The Minor Hockey Thread

[Northendzone]

my son's team played their second game of EMHW last night and they won 5-3. My son played one of the best games I have seen him play in years.

I feel like we were outshot 40 something to 20.

There is a chance that i strutted a little bit as i left the rink after the game

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by Lubicon

Supposedly to protect officials from abuse. A couple of seasons ago we (coaches and MHA's) received very strict instructions form Hockey Calgary that there was zero tolerance to interact with officials, even to the point of not shaking hands after a game. It's sad it has gotten to this point.

I agree, feedback when done properly is crucial and given that officials are not reviewed every game by their mentors coach feedback would be a great tool. It would be pretty apparent what is constructive and what is just whining by a coach so they could weed that kind of stuff out.

.

Why not have a way for the coach to provide feedback (both good and bad) to the ref association, but require the coach sign his name and make his feedback know to his association.

Officiating is ####ing hard, I tell me players that all the time. They miss stuff and players miss stuff.

If we want to raise the level of referees they need feedback (good and bad).

[Lubicon]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

Why not have a way for the coach to provide feedback (both good and bad) to the ref association, but require the coach sign his name and make his feedback know to his association.

Officiating is ####ing hard, I tell me players that all the time. They miss stuff and players miss stuff.

If we want to raise the level of referees they need feedback (good and bad).

Completely agree.

[MacDaddy77]

Off to the Finals for EMHW Novice 2 South!!

[Northendzone]

Off to the finals for midget aa. First time to the dance

[MacDaddy77]

CHAMPS!! Novice 2 South

[brocoli]

Originally Posted by Lubicon

Completely agree.

We do have a system in place of supervisions which senior officials go out and supervise younger officials. The problem that we have always had is the time commitment to have people volunteer throughout the year. There are only so many senior guys and when the numbers get thinned out like that it becomes a challenge to get supervisors.

So we do really have 2 options. Either we pay supervisors (which increases all fees and we do not want that) or we have a coach feed back which could also turn ugly.

When having conversations with a few retired senior officials (level 6's), they all say the same thing. Hockey has become too fast of a game and Alberta is the further behind in officiating. We need to move to the 2 ref 1 linesman system as in other provinces or else 4 officials. The officials are few and far between that can keep a level head enough while keeping up with the play to see everything. I personally would love to see us go to the 2-1 system as other provinces have. It allows the back official to see the incidents away from the play while allowing the front official to concentrate on the puck and surround players.

Congrats to all of you as well on MHW.

[Lubicon]

I understand the lack of personnel and un-practicalness (if that is a word) of supervising more games, that is just the reality. I also understand why there is not more coach feedback and that is unfortunate as I like to think many coaches would offer constructive reviews but it's always the few jacka$$es that mess it up for everyone. So it is what it is.

I'm intrigued by the 2-1 system, I have not heard of that before. I assume the '1' is one linesman, if so then there is one person responsible for calling offside, icing etc. or do the referees help with that as well. Just curious as to how it works in practice.

[Boblobla]

Originally Posted by MacDaddy77

CHAMPS!! Novice 2 South

Congratulations. My older son plays for the Mavs Div 2 team, we were finished on Sunday. We have been on the receiving end of a few shellings from your team.

I guess with 4 southwest teams in Div 2 Major Novice it was inevitable that one of the southwest teams won...

[brocoli]

Originally Posted by Lubicon

I understand the lack of personnel and un-practicalness (if that is a word) of supervising more games, that is just the reality. I also understand why there is not more coach feedback and that is unfortunate as I like to think many coaches would offer constructive reviews but it's always the few jacka$$es that mess it up for everyone. So it is what it is.

I'm intrigued by the 2-1 system, I have not heard of that before. I assume the '1' is one linesman, if so then there is one person responsible for calling offside, icing etc. or do the referees help with that as well. Just curious as to how it works in practice.

Yes, the 2-1 has the 1 as strictly a linesman, however just as the 2-person system, the back "ref" calls the icings going his way if needed as well as makes the call at the blue lines for teams entering the zone. When it is not their zone the act as a linesman who can call penalties if need be.

[Lubicon]

Originally Posted by brocoli

Yes, the 2-1 has the 1 as strictly a linesman, however just as the 2-person system, the back "ref" calls the icings going his way if needed as well as makes the call at the blue lines for teams entering the zone. When it is not their zone the act as a linesman who can call penalties if need be.

