Hockey News looks at the 2019-20 Flames

[Plaedo]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Couldn't find it - would you mind providing a link?

I think he is referring to this:

http://www.thehockeynews.com/news/ar...it-again-today

[Oil Stain]

Originally Posted by OutOfTheCube

Articles like these are basically pointless. Obviously it's impossible to predict trades and drafts and free agency to any reasonably accurate degree, so at that point, why even bother?.

THN are doing this with every team as well.

Basically all they are doing is deleting some bottom players/players close to retirement and then plugging 7-8 prospects into the holes and calling it a day.

Over the last three years, the Flames have graduated six prospects I believe. Monahan, Gaudreau, Ferland, Bennett, Tkachuk, and Jooris.

Will they graduate more than that in the next 3 years? I'd be interested in what the league average is per season. Probably not more than 1-2 per year would be my guess.

Just write an article on each team's top ten prospects. It would be better than this IMO.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by OutOfTheCube

Articles like these are basically pointless. Obviously it's impossible to predict trades and drafts and free agency to any reasonably accurate degree, so at that point, why even bother?

This was the roster three years ago:

Jiri Hudler
Johnny Gaudreau
Sean Monahan
Dennis Wideman
Mark Giordano
T.J. Brodie
Lance Bouma
Kris Russell
David Jones
Curtis Glencross
Joe Colborne
Mikael Backlund
Josh Jooris
Mason Raymond
Paul Byron
Markus Granlund
Matt Stajan
Deryk Engelland
Micheal Ferland
Brandon Bollig
Raphael Diaz
Sven Baertschi
Drew Shore
Sam Bennett
Emile Poirier
Ladislav Smid
Jonas Hiller
Corban Knight
Brett Kulak
Brian McGrattan
Joni Ortio
Corey Potter
John Ramage
Karri Ramo
Max Reinhart
David Schlemko
Devin Setoguchi
David Wolf
Tyler Wotherspoon

That's an almost 80% turn-over! In 3 years.

A lot of those guys were not expected to be long term pieces at that point in time. The one guy that stands out as a guy some of us expected to be with us right now is probably Byron. That was a bizarre move that pre-season.

There's also Ortio and maybe that would have gone differently had we acquired a proven 60 game starter like Bishop last year.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Oil Stain

THN are doing this with every team as well.

Basically all they are doing is deleting some bottom players/players close to retirement and then plugging 7-8 prospects into the holes and calling it a day.

Over the last three years, the Flames have graduated six prospects I believe. Monahan, Gaudreau, Ferland, Bennett, Tkachuk, and Jooris.

Will they graduate more than that in the next 3 years? I'd be interested in what the league average is per season. Probably not more than 1-2 per year would be my guess.

Just write an article on each team's top ten prospects. It would be better than this IMO.

How would that be better? Isn't it better to include the young players that are already on their team as opposed to just the prospects? Guys like Connor McDavid for instance? What would be the point about talking about the Oilers 3 years from now and not including him?

[savardandjokinen]

Originally Posted by OutOfTheCube

Articles like these are basically pointless. Obviously it's impossible to predict trades and drafts and free agency to any reasonably accurate degree, so at that point, why even bother?

This was the roster three years ago:

Jiri Hudler
Johnny Gaudreau
Sean Monahan
Dennis Wideman
Mark Giordano
T.J. Brodie
Lance Bouma
Kris Russell
David Jones
Curtis Glencross
Joe Colborne
Mikael Backlund
Josh Jooris
Mason Raymond
Paul Byron
Markus Granlund
Matt Stajan
Deryk Engelland
Micheal Ferland
Brandon Bollig
Raphael Diaz
Sven Baertschi
Drew Shore
Sam Bennett
Emile Poirier
Ladislav Smid
Jonas Hiller
Corban Knight
Brett Kulak
Brian McGrattan
Joni Ortio
Corey Potter
John Ramage
Karri Ramo
Max Reinhart
David Schlemko
Devin Setoguchi
David Wolf
Tyler Wotherspoon

That's an almost 80% turn-over! In 3 years.

You forgot to bold Kulak

[Oil Stain]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

How would that be better? Isn't it better to include the young players that are already on their team as opposed to just the prospects? Guys like Connor McDavid for instance? What would be the point about talking about the Oilers 3 years from now and not including him?

If they are talking about the future roster I guess I'd rather see the spaces needing filling left blank rather than all of the prospects plugged into those holes.

It's not going to work like that.

Boston for instance has their second line three years from now listed as:
Bjork-(Forsbacka-Karlsson)-Senyshyn.

I'd project the odds of that happening at about zero percent.

If a lot of fans like it how THN has written it, that's great. I'm just not a fan of the format.

[OutOfTheCube]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

A lot of those guys were not expected to be long term pieces at that point in time. The one guy that stands out as a guy some of us expected to be with us right now is probably Byron. That was a bizarre move that pre-season.

There's also Ortio and maybe that would have gone differently had we acquired a proven 60 game starter like Bishop last year.

I would say the Flames probably have a higher than average turn-over from 3 years ago due to being in a re-build. But even solid, contending teams have probably turned over 50-60% of their roster from 3 years ago. I just perused over the Penguins roster from 3 years ago -- basically the whole bottom 9 is changed, and half the defense. Some filled with prospects, some with trades/free agents, and other spots with guys nobody had even heard of 3 years ago.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by FBI

Loved the article slightly below as well about a 2016 redraft. Parsons up to #20. Tkachuk up to#3.

