Black Panther: Wakanda Forever

[Finger Cookin]

Not a fan of Riri/Ironheart from the comics I take it?

[Cecil Terwilliger]

I can't recall a single comic I've ever read that she appeared in, so I can't say I have any opinion at all on the comic character.

The movie version was awful though.

Edit: Apparently she appeared once or twice in Ta Nehisi's BP run but I don't specifically remember her.

[#-3]

Spoiler free review. Cecil's 95% right.

Spoiler!

Also if half of Asgards solders are always dead, are 75% of Wakandas solders always dead? If you're going war with fish people, then maybe let them attack you on land instead of rowing a boat out to the middle of the ocean.

Riri was terrible, I'd like to hope they slow down with new characters for a bit in ph5 and consolidate their gains, but we already have the Blacde & F4 & Xmen coming, so that seems unlikely. Maybe marvels miraculous casting department is finally bumping up against its limits.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

one day they'll run out of household name actors that haven't played marvel roles

I believe a couple of actors have played multiple roles too including hailed steinfeld (Gwen + .. archer girl)

[Nadal Fan]

One thing that I really enjoyed is the tone of the film. Wasn't throwing in jokes to break tension or having actors say quips every 30 seconds.

One thing I didn't like was the Midnight Angel suit, why cover her up and with something that didn't translate to screen.

[Finger Cookin]

Riri was a not insignificant part of the Champions team in the comic, which which basically had Ms. Marvel, Miles Morales Spider-Man, and the kid with a Nova suit (Sam Alexander, had to Google it) at the front and center. Viv Vision, one of Vision's kids from the excellent Tom King series, was also a long standing member as a few other people would come and go.

Young Avengers in the comics featured a lot of characters already introduced in the MCU, including Kate Bishop, Billy and Tommy (Wanda's kids from Wandavison), Cassie Lang, and a few more.

I think we might see some hybrid of these two teams show up in the MCU down the road - not sure if they'll brand themselves as Champions or Young Avengers, but a team of these newer, younger heroes is almost a certainty.

Whether that will happen in theaters or on Disney+ remains to be seen.

[Hack&Lube]

Apparently making the movie was a bit of a gong show as Letitia Wright who plays Shuri was refusing Covid measures, spreading vaccine conspiracies, and spreading anti-LGBT+ toxicity.

That the movie seems like it's replacing Chadwick Boseman with her makes this an easily skipped Marvel movie for me.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Lol wut? Got some sources on that?

Do you also skip Chris Pratt movies because he’s a white supremacist?

[GreenLantern]

Hrmm interesting to read these reviews, when I read the plot details I actually thought it sounded better than I expected. But it seems like they had trouble translating that to the big screen.

I at least hope Namor was well done. He's a great character and I know the actor seemed very passionate about the role.

The Marvel movies initially were speaking to their target audience, comic book fans. Then by the time we got to End Game even the general public was drawn in. I remember going to see it in one of those VIP or whatever theatres where you can order drinks. And there was a Madisynn type girl sitting in front of me drinking cosmos. She was already pretty lit up and was telling her friend she hadn't even seen any of the movies really and just came for the drinks and hot guys in tights. I was like oh great, shes going to ruin this for me.

By the time Tony Stark was laying there saying his good byes I heard someone sobbing. Took me a few minutes to realize it was this same girl, lol. Literally so enthralled in the movie she was shedding tears.

I think Marvel got greedy with this reach, I think they think they have more influence and a larger more diversified audience than they actually do. I'm not saying you don't lean into all cultures, I'm not trying to make this about that. But what I am saying is you need to remember who buys the tickets. So many people I've talked to just have zero interest in a Shuri Black Panther. It's very evident even in this thread. Why not just take a beat and re cast the actor. There are so many good actors out there that could have stepped into that role.

This also coming on the back of a lead toy designer leaking that the MCU is looking to use Fox X-Men characters in timeline/universe cross over cameos, but introduce the actual MCU version as mainly race and gender swapped from the Fox/Comic version. Including dropping the name and just referring to them as Mutants. What is the real motive here? Best person for the role or what they think is best for the role?