That makes a lot of sense, would like to see it implemented here too. I suppose the possible downside is you need two qualified referees rather than one for a game. Might be tougher to find the bodies at older or higher skilled levels. One ref / two lines works with younger/less experienced linesmen and two man system works at lower levels but hard to keep up at higher levels.

I watched a guy do a MAAA female game by himself a couple of years ago when he was the only one who showed up.

[Nancy]

Here is a map of some of the proposed boundary changes in Calgary. The first few pages are dedicated to the Springbank-Glenlake-Trailswest area, but the last page shows the whole city. They are proposing to create a new association on the West side of the city, the last link is an open letter of opposition from the executives of these clubs to Hockey Calgary.

Map: http://springbankhockey.com/files/ma..._proposals.pdf

HC Slides: http://springbankhockey.com/files/bo...-_dec_2018.pdf

Letter: http://springbankhockey.com/files/jo...an_23_2019.pdf

EDIT: The opposition seems to be related to wanting to keep associations large so that Tier 1 teams can be competitive provincially. They should just move Peewee AA into the existing quadrant system, which is consistent with what is done outside the city (e.g. SCAHL.).

[hixxes]

Maybe I'm missing something, but the only map I see is of the current configuration. The first two links are the same presentation.

[Nancy]

Originally Posted by hixxes

Maybe I'm missing something, but the only map I see is of the current configuration. The first two links are the same presentation.

Oops... fixed, but here is the link on its own:

http://springbankhockey.com/files/ma..._proposals.pdf

[hixxes]

Thanks for posting!

[Derek Sutton]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

Why not have a way for the coach to provide feedback (both good and bad) to the ref association, but require the coach sign his name and make his feedback know to his association.

Officiating is ####ing hard, I tell me players that all the time. They miss stuff and players miss stuff.

If we want to raise the level of referees they need feedback (good and bad).

Originally Posted by Lubicon

Completely agree.

Originally Posted by brocoli

We do have a system in place of supervisions which senior officials go out and supervise younger officials. The problem that we have always had is the time commitment to have people volunteer throughout the year. There are only so many senior guys and when the numbers get thinned out like that it becomes a challenge to get supervisors.

So we do really have 2 options. Either we pay supervisors (which increases all fees and we do not want that) or we have a coach feed back which could also turn ugly.

When having conversations with a few retired senior officials (level 6's), they all say the same thing. Hockey has become too fast of a game and Alberta is the further behind in officiating. We need to move to the 2 ref 1 linesman system as in other provinces or else 4 officials. The officials are few and far between that can keep a level head enough while keeping up with the play to see everything. I personally would love to see us go to the 2-1 system as other provinces have. It allows the back official to see the incidents away from the play while allowing the front official to concentrate on the puck and surround players.

Congrats to all of you as well on MHW.

Coach feedback opens a whole new can of worms, unnecessary/ uninformed input from from coaches is the last thing that will help develop officials. Practically every coach in hockey believes that the rules are, or should be, more lienient in the final 5 minutes then the first 55 minutes. "But he didn't mean to" is not a reason to not penalize a player for tripping another player and I've dealt with coaches who believe the penalties should be even to both teams not matter what.

Most coaches do not even no the rules themselves. What constitutes a 10 minute misconduct, how does the line change procedure work, why is it a four minute head contact penalty and not a two minute penalty and why was the icing waived off???? My personal, experienced (but nowhere near professional) position on this is that all head coaches take the reffereing course and officiate, or do lines for a minimum of 5 games each year.


As for evaluating and guiding younger officials this has to be handled by more senior refs. And really just assign a senior ref to the game as well, he can get a cut of the refs fees but is not on the ice and he can watch the game from the stands and evaluate the refs on the ice.

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by Nancy

Here is a map of some of the proposed boundary changes in Calgary. The first few pages are dedicated to the Springbank-Glenlake-Trailswest area, but the last page shows the whole city. They are proposing to create a new association on the West side of the city, the last link is an open letter of opposition from the executives of these clubs to Hockey Calgary.

