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Old 02-13-2018, 07:29 AM   #281
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Of course it affects the overall picture. That's the intent of mentioning it over and over.

The amount of times I have heard drunk armed thugs in this conversation (all over the web) is crazy. Stanley did not see drunk armed thugs. No one assaulted them before the shot was fired.

I'm not saying they were there selling cookies but it is easy to sway opinion when you paint a picture.

Country kids drink on the backroads and get into all sorts of trouble, white or native. From all accounts that's what Stanley was dealing with. Drunk kids/young adults. When the bullets started flying they were running, which was the desired result, but they weren't fighting.

It's only after that we see a checkered past and people rest easy because thank god they had gangster pics on social media.
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Old 02-13-2018, 07:44 AM   #282
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Of course it affects the overall picture. That's the intent of mentioning it over and over.

The amount of times I have heard drunk armed thugs in this conversation (all over the web) is crazy. Stanley did not see drunk armed thugs. No one assaulted them before the shot was fired.

I'm not saying they were there selling cookies but it is easy to sway opinion when you paint a picture.

Country kids drink on the backroads and get into all sorts of trouble, white or native. From all accounts that's what Stanley was dealing with. Drunk kids/young adults. When the bullets started flying they were running, which was the desired result, but they weren't fighting.

It's only after that we see a checkered past and people rest easy because thank god they had gangster pics on social media.

err last time I looked a vehicle is a weapon. On top of that they tried to steal a truck at the last farm, using the .22 gun butt to try and break the window. They drove into his yard and attempted to steal his ATV, then ran into his wifes suv, They admitted drinking the whole day.........If that does not constitute drunk armed thugs, kindly explain to me what does?
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Old 02-13-2018, 07:47 AM   #283
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I find it interesting in that the federal government now seems poised to act quickly on some judicial reforms; however, I don't here much talk about water quality on reserves of health care - two items that likely affect far more indigenous people that judicial matters.
Iím not entirely convinced of this. In any event, changes to the justice system are likely far less expensive to implement than building hospitals and water treatment plants near remote reserves. So, suffice to say, the governments should take some steps to address all of these issues at some point but I donít see anything absurd about prioritizing the justice system at this point in time.
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Old 02-13-2018, 07:48 AM   #284
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Of course it affects the overall picture. That's the intent of mentioning it over and over.

The amount of times I have heard drunk armed thugs in this conversation (all over the web) is crazy. Stanley did not see drunk armed thugs. No one assaulted them before the shot was fired.

I'm not saying they were there selling cookies but it is easy to sway opinion when you paint a picture.

Country kids drink on the backroads and get into all sorts of trouble, white or native. From all accounts that's what Stanley was dealing with. Drunk kids/young adults. When the bullets started flying they were running, which was the desired result, but they weren't fighting.

It's only after that we see a checkered past and people rest easy because thank god they had gangster pics on social media.
The background of Boushie and the others aside, he wasn't simply dealing with drunk kids.

When he fired the warning shots, he believed that he was dealing with a vehicle full of thieves who had just tried to steal two of his vehicles and had used theirs to run over and pin his wife. The gun was never intentionally pointed at anyone and he believed that it was unloaded when he approached the car to turn it off.

Even not knowing that he was in fact dealing with a group of intoxicated adults who were in the process of committing armed robberies, the law allows for his actions. People who are saying that "life is more important than property" are missing the point entirely. Not only was Boushie not shot intentionally, Stanley didn't get his gun out in response to straight property theft.

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Old 02-13-2018, 07:52 AM   #285
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From all accounts I've heard no one brandished a weapon and Stanley did not recognize it as such so in his mind he was not dealing with armed thugs. Calling them such paints a picture that does nothing but justify the shooting.
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Old 02-13-2018, 07:56 AM   #286
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Even not knowing that he was in fact dealing with a group of intoxicated adults who were in the process of committing armed robberies, the law allows for his actions.
Yes, he was justified in firing in the air. Where it went wrong was not maintaining control over the weapon and having it fire when pointed at another person. This is why I think manslaughter was an appropriate verdict.

