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Old 05-06-2010, 10:03 PM   #1
dfsflamesfan
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Default My theory on the Flames Drafting

My theory is that once Daryl stepped down from the coaching position he had become a better drafter. After he stopped coaching he picked (from 2007 on, because he stepped down after the '06 season and probably didn't have enough time looking for players): Backlund (1st,2007), Negrin (2nd, 2007), Aulie (3rd, 2007), Nemisz (1st, 2008), Wahl (2nd, 2008), Bouma (3rd, 2008), Brodie (4th, 2008), Howse (3rd, 2009), and Patterson (7th).

Not saying that any of these picks are going to be sure NHLers but they have done better than our previous picks prior to Sutters step down. I haven't mentioned some other picks like Erixon because I haven't really followed them closely. Most of the players that I said are a major or contributing factor to their teams this season.

Wahl, Bouma, Brodie and Patterson have all been called up to the AHL to play in the Calder Cup playoffs and are playing well to what I hear on their radio station.
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Old 05-06-2010, 10:04 PM   #2
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Another factor is that the scouting staff has undergone some changes in recent years. I'm not sure what specifically was done and when - but I do know some of the personnel did change.
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Old 05-06-2010, 10:07 PM   #3
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Another fact is that Darryl said numerous times that when he came in he was looking for quantity over quality. The farm team was depleted, heck it was non-existent, and this was why he traded down a lot and picked up extra picks wherever he could. Also explains the drafting strategy of getting gritty, "safe" prospects who had low upside but also weren't likely to bust completely.

Recently Darryl has picked a few more higher-upside players (Backlund, Howse, Wahl come to mind up front) and certainly the quantity of his picks has gone down as he's dealt almost all his 2nd rounders, and this coming up draft...well, you know.
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Old 05-06-2010, 10:24 PM   #4
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I think that this season, with the lack of picks in the top two rounds, you'll see them draft guys that are boom bust guys like Howse with the picks they have.
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Old 05-06-2010, 10:37 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dfsflamesfan View Post
(from 2007 on, because he stepped down after the '06 season and probably didn't have enough time looking for players):
I disagree with this part, him and his staff spent just as much time in 06 as any other year looking for players. I understand the point that you're trying to make but that statement just doesn't make sense.
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Old 05-06-2010, 10:40 PM   #6
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The only thing is that they aren't given a chance to prove themselfs though too. Thats the only thing that kinda bugs me!!!
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Old 05-06-2010, 10:41 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheerio View Post
I disagree with this part, him and his staff spent just as much time in 06 as any other year looking for players. I understand the point that you're trying to make but that statement just doesn't make sense.
He was still coaching in 2006, he stepped down in the summer time leaving very little time to scout players for himself and having to rely on other scouts like Button.
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Old 05-06-2010, 10:41 PM   #8
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Either way I am excited about the Flames drafting moving forward. I think they are getting much better at it.

Good theory for sure, it makes some sense.
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Old 05-06-2010, 10:47 PM   #9
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Quote:
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He was still coaching in 2006, he stepped down in the summer time leaving very little time to scout players for himself and having to rely on other scouts like Button.
Yes he was, doesn't Button do most of the scouting now anyways? Doesn't Darryl just have the final say? No idea just wondering
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Old 05-06-2010, 10:49 PM   #10
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Personally I have really liked a lot of the players Sutter has drafted since he took over. The GD problem is that he doesn't trust them worth a damn to cut their teeth in the NHL.
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Old 05-06-2010, 10:56 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheerio View Post
Yes he was, doesn't Button do most of the scouting now anyways? Doesn't Darryl just have the final say? No idea just wondering
Yes he has the final say, but you can't really get a good idea who you are picking if you didn't have all year to watch the junior players play. He would have to rely on the scouts.
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Old 05-07-2010, 02:03 AM   #12
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Personally I have really liked a lot of the players Sutter has drafted since he took over. The GD problem is that he doesn't trust them worth a damn to cut their teeth in the NHL.
You speak the truth. Other than Moss and Nystrom, which one of our picks are actually on our team? Not including Backlund we have like no body. Then when he actually does bring someone up, they play on our 4th line, with 2 muckers. Backlund will be 30 before he has someone with any remote skill to play with (pending he plays with Iggy next season).
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Old 05-07-2010, 06:53 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3 Justin 3 View Post
You speak the truth. Other than Moss and Nystrom, which one of our picks are actually on our team? Not including Backlund we have like no body. Then when he actually does bring someone up, they play on our 4th line, with 2 muckers. Backlund will be 30 before he has someone with any remote skill to play with (pending he plays with Iggy next season).
Well, there's Pardy on the team as well.

