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Old 11-06-2018, 05:03 PM   #101
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Chatter around Chicago is that they fired the wrong guy. Should have been Bowman.
What? How could that have happened, they don't even look at all alike.
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Old 11-06-2018, 07:14 PM   #102
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Now he can get back to his day job and focus on getting more pictures of Spider-Man.
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Old 11-06-2018, 08:38 PM   #103
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That is Joel Quenneville, Darryl Sutter, and Alain Vigneault all on the market. Pretty great crop of coaches to choose from if you are a team looking for a new coach.

Quenneville to Florida

Vigneault to St. Louis

Sutter to Edmonton
I think Sutter just retires.
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Old 11-06-2018, 08:45 PM   #104
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That is Joel Quenneville, Darryl Sutter, and Alain Vigneault all on the market. Pretty great crop of coaches to choose from if you are a team looking for a new coach.

Quenneville to Florida

Vigneault to St. Louis

Sutter to Edmonton
Sutter has retired.
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Old 11-06-2018, 08:56 PM   #105
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That is Joel Quenneville, Darryl Sutter, and Alain Vigneault all on the market. Pretty great crop of coaches to choose from if you are a team looking for a new coach.

Add in Babcock and you have 4 of my top 5 coaches from a couple years ago. I wonder if Coach Q's contract is like AV's where in if he takes another job the original contract ends. Because 6 mil for not coaching NHL hockey isn't the worst punishment.


edit: AV loses his NYR pay if he coaches another team in the NHL. So anyone who wants his skills needs to really sweeten the pot.

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Old 11-06-2018, 08:57 PM   #106
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Todd MacLennan
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Old 11-06-2018, 09:39 PM   #107
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I would bet my house that he doesn't touch Edmonton with a 10 foot pole. A coach of his calibre, after winning all his Cups, and in the Twilight of his career certainly wouldn't join that garbage tire of a team.

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Old 11-06-2018, 11:01 PM   #108
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Is it really surprising he got fired? Yes, he won 3 cups with Chicago, but after 10 years I think the messaging starts to fall flat no matter who you are.
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Old 11-06-2018, 11:27 PM   #109
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It was mildly surprising he was back for this year.
Coaches have their shelf life.
I’m sure Bowman probably added some drama needlessly to the situation, but it was time for Quenneville regardless.

To that end, my guess is that Bowman or the Hawks didn’t want him going somewhere to a rival in last offseason, so held onto him.

With the entirely predictable results from a team that’s sold its cap soul to the devil to make runs at Cups (successfully, too), it was all come to crash st some point,and it has.
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Old 11-07-2018, 08:43 AM   #110
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Funny - you have a two time Cup winner (also previously a finalist) in Sutter, a three time Cup winner in Quenneville, a two time finalist in Vigneault, all just sitting around.

You also have Hartley and Bylsma (though he has an assistant gig) who've won cups and would take a HC job, but they arguably did it on the backs on really good teams.
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Old 11-07-2018, 08:47 AM   #111
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I would bet my house that he doesn't touch Edmonton with a 10 foot pole. A coach of his calibre, after winning all his Cups, and in the Twilight of his career certainly wouldn't join that garbage tire of a team.

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They'd have to pay him his $6M for two years (counting this one) at least, and they'd be paying McLellan his $3M for a couple more years counting this one. They'd have the second and fourth highest paid coaches on their payroll. LOL.
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Old 11-07-2018, 09:13 AM   #112
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him going somewhere to a rival in last offseason, so held onto him.

With the entirely predictable results from a team that’s sold its cap soul to the devil to make runs at Cups (successfully, too), it was all come to crash st some point,and it has.
If you want to make runs a the cup that's what you need to do, because the most successful teams are doing it.

If you don't sign long term contracts with players as they get into their late 20's, instead trading them and reloading, you'll likely be doing it forever without any Cups.

At some stage, you need to take a stand with the team you have (assuming it's good enough to win the SC), and perhaps sign some contracts that will stink at the end.

Chicago crashed not so much that the got into cap hell as much as their core aged out. Gone from their glory days are Hossa, Sharp Hjammer etc. Seabrook is just a shell of his former self. Keith is just OK. Toews is still pretty good, but not as good as before. Kane is still great.
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Old 11-07-2018, 09:32 AM   #113
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If you want to make runs a the cup that's what you need to do, because the most successful teams are doing it.