Map: http://springbankhockey.com/files/ma..._proposals.pdf

HC Slides: http://springbankhockey.com/files/bo...-_dec_2018.pdf

Letter: http://springbankhockey.com/files/jo...an_23_2019.pdf

EDIT: The opposition seems to be related to wanting to keep associations large so that Tier 1 teams can be competitive provincially. They should just move Peewee AA into the existing quadrant system, which is consistent with what is done outside the city (e.g. SCAHL.).

This might be an unpopular suggestion but maybe Hockey Calgary should boot Springbank out of the organization and make them play in Hockey Alberta with the likes of Cochrane, Airdrie, Okotoks, etc.

Maybe realignment might be easier/better done without Springbank.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by Derek Sutton

Coach feedback opens a whole new can of worms, unnecessary/ uninformed input from from coaches is the last thing that will help develop officials. Practically every coach in hockey believes that the rules are, or should be, more lienient in the final 5 minutes then the first 55 minutes. "But he didn't mean to" is not a reason to not penalize a player for tripping another player and I've dealt with coaches who believe the penalties should be even to both teams not matter what.

Most coaches do not even no the rules themselves. What constitutes a 10 minute misconduct, how does the line change procedure work, why is it a four minute head contact penalty and not a two minute penalty and why was the icing waived off???? My personal, experienced (but nowhere near professional) position on this is that all head coaches take the reffereing course and officiate, or do lines for a minimum of 5 games each year.

What if part of the coach feedback if also coach education.

Education can't be a bad thing can it?

As for evaluating and guiding younger officials this has to be handled by more senior refs. And really just assign a senior ref to the game as well, he can get a cut of the refs fees but is not on the ice and he can watch the game from the stands and evaluate the refs on the ice.

I think it is difficult and dangerous to guide young officials in a vacuum without external feedback.

To be clear I am not advocating a blind feedback coaches should have to put there name to their feedback and include their association as well.

One of the problems I see in a number of sports if the officiating fraternity only looks internally. They don't seek any external feedback and when they receive external feedback it is often met with the same response "you coaches don't know the rules" or "do you ref, you don't like it then you should ref".

Open communication can only benefit the game and quality of both officiating and coaching, hell it might even help identify and get rid of ####### coaches.

[Lubicon]

Originally Posted by calgarygeologist

This might be an unpopular suggestion but maybe Hockey Calgary should boot Springbank out of the organization and make them play in Hockey Alberta with the likes of Cochrane, Airdrie, Okotoks, etc.

Maybe realignment might be easier/better done without Springbank.

Certainly worth at least considering I would think. Nothing is unsurmountable but keep in mind the following if this were to happen:

1. Sprinbank is unique in that it consists of players from both within and outside the City of Calgary. Assuming all City kids would stay inside Hockey Calgary then they would need an association to play in.

2. I don't know the exact split, but considering my point above I'm not sure how many kids would actually leave Hockey Calgary by doing this. The end result is there may not be a significant reduction in player numbers.

3. Hockey Calgary would 'lose' access to the ice that Springbank utilizes - Springbank School and to some extend Edge School.

4. Calgary Royals (quadrant/elite) would lose players. Woudl this significantly affect them?

5. where would Springbank players go to play Elite hockey? (choice of two associations - based in Airdrie and Okotoks)

I would think access to ice (and loss of ice) would be major factors as it seems this always comes into play.

But I've always wondered why Springbank kids did not play out of Cochrane to begin with.

[showtime]

Originally Posted by Lubicon

Certainly worth at least considering I would think. Nothing is unsurmountable but keep in mind the following if this were to happen:

1. Sprinbank is unique in that it consists of players from both within and outside the City of Calgary. Assuming all City kids would stay inside Hockey Calgary then they would need an association to play in.

2. I don't know the exact split, but considering my point above I'm not sure how many kids would actually leave Hockey Calgary by doing this. The end result is there may not be a significant reduction in player numbers.

3. Hockey Calgary would 'lose' access to the ice that Springbank utilizes - Springbank School and to some extend Edge School.

4. Calgary Royals (quadrant/elite) would lose players. Woudl this significantly affect them?

5. where would Springbank players go to play Elite hockey? (choice of two associations - based in Airdrie and Okotoks)

I won't comment on the other aspects but in terms of elite hockey, it would significantly impact NWCAA and Royals.