[GGG]

I enjoyed it.

I liked it involved the Earth geopolitics and that should have several good future instalments

I agree with the riri comments, she was not great also her suit looked like a transformer. And the strategy to engage in the ocean was terrible.

Spoiler!

I really liked the killmonger cameo and thought that worked really well

Did M’baka force Shuri to leave? And does he have US backing? I suspect he has betrayed Wakanda

I also like the portrayal as the western world as colonizers.

I think that after Avatar 2 this will be tough to watch as they went with the dark underwater scenes to avoid having to have a lot of detail whereas Avatar looks bright and detailed so there will be a step change in our expectations for effects.

All of my critiques are minor and as a guy who thought Namor sucked in the comics I was pleasantly surprised with the changes.

Solid instalment worth going to.

[FormerPresJamesTaylor]

Really boring, Shuri is a fantastic side character, that's it.

[FormerPresJamesTaylor]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Fatigue is definitely starting to set in. Superhero movies have been around for decades so they are never going to disappear but their popularity will eventually decline and it's safe to say they have peaked already. Slow decline will likely ensue in the coming years as all movie genres are all susceptible to cycles. It won't be over night as I believe it will be like Westerns where the decline is gradual over decades.

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

How is it safe to say they’ve peaked?

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Very safe.

Very safe? lmao, that doesn't answer Cecil's question

[Itse]

Holy crap what a terrible thread this is, yeah I'm just gonna take my movie discussion elsewhere.

Wow.

[#-3]

Originally Posted by GGG

Spoiler!

I really liked the killmonger cameo and thought that worked really well

Did M’baka force Shuri to leave? And does he have US backing? I suspect he has betrayed Wakanda

Spoiler!

Agree Jordan was great again.

My read was that Shuri essentially abdicated in favor of him. I also definitely did not get a betrayal impression, but I do think they are going to need important people in leadership positions that they can dispose of this spring (skrulls), and M'Baku would be a top candidate but for the fact that I thing they love the character and the actor and want to use him more.

[#-3]

Originally Posted by GGG

I also like the portrayal as the western world as colonizers.

I don't really know if it is intentional, but in both the Black Panther movies, both the big villains were very big into complaining about the crimes of colonialism while advocating for their people to take very colonial attitudes towards the rest of the world. I haven't been able to pickup on if the link is intentional or not.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by #-3

Spoiler!

Agree Jordan was great again.

My read was that Shuri essentially abdicated in favor of him. I also definitely did not get a betrayal impression, but I do think they are going to need important people in leadership positions that they can dispose of this spring (skrulls), and M'Baku would be a top candidate but for the fact that I thing they love the character and the actor and want to use him more.

Yeah it seemed to me that for both in universe and filmmaking purposes, they didn’t want Shuri to be queen. Gives Mbaku more screen time and opens up Shuri to focus on BP duties. Allows her to play superhero instead of politician. Plus Letitia Wright doesn’t have the acting chops to be queen.

Plus, if she’s as crazy as people say, maybe Disney wants an out if they want a new BP.


Regarding colonialism, I think portraying both villains as being hypocritical and racial superiority zealots was definitely intentional.

[#-3]

nm

[AC]

I liked it overall, but agree with some of the complaints that they could have edited out at least 30 minutes and made it better.

Could have cut out Julia Louis-Dreyfus entirely. Also I had no idea who Ironheart was, but she could have had way less involvement and I think the story would have been better. I get that she has her own comic book history, but it always feels like such a cop-out to have someone conveniently be essentially the smartest person in the world who can make the most advanced technology easily (and also a cool kid!).

Same with the plan to fight the water based army at sea... just a baffling strategy.

I think with 30 minutes cut out it would have been good-great, but it was ok-good as is. Also, Lupita Nyong'o is gorgeous.

[Yeah_Baby]

Good news for all the Ironheart fans, she has her own Disney+ show coming soon.

Originally Posted by Itse

Holy crap what a terrible thread this is, yeah I'm just gonna take my movie discussion elsewhere.

Wow.

?

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Apparently the CIA stuff with Dreyfus and Freeman was to set up the Thunderbolts show.