If you don't sign long term contracts with players as they get into their late 20's, instead trading them and reloading, you'll likely be doing it forever without any Cups.

At some stage, you need to take a stand with the team you have (assuming it's good enough to win the SC), and perhaps sign some contracts that will stink at the end.

Chicago crashed not so much that the got into cap hell as much as their core aged out. Gone from their glory days are Hossa, Sharp Hjammer etc. Seabrook is just a shell of his former self. Keith is just OK. Toews is still pretty good, but not as good as before. Kane is still great.
Their core got older, but also was given contracts that eliminated retooling. Their big success came when the great players were paid less, so they could afford a stellar supporting cast - Hossa, Sharp, etc. And for a while after the big contracts they could still make it work, but not after the supporting cast got good enough to ask for more money too.
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Old 11-07-2018, 09:35 AM   #114
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...Chicago crashed not so much that the got into cap hell as much as their core aged out. Gone from their glory days are Hossa, Sharp Hjammer etc. Seabrook is just a shell of his former self. Keith is just OK. Toews is still pretty good, but not as good as before. Kane is still great.
No. They have crashed primarily because of the money that is tied up on their top end, which does not provide the same flexibility around which to build a great roster. Chicago's Cups all happened when Toews and Kane were on reasonable second contracts, with Kieth on a back-diving deal that is now illegal under the current cap structure, and with room for supplemental players like Marian Hossa and Patrick Sharp.
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Old 11-07-2018, 12:11 PM   #115
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No. They have crashed primarily because of the money that is tied up on their top end, which does not provide the same flexibility around which to build a great roster. Chicago's Cups all happened when Toews and Kane were on reasonable second contracts, with Kieth on a back-diving deal that is now illegal under the current cap structure, and with room for supplemental players like Marian Hossa and Patrick Sharp.
Their cups also occurred when their core was better than other teams, which is no longer the case. Their core has declined sharply in the last few years, to the point that it's no better than average at best.
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Old 11-07-2018, 12:38 PM   #116
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Their cups also occurred when their core was better than other teams, which is no longer the case. Their core has declined sharply in the last few years, to the point that it's no better than average at best.
Well, yes, but the fact that they have so much money tied up in their core has prevented the Hawks from being proactive and making adjustments and upgrades with the passage of time.
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Old 11-07-2018, 02:45 PM   #117
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Well, yes, but the fact that they have so much money tied up in their core has prevented the Hawks from being proactive and making adjustments and upgrades with the passage of time.
In fact, they've lost really good depth players - Panarin, Saad, Teravainen, Shaw, Sharp, Bollig (jk).
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Old 11-07-2018, 04:48 PM   #118
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If they were smart they would leak that Kane is on the market and cash in big time this summer. He's the only expensive contract they have that could really kickstart a rebuild properly.
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Old 11-07-2018, 05:04 PM   #119
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No. They have crashed primarily because of the money that is tied up on their top end, which does not provide the same flexibility around which to build a great roster. Chicago's Cups all happened when Toews and Kane were on reasonable second contracts, with Kieth on a back-diving deal that is now illegal under the current cap structure, and with room for supplemental players like Marian Hossa and Patrick Sharp.
This year they are sucking. Last year they are sucking.

However, the previous year they still won the conference before being swept by the surprising Stanley Cup finalist Predators.

That 2016-2017 season had:
Kane making 10.5M
Toews making 10.5M
Seabrook making 6.9M
Crawfood making 6.0M
Keith making 5.5M

That was their core, the same core making the same amount. So what's the real difference?

Probably most notably (outside of the aging core) is trading Panarin for Saad...That wasn't a cap move they ended up making the same amount, that was just a bad trade. Panarin was a PPG player, Saad put up 35 points. Imagine the Flames trading Monahan for Ryan Strome...

Losing Hossa obviously hurt as well.
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Old 11-07-2018, 05:18 PM   #120
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In fact, they've lost really good depth players - Panarin, Saad, Teravainen, Shaw, Sharp, Bollig (jk).
Not to mention Byfuglien, Frolik, Leddy, Hjalmarsson, Ladd, Versteeg, Brouwer (back when the latter three were good) - it's actually incredible how much depth the Blackhawks had to shed over the years and yet they managed to stay good for quite a long time.
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