But he was not justified in shooting at anyone in self defense. Mainly because they weren't armed.
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Old 02-13-2018, 08:00 AM   #287
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Country kids drink on the backroads and get into all sorts of trouble, white or native.
Oh please. We don't need to justify their actions to take a look at Gerald Stanley's.

There's no need to paint this as country kids out for a good time. First off, he was 22. He's not a kid in any sense of the word. And no, country kids are not driving around in the backroads with loaded guns using them to break into vehicles while out on a crime spree blackout drunk. That's not a normal weekday for your average country kid.

Does that mean the shooting was justified? Of course not. But let's not
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Old 02-13-2018, 08:01 AM   #288
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Yes, he was justified in firing in the air. Where it went wrong was not maintaining control over the weapon and having it fire when pointed at another person. This is why I think manslaughter was an appropriate verdict.

But he was not justified in shooting at anyone in self defense. Mainly because they weren't armed.
WHich is easyto say with the limited details the media chooses to report. The jury who listened to all the information disagreed.
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Old 02-13-2018, 08:02 AM   #289
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Manslaughter still requires intent unless I read the legal code all wrong. Negligence causing
a wrongful death? Is that a charge?
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Old 02-13-2018, 08:03 AM   #290
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Mainly because they weren't armed.
Well, that's incorrect. They were armed. He just didn't know it.

Which sort of lends credence to his story, all he had to do was wait for the cops to get their and say that they had a loaded gun, which they did, and feared for his life and they may not even press charges.

The "I accidentally shot him" defense was obviously going to lead to charges, and probably had a much higher rate of incarceration.
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Old 02-13-2018, 08:03 AM   #291
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From all accounts I've heard no one brandished a weapon and Stanley did not recognize it as such so in his mind he was not dealing with armed thugs. Calling them such paints a picture that does nothing but justify the shooting.
Vehicles are enough of a weapon for me. From what I've heard it is really common for young people to trespass on farms in the area without the best intentions. It most commonly results in theft and property damage. And it's a serious on going problem. I don't know if that's true but even around here (Priddis) I would never expect the best case scenario if a group of anybody rolled up to my place with a flat tire and tried starting my atv and ran over my stuff.
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Old 02-13-2018, 08:13 AM   #292
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Yes, he was justified in firing in the air. Where it went wrong was not maintaining control over the weapon and having it fire when pointed at another person. This is why I think manslaughter was an appropriate verdict.

But he was not justified in shooting at anyone in self defense. Mainly because they weren't armed.
They didn't have the evidence to he acted with wanton or reckless disregard for others though or that he committed a crime which resulted in the death, both of which can be used to reach a manslaughter finding.

I think a key part of the reason the jury found that his actions were not reckless was Stanley's belief that he had only loaded two rounds and after he had fired, he took steps to render the firearm safe before approaching the car to turn it off.

And before people jump on me for believing Stanley's testimony, it's up to the Crown to show guilt, there is no burden on the accused to prove their innocence. Stanley testified as to what transpired and the Crown had no evidence that showed otherwise.

To the final point, a vehicle can be used as a weapon.

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Old 02-13-2018, 08:19 AM   #293
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I'm not trying to paint these kids as valedictorians. I'm just having a hard time with the villanizing, and I'm seeing a lot that is just vile (not here). It's frustrating cause it's not all fair. A young man lost his life in a f'd up situation, and I get that it wasn't the farmer who started it.

There is a growing movement to arms in rural areas, I see posts all the time from freinds who want texas style laws, concealed carry etc. People want to shoot people over property and they are doing what they can to paint this group as a roving band of criminals which justified killing one. It's not right.

There were options for Stanley, he and his son left the conflict and returned to it. He saw his wife was not under the SUV before the shot, they could have retreated to their home, armed and waited it out. It could have turned out different.

I've thought it through many times, I live alone on a farm at least 20 minutes from police assistance. I don't have a gun and I wouldn't use one to try and scare people off. I just don't want to take the chance of killing someone. Call me naive.

People are mad about theft and want to take out that anger and I know lots of people who think this was actually a good thing. I can accept that people don't think Stanley should have gone to jail but to celebrate a young mans death make's me sick.
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Old 02-13-2018, 08:21 AM   #294
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already addressed...nm
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Old 02-13-2018, 08:24 AM   #295
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At the same time, you have to appreciate that people are also frustrated by the attempts by the media to portray this as a racist white farmer who shot a bunch of children who were just looking for help fixing their car.

