[PGT] Big Save Dave dominates the Leafs, Flames win 2-1 (SO)

[simonarea]

Brodie has another crap game. (Costly turnovers)

[TheScorpion]

Originally Posted by simonarea

Brodie has another crap game. (Costly turnovers)

I don't think I agree with you, I liked what I saw from Brodie last night. Also don't know what you mean by "another," IMO he's been the Flames' best defenseman all year long.

Speaking of defense, I think I'd like to see Alexander Yelesin swapped in for Kylington tomorrow. Not that Kylington has been bad (in fact he was excellent against Toronto from my perspective) but I'd like to see the Russian given a look before the break.

[jaikorven]

Originally Posted by simonarea

Brodie has another crap game. (Costly turnovers)

Man...I just don't know where that is coming from

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by Bingo

For sure but it was before Ward too.

There are certainly come concerns when it comes to shot metrics, the Ward Flames take less shot attempts and shots, and give up more.

But their high danger stuff has actually improved.

They were terrible in generating under Peters at 9.14 per game. Now they're at a still weak 10.21. Against they gave up 9.98 under Peters and have improved to 9.74.

The overall split went from 47.8% to 51.2% so an improvement.

But why are they generating so little across both coaches? It is the same players.

Both shooting percentage and save percentage is up under Ward, as was likely considering how little luck/bounces the team was getting to start the season.

And how did the players score so much last year?

It’s what they are doing

Now whether or not someone is telling to do things that are going to help or hurt in various areas, and whether or not they are listening and such, is unknown, but we do know what the players are capable of

[AustinL_NHL]

Originally Posted by Bingo

For sure but it was before Ward too.

There are certainly come concerns when it comes to shot metrics, the Ward Flames take less shot attempts and shots, and give up more.

But their high danger stuff has actually improved.

They were terrible in generating under Peters at 9.14 per game. Now they're at a still weak 10.21. Against they gave up 9.98 under Peters and have improved to 9.74.

The overall split went from 47.8% to 51.2% so an improvement.

But why are they generating so little across both coaches? It is the same players.

Both shooting percentage and save percentage is up under Ward, as was likely considering how little luck/bounces the team was getting to start the season.

True, but overall, they've seen a regression across all metrics except for HDCF%. Their xGF% are pretty much equal (49.56% under Peters vs 49.78% under Ward).

Their PDO has also done a complete 180. From being 3rd last under Peters (.968) to 3rd highest under Ward (1.017)

Have to think it's all mental. Especially Gaudreau. He doesn't look half the player we've become used to.

Monahan actually looks much more engaged this year. Chucky is still Chucky and Lindholm continues to be a beauty.

Between Gaudreau falling off a cliff and Giordano running into a brick wall, I think those two are the biggest reasons our offense has dried up so much.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by AustinL_NHL

Since Ward took over, the Flames are ranked:

22nd in shots/60
22nd in goals/60
10th in scoring chances/60
19th in high danger chances/60

Their offense is well below average

What are they in goals? I suspect in the middle because they've had more or less an equal number of 4 goal games versus 0-2 goal games.

[sa226]

I think there is a renewed focus on defense, with buy in from the players. I think its also a transition from last year where everyone had career years. Their scoring last year covered a lot of defensive warts. I don't think it showed up in the numbers as much because they had the puck all the time. But as we saw when up against a team that could out skate them, they had no answer.

I'd like to think Ward is trying to mould them into a "Defense first team, that can score" and we're just not seeing the results yet. You can see it with Lindholm playing against the top players, somewhat stubbornly leaving Backlund with Monahan and Gaudreau and reinserting Jankowski into the lineup last night.

I think the team knows that if they're chasing a matchup game it's hard to win, but if you're comfortable rolling 4 lines you're better set up for success.

I'm okay with the evolution of the team, because I think it's for the better in the long run. What has become extremely frustrating is the inconsistent work ethic. It was such a huge win against Edmonton. To follow it up with that stinker in Montreal is all too predictable. Just when I think they're starting to put it together and gain some separation, they regress.

We all know Treliving is hunting, besides that this team has the necessary elements to be much better than their record indicates.

2 small wishes for me for the second half of the season. 1: Gaudreau and Monahan to be more dynamic. 2: A better powerplay. Or at least a more timely one. The way game management is these days, you need your powerplay to be more effective.

Sent from my SM-G973W using Tapatalk

[Hemi-Cuda]

Originally Posted by AC

This gorgeous hit was called a trip...

Even Ray Ferraro was like "That's a great hit, it's not a penalty".

This is why my give-a-#### level for hockey has hit an all-time low. It's actually rare that I see a penalty called in the NHL and think "Ya that's fair". More often it's either a phantom call like above or egregious penalties being ignored. Why get invested in the game when so much of the outcome is dependent on penalties, and there's zero logic in how they're applied?

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by sa226

I think there is a renewed focus on defense, with buy in from the players. I think its also a transition from last year where everyone had career years. Their scoring last year covered a lot of defensive warts. I don't think it showed up in the numbers as much because they had the puck all the time. But as we saw when up against a team that could out skate them, they had no answer.

I'd like to think Ward is trying to mould them into a "Defense first team, that can score" and we're just not seeing the results yet. You can see it with Lindholm playing against the top players, somewhat stubbornly leaving Backlund with Monahan and Gaudreau and reinserting Jankowski into the lineup last night.

I think the team knows that if they're chasing a matchup game it's hard to win, but if you're comfortable rolling 4 lines you're better set up for success.

I'm okay with the evolution of the team, because I think it's for the better in the long run. What has become extremely frustrating is the inconsistent work ethic. It was such a huge win against Edmonton. To follow it up with that stinker in Montreal is all too predictable. Just when I think they're starting to put it together and gain some separation, they regress.