Of the offensive prospects, the only guys that are seeming to be in the same region as Backlund are Howse, Wahl, and Nemisz. The rest are guys like Sutter who should get started as 4th line guys and moved slowly up the ladder because their overall offensive talent isn't great.

Our system definitely needs an injection of players that are more like Howse and Cameron than muckers.
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Old 05-07-2010, 07:29 AM   #14
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I wonder how good Stevey Y is going to draft.......

In all honesty, Sutter hasn't done as bad a job as everyone says, but he hasn't done as good of a job as everyone wants. The draft is almost as much luck as anything elese and Daryl needs to get lucky and draft a gem.
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Old 05-07-2010, 07:56 AM   #15
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Quote:
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Well, there's Pardy on the team as well.

Of the offensive prospects, the only guys that are seeming to be in the same region as Backlund are Howse, Wahl, and Nemisz. The rest are guys like Sutter who should get started as 4th line guys and moved slowly up the ladder because their overall offensive talent isn't great.

Our system definitely needs an injection of players that are more like Howse and Cameron than muckers.
Phaneuf was also drafted by Sutter.

Bad drafting by Sutter is a myth. The Flames have never had top picks in the draft and the seconds have been dealt to fill other major holes in the team.

Sutter has done pretty well with his trading seconds so far. Both Kipper and Bourque were traded straight up for seconds. Seconds were also used to acquire Cammy and Tanguay. Borque and Kipper alone are better return statistically than you would expect from 5-6 years of actually drafting seconds.
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Old 05-07-2010, 08:04 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3 Justin 3 View Post
You speak the truth. Other than Moss and Nystrom, which one of our picks are actually on our team? Not including Backlund we have like no body. Then when he actually does bring someone up, they play on our 4th line, with 2 muckers. Backlund will be 30 before he has someone with any remote skill to play with (pending he plays with Iggy next season).
Yeah, I know what you mean. You can not include as many players as you want till your argument makes sense. In fact, if you don't include Moss and Nystrom, Pardy, and the players we have had as regular roster players that we traded to other teams, then we don't have anyone that we drafted on our team. Wow, that sure makes things look bad.
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Old 05-07-2010, 08:25 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm View Post
Personally I have really liked a lot of the players Sutter has drafted since he took over. The GD problem is that he doesn't trust them worth a damn to cut their teeth in the NHL.
Who are you referring to Mastodon (honestly just asking)?

assuming the 2009 draft is too soon to think they should be getting a look (therefore leave it out)

  • the 08's aren't ready but progressing
  • the '07 draft already has Backlund in the show and given a very good chance
  • '06 has injuries (Armstrong) and stalled development (Irving), neither deserve to play yet.
  • '05 you might have an argument with Pelech, but that draft has Sutter and Keetley that have both been given a look (Sutter two long looks)
  • '04 they graduated three players to the NHL full time (Boyd, Prust, Pardy)
  • '03 you have Phaneuf and players that didn't pan

The only guy I see as remotely held back as Pelech and that is far from an agreed point.

I think the Sutter doesn't give players a chance thing is a mantra with very little to support it.
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Old 05-07-2010, 08:57 AM   #18
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Sutter's first couple drafts are a write-off because he thought (hoped?) the NHL would revert back to hook-and-hold hockey. According to Peter Maher, Sutter admitted he would have drafted differently if he knew the new officiating standards would stick.

As for drafting quantity over quality, I've never heard of any GM, in the NHL or other league, taking that approach. What a bizarre notion - that the job of an NHL GM is to stock a minor-league roster.

Given the salary cap and the pre-eminence of skill and skating in today's game, you simply cannot succeed long-term unless you draft and develop well. All the trades and free-agent signings in the world cannot return value for dollar that drafting and development will bring. It's that simple.
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Old 05-07-2010, 09:12 AM   #19
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Old 05-07-2010, 09:17 AM   #20
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Its been more like this for us though...

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