All the facts are known, but half truths and omissions are still being used try and drive a particular agenda. And apparently now, a push for a more race based legal system.
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Old 02-13-2018, 08:24 AM   #296
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Be that as it may, it still shows the attitude that he had towards authority
Jesus Christ dude.
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Old 02-13-2018, 08:31 AM   #297
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Jesus Christ dude.
I once ended an article I wrote for a school paper with this quote:

Flossing a Benz on rims that isn't stolen
My dreams is censored, my hopes are gone
I'm like a fiend that finally sees when all the dope is gone
My nerves is wrecked, heart beating and my hands are swollen
Thinking of the G's I'll be holdin', picture me rollin'


shutter to think what people would interpret that to mean.
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Old 02-13-2018, 08:33 AM   #298
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I once ended an article I wrote for a school paper with this quote:

Flossing a Benz on rims that isn't stolen
My dreams is censored, my hopes are gone
I'm like a fiend that finally sees when all the dope is gone
My nerves is wrecked, heart beating and my hands are swollen
Thinking of the G's I'll be holdin', picture me rollin'


shutter to think what people would interpret that to mean.
#biggieforlife
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Old 02-13-2018, 08:58 AM   #299
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Well, that's incorrect. They were armed. He just didn't know it.

Which sort of lends credence to his story, all he had to do was wait for the cops to get their and say that they had a loaded gun, which they did, and feared for his life and they may not even press charges.

The "I accidentally shot him" defense was obviously going to lead to charges, and probably had a much higher rate of incarceration.
Go back and read the testimony

They tried to back the car into him. They then ran their car at his son. They then rammed another vehicle, and Stanley was convinced that his wife had been hit.

If we want to go to state of mind, he stated that he wanted the vehicle off, not because of some kind of citizen arrest, but he thought his wife was under the car. That's the transcript of the record.

And frankly lets not try to soften it up that these people were like the dukes of hazzard out driving the back roads while a little drunk having some harmless fun.

He went to get his gun because he felt threatened, and maybe justifiable so. He also thought his wife had been hit.


At the same time, the trial wasn't about his state of mind, or a self defense defense. It was about the technical aspect of the gun firing.

Did he intentionally shoot Boushie?
Did the gun unexpectedly go off?


Was there intent?

Right now who knows, the only guy who really does is Stanley, but there wasn't enough put in front of the jury to convict.

And right now, the simplest thing for the government to try to do is a cosmetic fix to the courts, "We need more natives in the jury".

I still contend that if there was reasonable doubt it shouldn't matter if there ware whites, chinese, or natives on the jury. Can you render a fair verdict given the facts presented in the case? Do you understand what things like reasonable doubt are?

What we're hearing basically is that the jury is being painted as racists. I'm guessing in the court of public opinion, no matter what the evidence no matter how bad the witnesses were or that the RCMP couldn't provide compelling proof that Stanley should have been convicted of something, because now the justice system has to be about more then justice, it has to be a tool for public sentiment.

We can talk about why there weren't natives on the jury when you have a pool of 750 and each side has 12 strikes. Is there a transcript or record of the jury selection and why people were struck from the jury pool. Did someone stack it so the first 100 people in the jury list were all whites?
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Old 02-13-2018, 09:10 AM   #300
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I'm not trying to paint these kids as valedictorians. I'm just having a hard time with the villanizing, and I'm seeing a lot that is just vile (not here). It's frustrating cause it's not all fair. A young man lost his life in a f'd up situation, and I get that it wasn't the farmer who started it.
Again, you made the conscious effort to call them kids to defend your own narrative that his wasn't an adult criminal. He wasn't a kid.

I'm sorry, but when you decide to start a crime spree with a loaded weapon and put innocent people at risks for your life, it's not villainizing, it's simply being a villain.

With that said, yes, he didn't deserve to die and yes, I believe it's an extremely unfortunate situation. But with all the injustices in the world, you should be able to understand why some people aren't losing sleep because some criminal with a loaded gun who was on a crime spree is dead.
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