Not to be greedy, but surprised Fox isn't in the early 2nd rounders as well (at least)

[Gaudfather]

Originally Posted by keenan87

I would be curious to know what the mood would be next offseason if both Smith and Lack disappoint... I think he is a great GM but should that be the final straw for Treliving?

What Treliving has done with the goaltending situation last year and this year is take measured approaches with limited financial risk. Essentially he is buying time until one if the in-house developed goalie prospects is ready.

Can you imagine if he did a MAF or Ben Bishop deal with big term and dollars and that didn't work out? Then he would be crucified. He is opting for a lower risk approach, understanding he may catch more flak in the short term, but hoping this is the right thing for the Flames in the medium to longer term.

[FiveSeven]

I want Tree forever...

[MarkGio]

Some of those players listed have to pass through waivers this fall. I can't see teams passing up on Poirer, Shinkaruk, and/or Klimchuck.

[Vulcan]

Originally Posted by MarkGio

Some of those players listed have to pass through waivers this fall. I can't see teams passing up on Poirer, Shinkaruk, and/or Klimchuck.

Klimchuck is waiver exempt. IMO The other two will probably pass.

[PlayfulGenius]

I'd take that Flames lineup over any of the other teams they've done this far (albeit there's only 4 others, I think)

Buffalo should likely move of their Top 3 C for help on D and in G.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by MarkGio

Some of those players listed have to pass through waivers this fall. I can't see teams passing up on Poirer, Shinkaruk, and/or Klimchuck.

Every team has players like that who they will be waiving at the same time, and if you claim them on waivers they have to stay with the NHL club for the year or be exposed to waivers again.

There are only a couple of teams with so little talent that claiming one of these players would be worthwhile, and even then I doubt they do it since these aren't names that scream high end NHL potential.

I wouldn't worry. This conversation happens every year and 99.99% of the time none of the players around the league are claimed.

[1qqaaz]

I just realized that the Flames may have had an extremely strong 2016 draft (forgive me for being slow). Tkachuk, Parsons and Fox maybe all be worthy of first round picks in a re-draft.
Three great players at 3 different positions.

Reminds me of the 2011 draft, in which every pick looked promising after a year. From those 5 picks, only Gaudreau and Wotherspoon are on the Flames, but it's still possible that all 5 of them have NHL careers.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by keenan87

I would be curious to know what the mood would be next offseason if both Smith and Lack disappoint... I think he is a great GM but should that be the final straw for Treliving?

I doubt that very much.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

Every team has players like that who they will be waiving at the same time, and if you claim them on waivers they have to stay with the NHL club for the year or be exposed to waivers again.

There are only a couple of teams with so little talent that claiming one of these players would be worthwhile, and even then I doubt they do it since these aren't names that scream high end NHL potential.

I wouldn't worry. This conversation happens every year and 99.99% of the time none of the players around the league are claimed.

I think this year is slightly different with the expansion team Vegas in the mix. They have a thin lineup up front and if they sustain any injuries in training camp they may be looking to waivers to gamble on some young talent that would be fringe NHLers on most teams.

While I agree with your assessment most years I actually think Vegas may be in a position to gamble on guys along the lines of Shinkaruk. Wouldn't surprise me at all if they grab a forward or two off waivers this fall in an attempt to add a young scorer who might be top two line material for them and no one else.

[Huntingwhale]

Originally Posted by keenan87

I would be curious to know what the mood would be next offseason if both Smith and Lack disappoint... I think he is a great GM but should that be the final straw for Treliving?

Hell no. Not even close. Yeah it would suck if both goalies crapped the bed. But goaltending is but 1 piece of the puzzle. BT has:

- Built a top D on paper and put the team in a great positional defensively going forward, with good contracts from 1-6. Gio's might be a bit worrisome at the end, but he was still top 8 is Norris voting last season. He was part of one of the top pairs last season with Hamilton AND seasons prior with Brodie. He is still worth it.

-He's given us a balanced forward group with good depth and skill. Still need a top 6 RW spot, but that very well might come from within if Ferland takes the next step. We have great C depth finally after 20+ years.

-The Flames drafting is doing great, with a recent ranking in the top 10 list.

-The man wins trades. Literally every trade he's made (unless someone can point out a bad one that has handicapped us) the Flames have profited from. Did Feaster win all his trades? Did Sutter? Who was the last Flames GM whom you had full confidence going into trade talks with other GMs, Fletcher maybe? Trades are a huge part of a GM's job. Treliving. Wins. Trades.

-Oh and we have an extremely deep prospect pool of goaltenders, with the perfect stop gap plan of 2 years ala Smith, with a decent chance at least one of them panning out.

So in what world would you throw all of that away and have to start over again by bringing in a new GM because the freakin' goalies, one single piece of the puzzle, bomb? Fire the GM if ALL of those components start failing (like it did with Sutter). I don't think a single person can argue with a straight face that BT hasn't done a phenomenal job in most areas.

Nope, let's fire the guy who put all that together

[Southside]

Rather than a new thread I thought I would park these here.

The Hockey Writers and Ron MacLean like the Flames off season.

http://thehockeywriters.com/10-nhl-t...p-for-2017-18/

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/r...marleau-vegas/