Insomnia, it sucks

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Ferarri

Thanks, insomnia is the absolute worst.

I've tried Zopiclone and lemorexant and both have had virtually zero success. I've heard that Melatonin strips could be effective so I will attempt to try those. I'm usually pretty good at taking it about an hour to hour and a half before bed.

I haven't tried the glasses for blue light so that's something to add to the list. I've been better about no screen time before bed but practicing better sleep hygiene could be improved on my end.

I found Melatonin stripes to be much better but I can't find them in stores any more or online (if you do find a source for them please PM me).

You may want to ask your doctor about Zopildem. Everyone is different but it's been highly effective for me.

Other potential things to try:
- Don't lie in bed for hours trying to sleep. Basically if you aren't asleep within 30 minutes, you need to reset. Get up. Don't watch TV or get your brain going. Try some breathing, drink some milk. Change the room you are sleeping in. The key is to reset.
- DO NOT LOOK AT THE CLOCK. Ever. The clock is toxic because you'll start calculating the number of hours left you have to sleep and create panic. If you have a clock radio - get rid of it.
- You can consider putting yourself on a sleep program to drive your exhaustion up. I know this seems counter intuitive but it's what my sleep doctor recommended. So he pushed my bed time to 1:30 am and then slowly I worked myself back (in 5 minute increments) to midnight. Sleep happens when you have a balanced relationship between your exhaustion and your mental arousal. So in a world where you are now paniced about your sleep, you need to re-balance that by increasing the exhaustion. People make the mistake, when they are struggling to sleep, of going to bed earlier. What you should do is go to bed later.

Most of all get help. If you are in Calgary I can recommend a good sleep doctor that helped me.

PM me if you ever want to talk about it.

[MoneyGuy]

I sleep with one Bluetooth ear bud listening to music or podcasts. On my Fitbit I consistently score in the 80s. It really helps.

[lucky1]

I used to take melatonin in various doses for jet lag induced insomnia - seemed to work ok until I started getting Aural Migraines - from 1 per year to almost 1 per day. I even got the migraines while sleeping, waking up to fuzzed out vision and vicious brain cramps. I stopped taking the melatonin and bamn, the migraines were reduced right away and now back to a very infrequent status....its strange because melatonin is generally recommended to help alleviate migraines

[calgarywinning]

Try magnesium on a regular basis to level it out.

Melatonin can be effective, but I find I sleep consciously awake on that. Magnesium for the win.

[DoubleF]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

I found Melatonin stripes to be much better but I can't find them in stores any more or online (if you do find a source for them please PM me).

You may want to ask your doctor about Zopildem. Everyone is different but it's been highly effective for me.

Other potential things to try:
- Don't lie in bed for hours trying to sleep. Basically if you aren't asleep within 30 minutes, you need to reset. Get up. Don't watch TV or get your brain going. Try some breathing, drink some milk. Change the room you are sleeping in. The key is to reset.
- DO NOT LOOK AT THE CLOCK. Ever. The clock is toxic because you'll start calculating the number of hours left you have to sleep and create panic. If you have a clock radio - get rid of it.
- You can consider putting yourself on a sleep program to drive your exhaustion up. I know this seems counter intuitive but it's what my sleep doctor recommended. So he pushed my bed time to 1:30 am and then slowly I worked myself back (in 5 minute increments) to midnight. Sleep happens when you have a balanced relationship between your exhaustion and your mental arousal. So in a world where you are now paniced about your sleep, you need to re-balance that by increasing the exhaustion. People make the mistake, when they are struggling to sleep, of going to bed earlier. What you should do is go to bed later.

Most of all get help. If you are in Calgary I can recommend a good sleep doctor that helped me.

PM me if you ever want to talk about it.

If I can't sleep in 20-30 minutes, I get up and do chores. I agree with the no lights and screen time. It sounds silly and arduous, but honestly speaking, it works. I think I can't sleep sometimes worrying about the tasks for the next days that are accumulating. If I can't sleep and reset to "if I can get more than 2-3 hours, bonus!". I think my anxiety reduces while doing chores because the overwhelming task list that I worry about in my mind is getting smaller. Then during the day I'm happy there's less mess or tasks to do and I think it works in a dual manner that way.

