municipality just shy of a population of 20K... needless to say we did not have a professional sports franchise and yet me and the other kids I grew up with still followed things and had sports icons we looked up to.

[RM14]

Originally Posted by getbak

The initial phase of the expansion will be to add a new hall F between hall E and the casino. Once that is done, they'll demolish the Corral and hall A and start work on the larger expansion.

Do you know if that direction of the BMO center is being built with a roughed in +15 indoor path from the Stampede train station to the new arena site?

Or is an indoor +15 being left out to keep people walking along the future Stampede trail street?

[Manhattanboy]

Originally Posted by RM14

Do you know if that direction of the BMO center is being built with a roughed in +15 indoor path from the Stampede train station to the new arena site?

Or is an indoor +15 being left out to keep people walking along the future Stampede trail street?

I could be wrong but this rendering looks to be from the SE (where the Corral is now) with the plus 15 across the LRT tracks at the back of the building.

[Robbob]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

I thought the Olympics was the “only way” to get Fed funding? I was led to believe that by our cohorts on this site.

Correct me if I am wrong, but this funding is for the conference center not an arena.

[squiggs96]

Originally Posted by Muta

This is not the final design at all. In fact, it likely will look very different from this. The design architect selected is a good one and will do something really awesome, I'm sure of it.

I, for one, look forward to having my socks knocked off.

[Muta]

Originally Posted by getbak

The initial phase of the expansion will be to add a new hall F between hall E and the casino. Once that is done, they'll demolish the Corral and hall A and start work on the larger expansion.

Don't forget about the future extension of 17th Avenue. The entire BMO Centre's existing south side will be redeveloped to create a street-front presence along 17th.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

That is just such a sexy looking building. It reminds me of the Operahouse in my Norwegian hometown.

They need to put that thing on treads

Spoiler!

[getbak]

Farkas gonna fark...

https://twitter.com/user/status/1107852259193348096


BMO Centre expansion funding approved. Construction to begin in 6 weeks (beginning of May).

[Weitz]

So will there actually be 500 jobs created or is the good ol "created jobs" that government likes to play out?

[jayswin]

How the heck does an expansion of the BMO centre create 500 permanent jobs and bring in $267m a year?!! At the risk of coming off as an uneducated citizen that seems like completely fabricated bull****.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by jayswin

How the heck does an expansion of the BMO centre create 500 permanent jobs and bring in $267m a year?!! At the risk of coming off as an uneducated citizen that seems like completely fabricated bull****.

"Trust us"

[4X4]

Originally Posted by jayswin

How the heck does an expansion of the BMO centre create 500 permanent jobs and bring in $267m a year?!! At the risk of coming off as an uneducated citizen that seems like completely fabricated bull****.

By hosting more, much larger events? The effect would be spread around the area to hotels, restaurants, car rental places, LRT, etc.

Maybe the 500 jobs is optimistic, but loads more cash being dropped in the City is a big deal.