We all know Treliving is hunting, besides that this team has the necessary elements to be much better than their record indicates.

2 small wishes for me for the second half of the season. 1: Gaudreau and Monahan to be more dynamic. 2: A better powerplay. Or at least a more timely one. The way game management is these days, you need your powerplay to be more effective.

Sent from my SM-G973W using Tapatalk

Call me crazy but I think Gaudreau and Monahan can be split up. I think Monahan has some chemistry with Lindholm so make them a pair. I think Tkachuk needs someone in the slot to pass to. That's Monahan. Add a RHS for the Gaudreau/Lindholm line, give Dube a shot on the Tkachuk/Monahan line.

[AustinL_NHL]

Originally Posted by sa226

I think there is a renewed focus on defense, with buy in from the players. I think its also a transition from last year where everyone had career years. Their scoring last year covered a lot of defensive warts. I don't think it showed up in the numbers as much because they had the puck all the time. But as we saw when up against a team that could out skate them, they had no answer.

I'd like to think Ward is trying to mould them into a "Defense first team, that can score" and we're just not seeing the results yet. You can see it with Lindholm playing against the top players, somewhat stubbornly leaving Backlund with Monahan and Gaudreau and reinserting Jankowski into the lineup last night.

I think the team knows that if they're chasing a matchup game it's hard to win, but if you're comfortable rolling 4 lines you're better set up for success.

I'm okay with the evolution of the team, because I think it's for the better in the long run. What has become extremely frustrating is the inconsistent work ethic. It was such a huge win against Edmonton. To follow it up with that stinker in Montreal is all too predictable. Just when I think they're starting to put it together and gain some separation, they regress.

We all know Treliving is hunting, besides that this team has the necessary elements to be much better than their record indicates.

2 small wishes for me for the second half of the season. 1: Gaudreau and Monahan to be more dynamic. 2: A better powerplay. Or at least a more timely one. The way game management is these days, you need your powerplay to be more effective.

Sent from my SM-G973W using Tapatalk

Their defense under Ward is much worse than it was under Peters. Only difference is Ward is getting otherworldly goaltending to mask the terrible defensive hockey being played in front of them.

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by Hemi-Cuda

This is why my give-a-#### level for hockey has hit an all-time low. It's actually rare that I see a penalty called in the NHL and think "Ya that's fair". More often it's either a phantom call like above or egregious penalties being ignored. Why get invested in the game when so much of the outcome is dependent on penalties, and there's zero logic in how they're applied?

Yup I'm getting there myself. Game management is eroding my interest in the NHL. I'll always love hockey, but this league has a problem and if it's not fixed I'll be taking a break

[DeluxeMoustache]

You guys are happier blaming the refs than acknowledging the Flames’ obvious weaknesses.

The odd lousy call isn’t the reason the team has been shut out 6 times

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by simonarea

Brodie has another crap game. (Costly turnovers)

What did it cost them?

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by AustinL_NHL

Since Ward took over, the Flames are ranked:

22nd in shots/60
22nd in goals/60
10th in scoring chances/60
19th in high danger chances/60

Their offense is well below average

most road games, 3rd highest quality of opponent

I bet some of these come down

[N-E-B]

Originally Posted by dino7c

What did it cost them?

Absolutely none of them. Brodie was fine tonight and has been great since he came back.

Some posters just hate him for unknown reasons but I think people really overstate his weaknesses. Yeah, he’s prone to the odd mistake here and there but they aren’t nearly as frequent or as costly as people say.

[the2bears]

Originally Posted by TheIronMaiden

What was it before he took over? It still feels like an improvement TBH.

Yeah, without knowing the baseline to compare against those numbers don't mean as much as Austin thinks they do.

[AustinL_NHL]

Originally Posted by dino7c

most road games, 3rd highest quality of opponent

I bet some of these come down

Since Ward took over, the Flames have played 12 home games and 10 away games.

The teams that we've played since Ward took over have an average 5v5 Goals Against per 60 of 2.53, which is much higher than the Flames' 2.27 Goals For per 60.

To make this easier:

Opponents Averages (since Ward took over) vs Flames Averages (since Ward took over):

Goals against 5v5: 2.53 (Flames: 2.27 goals/60)
Shots against 5v5: 31.09 (Flames: 29.71 shots/60)

So it's not like the Flames' numbers are being hampered by playing amazing teams or playing mostly on the road, because they've played more games at home under Ward and can't even equal or surpass their opponents averages.

[robertsfanatic]

Originally Posted by simonarea

Brodie has another crap game. (Costly turnovers)

which game were you watching?

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by Hemi-Cuda

This is why my give-a-#### level for hockey has hit an all-time low. It's actually rare that I see a penalty called in the NHL and think "Ya that's fair". More often it's either a phantom call like above or egregious penalties being ignored. Why get invested in the game when so much of the outcome is dependent on penalties, and there's zero logic in how they're applied?

I think there's two major factors coming to a head in recent years in the NHL.

1. Game management - It's absurd, and it's clearly there.

2. The game is simply getting too fast for on ice officiating.

These two factors are coming together and making NHL officials look absolutely inept to the naked (TV) eye. They can barely keep up with the play and see each potential infraction if they were just calling everything as they see it, BUT on top of that they're attempting to follow a script of keeping games close with timely calls for the trailing team.

Behind closed doors, and in theory this might seem reasonable for the NHL, but I don't know if they know how obvious and inept everything looks on a broadcast.

[handgroen]

Originally Posted by simonarea

Brodie has another crap game. (Costly turnovers)

Originally Posted by jaikorven

Man...I just don't know where that is coming from

Looks like it's coming from his simon area