[News] LA Kings buyout Pha9

[mrdonkey]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

The Flames won the Phaneuf trade all day dude

In retrospect... Maybe?

They had no way of knowing Stajan would score the only meaningful goal this franchise has had in 30 years. It wasn’t part of the plan.

But I guess you could call it a win. Still seems kinda lame to label it that way on a fluke.

(For the record, I was excited at the time. But in hindsight it wasn’t that big and was still a something-for-nothing trade.)

[bluejays]

No way the Flames won that deal at the time. Phaneuf was highly regarded around the league for his potential. Daryl jumped the gun out of disappointment and certainly appeared to take the first deal he was given. And that was a headscratcher. No prospects or picks - just veterans with limited upside. It certainly appeared to be a deal out of spite. Now, years later neither team really won, but for Phaneuf at the time you had to have got a kings ransom for the value his name had. The Flames didn't get that.

[Dube]

Funny nobody has commented on the true reason the trade happened.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by Dube

Funny nobody has commented on the true reason the trade happened.

Phaneuf was a selfish player who clashed with the leadership. That’s it.

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

The Flames won the Phaneuf trade all day dude

No they didn't. At the time Phaneuf was a young stud who had a Norris nomination to his name. Even if he deteriorated later, it doesn't mean Sutter got enough. That trade was a flat out waste of a great asset. Don't care that Stajan played a bunch of meh games for the Flames on the back half of his career, the Flames still got taken out to the woodshed on that one.

[Dube]

Originally Posted by Scroopy Noopers

Phaneuf was a selfish player who clashed with the leadership. That’s it.

That sums it up without speaking of why. You’re correct.

Edit: Flames brass were in a rough spot. Surly they could’ve waited for a better package but it was a mess in that locker room.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

The Flames won the Phaneuf trade all day dude

Not even close

Flames traded a 24 year old top 4 D for a collection of mediocre players players from the second worst team in the league. The move was purely intended to get the Flames in the playoffs and try to win with Iggy-Kipper. They would go 5 years missing the playoffs and have nothing to show for the deal.

[btimbit]

I don't think you'll find many people that think Phaneuf should've stayed, but the trade itself wasn't good. Could have gotten way more back

[Locke]

Originally Posted by btimbit

I don't think you'll find many people that think Phaneuf should've stayed, but the trade itself wasn't good. Could have gotten way more back

Theres so many moving pieces in that old trade though.

Granted, overall it was pretty bad, but at the same time it did expedite the coming era of the rebuild.

I dont know, the thing is we were treading water by that point, did it kill us to tread a little longer? It wasnt brilliant asset management by any means and we probably sold low on Phaneuf and maybe at that point could have done better, but I didnt see a lot of assets around that would have made for a better deal and I think it was clear that Dion had to go.

Dark days those were...

But I'll throw this out there.....entirely worth it for Matt Stajan alone. Just a great soldier and great human. I'm glad Matt Stajan was a Calgary Flame.

[Sylvanfan]

By the time the team traded Phaneuf the league was wise to the fact that the hype exceeded what the player could actually do. Most teams knew he was a medoiocre defender who could occasionally get off a shot on the PP. The 2009 hip injury likely did slow him a lot.

Flames still likely could have got a package with a late first and another pick or two. But they chose to try and be a low seed playoff team.

Ultimately though...he was a flash in the pan and the 2003 draft which had a chance to set the franchise up nicely ended up not really doing anything.

[Sylvanfan]

Originally Posted by btimbit

I don't think you'll find many people that think Phaneuf should've stayed, but the trade itself wasn't good. Could have gotten way more back

I think thats a myth. Way more wasn't going to happen. Way different that might have been an option. The package of picks could have yielded more...than again look at Sutters drafting....it was awful.

[Dube]

Originally Posted by Locke

Theres so many moving pieces in that old trade though.

Granted, overall it was pretty bad, but at the same time it did expedite the coming era of the rebuild.

I dont know, the thing is we were treading water by that point, did it kill us to tread a little longer? It wasnt brilliant asset management by any means and we probably sold low on Phaneuf and maybe at that point could have done better, but I didnt see a lot of assets around that would have made for a better deal and I think it was clear that Dion had to go.

Dark days those were...