Melatonin never worked well for me and I find I'm groggy the next day. One weird thing I used to do that would occasionally work, is to turn the light on and just lie in bed in a sleeping or meditation position. Somehow, I'd sleep and if I nap in such a situation, I'm less groggy than if the lights were off. I don't recall where I read it, but it was something I read and tried before and it has reasonable success.

Agreed on the no clock comment. I'd also suggest looking into an alarm like sleep cycle to install on your phone and/or a light alarm. Sleep cycle tracks sounds and/or movement and will set up a wake up time based on a 10-20 minute time period. It will aim to start the sounds when it perceives you're not in deep sleep. I do find I'm less groggy in the morning and I feel less annoyed/jilted out of bed. The same goes with the light alarm. You can actually install Phillips hue smart bulbs to synchronize with a gentle increase of light to wake you up. Again, I feel better rested when I used that type of alarm than the basic blaring at X time alarms.

[DoubleF]

RE: Melatonin strips. What's the difference between strips and fast dissolving tabs?

https://www.amazon.ca/Zeph-Strips-Ac...49&sr=8-1&th=1

Is this basically what you're looking for? I wonder what the reason was for Jaimeson to discontinue their product.

[lucky1]

Originally Posted by DoubleF

RE: Melatonin strips. What's the difference between strips and fast dissolving tabs?

https://www.amazon.ca/Zeph-Strips-Ac...49&sr=8-1&th=1

Is this basically what you're looking for? I wonder what the reason was for Jaimeson to discontinue their product.

the strips are sublingual - dissolved under the tongue which gets the melatonin in your system extremely fast. Costco used to sell sublingual tablets, not sure if they still do or not.

[D as in David]

Originally Posted by calgarywinning

Try magnesium on a regular basis to level it out.

Melatonin can be effective, but I find I sleep consciously awake on that. Magnesium for the win.

Agreed, although there are many different types of magnesium and some of them can be quite hard on you. Magnesium Glycinate works well for me and I've read that threonate is the form of magnesium that crosses the blood-brain barrier and will assist with sleep and not be absorbed by the gut. Take 2-3 hours before bedtime.

I've tried melatonin in the past with not great results and I also see a lot of research specifically saying you shouldn't take it.

I've posted elsewhere in this thread with tips for setting your circadian clock early in the day.

[Nyah]

Originally Posted by zamler

For me quetiapine has been very effective it helped me get out of the viscous cycle of barely sleeping. You are dead tired and feel awful so you can't sleep properly it's a horrible spriral.

I freaking loved quetiapine for the odd time I just really needed a solid night sleep. I had to be careful though because I'd be groggy in the morning for a while and driving wasn't really an option first thing, so I'd only take it on weekends (if the week had been total #### sleeps). It would knock me out for a good 12 hours. It was an absolute lifesaver for travel too, as I'd routinely get insomnia on vacation. There was absolutely no escaping it, and quetiapine was such a lifesaver.

Unfortunately I've been diagnosed with a heart arrhythmia so I can't take it anymore. My Dr. prescribed trazodone which is an antidepressant for the times I need help sleeping. It's okay, does the trick although it doesn't even come close to the effectiveness of quetiapine.

[zamler]

Originally Posted by Nyah

Unfortunately I've been diagnosed with a heart arrhythmia so I can't take it anymore. My Dr. prescribed trazodone which is an antidepressant for the times I need help sleeping. It's okay, does the trick although it doesn't even come close to the effectiveness of quetiapine.

Sorry to hear that. Any idea why? I found out the hard way that excessive amounts of melatonin cause irregular heartbeat, not suggesting that is your cause normal people don't take high doses. I was desperate and did.

Quetiapine does tend to linger in the morning but that's far better than not sleeping. I love Seroquel (brand name for those that don't know) and always have some on hand even though I don't take it much. Just knowing it's there makes all the difference.

[Locke]

Ugh...anyone else struggling lately?

[Brendone]

Originally Posted by Locke

Ugh...anyone else struggling lately?

If by lately you mean the last 20 years, then yes

[Leeman4Gilmour]

I have not gone through all the pages, but I do hope someone has mentioned Indica gummies. They really give me a deep sleep. Sativa's and/or Hybrid's will end in a deep sleep as well (for me) but you also get high. Which isn't a bad thing.

FWIW, I've never been a fan of smoking weed. Not the act of smoking it, or the product itself, just the effects didn't agree with me (elevated heart rate, almost too high, etc.). But gummies are way different. Again, for me anyway.

