Women's professional hockey - will it ever work?

[Lanny_McDonald]

Was an interesting discussion during the intermission of the Oilers game where they talked about the failure of the CWHL on the heels of the Inferno's championship. The women vowed not to play in a professional North American league until (and I'm summarizing) they were guaranteed stability and fair pay. My question is, is it really feasible to expect a professional league for women that can compete with even minor league or junior hockey? Can women attract a following that will guarantee the pay and stability they want, considering the competition?

[CaptainCrunch]

No it can't compete, They get tiny crowds, and though they try to market they just don't draw.

They can push the NHL all that want to pay their way, but the NHL isn't going to make a bad investment and I doubt that even their marketing machine would make it a draw.

I don't think its a viable pro game, it can't compete with pro or even Major Junior Hockey. I think they'll be sitting for a while.

When someone says they're on strike when there's no money to be made, I have to question their logic.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Is it wrong to suggest that junior and collegiate female hockey is enough? Do they have the right to earn a living as pro athletes? The only reason I can think is for the sake of the olympics but many other athletes need to have careers outside of sport. Maybe it should be a part time activity.

Or with a major donor/sponsor/bankroll, perhaps they could set up a 4 team league in the GTA or something.

[Samonadreau]

It would help to have one Main league like what happened to the NHL in 1979

[codynw]

As someone who knows absolutely nothing about this kind of thing, I do think a smaller league that is backed financially by the NHL could be viable. A 32 team league would obviously be too much, but I don't see why a 12ish team league couldn't work.

[Moneyhands23]

I think the first step is to introduce/allow hitting and fighting in the league.

Make it the same game for both the men and woman.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

Is it wrong to suggest that junior and collegiate female hockey is enough? Do they have the right to earn a living as pro athletes? The only reason I can think is for the sake of the olympics but many other athletes need to have careers outside of sport. Maybe it should be a part time activity.

Or with a major donor/sponsor/bankroll, perhaps they could set up a 4 team league in the GTA or something.

Its not a right, there has to be money coming in to get paid, and there wasn't a lot of money coming in. Crowds made up of family members and friends tells you a lot of what you need to know.

Look, I coached Woman's tackle football, which was pretty high level up here, but we were under no illusions that it would ever generate enough fan interest for it to draw money. In fact sadly the only reason why it worked in the States and got TV deals is because the woman played in their underwear.

If there is corporate sponsor ship out there then that's the route. But to think that the NHL is obligated to put money in to pay salaries on a hockey level with no interest except every 4 years is crazy.

[Winsor_Pilates]

This is a question best for those with daughters.
If they'd watch it, then yes it will work in some format and scale. If not, there's no audience for it.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by codynw

As someone who knows absolutely nothing about this kind of thing, I do think a smaller league that is backed financially by the NHL could be viable. A 32 team league would obviously be too much, but I don't see why a 12ish team league couldn't work.

I'd rather have the NHL spend money on youth development for boys and girls hockey, and maybe a scholarship fund for woman players to go to college.

Even a small 10 team league and lets say you pay the players 30,000 a year. You're looking at the NHL throwing $6,600,000 down a well, you'd get laughed out of the board room.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

If the WNBA can work to a moderate degree I don't see why women's hockey can't work. Anyone who says otherwise is close-minded.

The thing with the WNBA is that it's a sister/brother league to the NBA, although the teams aren't directly affiliated with each other. The NHL needs to support women's hockey if they hope to not only have a women's league, but also grow the game and gain women as a key demographic.

[Moneyhands23]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

If the WNBA can work to a moderate degree I don't see why women's hockey can't work. Anyone who says otherwise is close-minded.

The thing with the WNBA is that it's a sister/brother league to the NBA, although the teams aren't directly affiliated with each other. The NHL needs to support women's hockey if they hope to not only have a women's league, but also grow the game and gain women as a key demographic.

I was under the impression that the WNBA doesn't work and loses millions of dollars annually. Has this changed?

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Close minded because the NHL so far isn’t keen on bankrolling a league that will lose bucketloads of money like the NBA does?

[Moneyhands23]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

Close minded because the NHL so far isn’t keen on bankrolling a league that will lose bucketloads of money like the NBA does?

Easy to call ppl close minded when its not your money I guess.

[GGG]

It seems odd to assume that the highest level of sport should pay a living wage.

Outside of about 10 sports for men and 3 for women this just isn’t the case. Every other sport requires government / Olympic support to be viable.

[DiracSpike]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

Close minded because the NHL so far isn’t keen on bankrolling a league that will lose bucketloads of money like the NBA does?

Not only that, but instead of getting props for running a charity league they instead get blasted for the “pay disparity” between leagues. For some people it’s never enough, or they always want to have something to complain about. The world doesn’t owe you a living playing professional sports, even relatively popular male sports like arena football and lacrosse have a tough time cutting it.

The reason most women’s sports fail is ultimately this: women don’t watch women’s sports. If women supported the WNHL or WNBA like men do for the NHL and NBA then those leagues would be perfectly viable, but they don’t.

[btimbit]

It would be nice but financially it just doesn't seem viable. They don't draw the viewers

[soulchoice]

No it won't ever work. The NHL has no responsibility to fund a league which will be a losing financial business. It would be very hard to compete with other hockey in most cities which have higher level hockey. All of NHL, CHL, CIS, NCAA 1-3, College hockey, Junior A, Junior B, Junior C, AAA midget, Senior men's contact hockey and some div 1 beer league are all higher levels of hockey. So to have others want to pay to watch womens pro is a tough go.

The part about being the elite in their sport, thus should be paid a liveable wage is nonsensical and illogical. The top players in sledge hockey are the elite in their sport too, so does that mean they should also get a league and a liveable wage?

Sure its unfortunate one won't be able to encourage support their daughter to be a pro hockey players. However as a parent I would also tell my daughter yes it's great you want to be a pro hockey player but it most likely won't happen so be wise to choose another career. It's life.

[Matty81]

I'd probably keep half an eye on it if there was one high level league.

Their landscape is too fractured and I do think nhl should get involved.

Times are changing and they are going to need to work to attract younger fans, there is a lot more competition for their attention than 30 years ago. The games are too expensive for most normal families to attend regularly in person. Co branded womens teams are a good way to try and make more little girls into lifelong hockey/nhl fans.

Having a womens product run a short season schedule with fewer teams probably would not be a huge investment for them to make cost wise but I think worthwhile. The afl in Australia just did this and promoted it a lot, it's been a reasonable success.

Thinking it needs to make money on day 1 is shortsighted, it won't, but it would be a good idea long run imo to ensure the long term health of the league.

[soulchoice]

Originally Posted by Samonadreau

It would help to have one Main league like what happened to the NHL in 1979

The difference is in 1979 that one League had the best hockey players in North America. Quality and talent wise there was no better alternative to put your dollars to.

[Reggie Dunlop]

The NHL started as a 4 team league.

I can't see a womens' league being any bigger than that, and they'd have to be be very creative in their marketing.

Canada vs. USA usually draws decent interest (at least north of the border) because of the intense rivalry. Build from something like that as a template.