But I'll throw this out there.....entirely worth it for Matt Stajan alone. Just a great soldier and great human. I'm glad Matt Stajan was a Calgary Flame.

How did you expect them to tread? Could they have just kept Dion a away from the team for a few more days and fetched a better deal? Not sure what else management could’ve done.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Dube

How did you expect them to tread? Could they have just kept Dion a away from the team for a few more days and fetched a better deal? Not sure what else management could’ve done.

Sorry, thats not what I meant, I meant that we werent competing with or without Dion, so taking the Toronto deal, while underwhelming, wasnt really moving the needle so I doubt there were substantially better offers out there.

He still should have checked and he didnt, but the premise that 'we could have gotten more for Phaneuf' I think is flawed.

We could maybe have gotten younger, less established players, or draft picks, but that would make a significant shift in the team's strategy at the time plus the other team still has to even out the dollars to make the deal work.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

The Flames won the Phaneuf trade all day dude

Unfortunately not. They got fleeced as he had way more value than spare parts.

[djsFlames]

It was not a good trade.

But Phaneuf was never as good as he was as a Flame afterward anyways.

Edmonton will undoubted try to net any former big name from the bargain bin, could see them trying to court him.

[Dube]

Originally Posted by Locke

Sorry, thats not what I meant, I meant that we werent competing with or without Dion, so taking the Toronto deal, while underwhelming, wasnt really moving the needle so I doubt there were substantially better offers out there.

He still should have checked and he didnt, but the premise that 'we could have gotten more for Phaneuf' I think is flawed.

We could maybe have gotten younger, less established players, or draft picks, but that would make a significant shift in the team's strategy at the time plus the other team still has to even out the dollars to make the deal work.

From my understanding of the situation it was basically a “He goes or I go”. Didn’t have weeks to mull it over nor was it it was something that was even on the radar. Given the timing it’s all management could do

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Dube

From my understanding of the situation it was basically a “He goes or I go”. Didn’t have weeks to mull it over nor was it it was something that was even on the radar. Given the timing it’s all management could do

Is this in regards to Conroy? Because I thought that was just a rumour.

[bluejays]

Originally Posted by Dube

From my understanding of the situation it was basically a “He goes or I go”. Didn’t have weeks to mull it over nor was it it was something that was even on the radar. Given the timing it’s all management could do

Even if that was the case, it was still terrible asset management. Part of being a good leader is you settle things down until things can work out better. Knowing that you have an asset worth something, you can't limit yourself by saying you have a week to trade him to make the present work out. He was a significant asset. Speak to all the parties you need to keep satisfied and say to hold on until they can figure things out a few weeks. Communication was never a great Sutter trait, but it was an unnecessary time limitation given who Phaneuf was. Then he could make calls to the teams with assets he'd want back and put a time constraint on getting back to him. Instead it was a trade that nobody heard a peep over because of how quick the team was to jump the gun. Sutter was also juggling coaching as well, no? Just a bad recipe.

[Dube]

Originally Posted by Locke

Is this in regards to Conroy? Because I thought that was just a rumour.

It was either the Captain or the punk staying

[Locke]

Originally Posted by fleury

Even if that was the case, it was still terrible asset management. Part of being a good leader is you settle things down until things can work out better. Knowing that you have an asset worth something, you can't limit yourself by saying you have a week to trade him to make the present work out. He was a significant asset. Speak to all the parties you need to keep satisfied and say to hold on until they can figure things out a few weeks. Communication was never a great Sutter trait, but it was an unnecessary time limitation given who Phaneuf was. Then he could make calls to the teams with assets he'd want back and put a time constraint on getting back to him. Instead it was a trade that nobody heard a peep over because of how quick the team was to jump the gun. Sutter was also juggling coaching as well, no? Just a bad recipe.

Originally Posted by Dube

It was either the Captain or the punk staying

If the rumour was true, and I'm not getting in to that because I genuinely dont know, then you cut out the cancer. ASAP.

But then similarly one has to consider the value of Conroy staying, not just as a player, but a valued member of the organization and that totally tilts the value of the trade.

You basically have to add the value of Conroy's retention to our side of the ledger in regards to that trade.

In which case we absolutely killed it!

But again...I think thats conjecture.