They come in bags totaling 10mg of "active ingredient" and vary in the number of gummies. If there's 10 gummies in a bag, that's 1 mg each. If there's 2 gummies, that's 5. Simple. I do the 5's but, start with whatever you want. Oh, and cheap. A 10 mg bag of gummies can be had for less than $5.

[fotze2]

Originally Posted by Locke

Ugh...anyone else struggling lately?

Always. Worst is Sunday night, then Monday night then get less crappy every night until Sunday and it starts over.

I finally could describe what I've had for years and googleMD'd it. Nocturnal Mini-Panic Attacks. Knowing its an actual thing has made it a bit better these past few weeks.

My mind races in the middle of the night and things I said that I regret, or something that I need to do but have been putting off, car is making a sound, got to book that dentist appointment. Thinking I forgot something at work.

Right when falling asleep these things are end of the world and its like having a heart attack (I imagine). Instantly sweating, trembling, heart racing, then it goes away, try to get back to sleep and again. All night from 2-3 am to wake up.

[Doctorfever]

Originally Posted by Leeman4Gilmour

I have not gone through all the pages, but I do hope someone has mentioned Indica gummies. They really give me a deep sleep. Sativa's and/or Hybrid's will end in a deep sleep as well (for me) but you also get high. Which isn't a bad thing.

FWIW, I've never been a fan of smoking weed. Not the act of smoking it, or the product itself, just the effects didn't agree with me (elevated heart rate, almost too high, etc.). But gummies are way different. Again, for me anyway.

They come in bags totaling 10mg of "active ingredient" and vary in the number of gummies. If there's 10 gummies in a bag, that's 1 mg each. If there's 2 gummies, that's 5. Simple. I do the 5's but, start with whatever you want. Oh, and cheap. A 10 mg bag of gummies can be had for less than $5.

I tried them and it didn’t work for me, but I had a friend tell me that my dose was too low (1 mg). So I will try again with a higher dose.

[Tron_fdc]

Have a look for gummies with high CBN. 10mg THC and 10-20MG CBN and I typically sleep great.

My doctor prescribed me ambien and while it works REALLY well, it's super addictive. I found I was taking it to "make sure" I slept, and that has formed a habit that has been difficult to break. I'm currently substituting THC with varied success.

I tried zoplicone and that stuff knocked me out cold for 10 hours. I could sleep through an earthquake and I always woke up with a weird metal taste in my mouth.

Isn't melatonin really bad for you? I thought I read that somewhere. Or maybe it's bad for kids? I don't recall.

[DoubleF]

Is there something that someone can take that seems innocuous enough + doesn't leave the individual groggy the next day?

My wife seems to recently have had something escalate to the point that she has something almost like the nocturnal mini-panic attacks that fotse described. She'll fall asleep easily, then suddenly wake up and cannot go back to sleep. Most of the options like melatonin and cannabis leave her very groggy the next day which increases caffeine intake and then creates a cycle of ups and downs that we believe are exacerbating the issue.

My wife has been trying different things. I'm just wondering if there's something I can try to help it along. I think it'll resolve on its own as I think it's mainly due to the school year starting and a few key illnesses and injuries that have happened in the last few weeks, but I'd like to see if I can speed up the process a wee bit.

[Nage Waza]

My issues were thyroid related, which once medicated reduced my narcolepsy (falling awake while asleep - night visions, paralysis, exploding head, flashing seizure like lights in my eyes, etc.). I was recently diagnosed with REM disruption disorder as well. The cure for me has been a CPAP machine which finally has me sleeping the entire night. The one issue is too much sleep, so there are catch up nights where I can't sleep since I slept too much. Could be worse!

You need to see doctors and get all the testing done, including apnea, thyroid and being very clear about your personal experience.

[Nyah]

My doctor put me on a small daily dose of Sertraline (Zoloft, 50mg/day) earlier this year for anxiety/depression. Along with helping with those two things, it's almost completely reversed my insomnia (which also probably helped my mental health massively). I can almost always fall asleep normally every night, and if I do wake up I can get back to sleep with no issues (most of the time).

Obviously it's not for everyone, but it's been an absolute game changer for me and has vastly improved my quality of sleep, therefore life.

[Jiggy]

I know people who have had insomnia. They said meditation and deep breathing at night helped them get over it. But the duration you spend doing it can be different for everyone. And doing it every night was the important part.