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Old 11-19-2020, 11:49 PM   #441
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WFH and the isolation isn't too bad. I'm handling it pretty well. Thankfully I have people around to keep me company.

But find myself getting frustrated at people celebrating the vaccines. The light at the end of the tunnel talk is a bit much. It could be a year until we all get vaccinated and that's really when society should return to normal. No way we should be abandoning social distancing and masks a minute before then. I have this feeling as soon as the vaccine rolls out in any capacity, people are going to go nuts and forget everything we've learned over the last year.

It's weird too because just a few months ago I was so excited for the vaccine and the potential for the massive parties that would ensue.

Otherwise I'm not all that bothered by the current situation. I can hang on for a bit longer all locked down.

I'm worried we're all going to jump the gun for the sake of fun and the economy and ignore the fact that COVID could have long term effects.
I get what youíre saying but I am getting a real lift these days seeing headlines in articles from journals like the Atlantic and Newsweek that the end of the pandemic is now clearly in sight.
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Old 11-20-2020, 08:09 AM   #442
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Celebrate all good things.
Always
Yes of all the frustrating things I see happening, people celebrating the news of vaccines is quite possibly last on the list. Actually it's not on the list.

For many families, this pandemic has been a lot more devastating than working from home and less social interaction.

A light at the end of the tunnel is badly needed.
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Old 11-20-2020, 08:17 AM   #443
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Yes of all the frustrating things I see happening, people celebrating the news of vaccines is quite possibly last on the list. Actually it's not on the list.

For many families, this pandemic has been a lot more devastating than working from home and less social interaction.

A light at the end of the tunnel is badly needed.
This. I need that ####. Super pumped, but it doesnít mean Iím going to forget everything Iíve been doing for 9 months on day one of injections.
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Old 11-20-2020, 08:32 AM   #444
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If you get the vaccine why can’t you go back to regular life?
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Old 11-20-2020, 08:34 AM   #445
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Have joined a clinical trial for a covid-19 vaccine candidate (AstraZeneca). Am through the preliminary pre screening and will have initial consultation with study person shortly.

I have never participated in a clinical trial previously. Will be interesting, maybe.
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Old 11-20-2020, 08:47 AM   #446
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Have joined a clinical trial for a covid-19 vaccine candidate (AstraZeneca). Am through the preliminary pre screening and will have initial consultation with study person shortly.

I have never participated in a clinical trial previously. Will be interesting, maybe.
I've wished for awhile now that I could participate in a trial. At least it would be doing something. For all those internet memes out there that say this is so easy, because all we have to do is stay home and watch netflix... it is not! I would much rather be doing something, than just sitting around waiting.

I'm a teacher and when I went back to in person teaching this fall, all my friends kept asking if I was scared. And while I recognize my chance of being exposed is greater than if I had stayed home, the relief from being around others is much greater than my feelings of concern. I really struggled with the shutdown in the spring. With things opening up a bit in the summer, I thought I was feeling better, but my first day back at work in the fall was one of the best days ever.
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Old 11-20-2020, 10:00 AM   #447
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Have joined a clinical trial for a covid-19 vaccine candidate (AstraZeneca). Am through the preliminary pre screening and will have initial consultation with study person shortly.

I have never participated in a clinical trial previously. Will be interesting, maybe.
RIP EldrickOnIce. Welcome, Zombie EldrickOnIce.
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Old 11-20-2020, 06:02 PM   #448
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Yes of all the frustrating things I see happening, people celebrating the news of vaccines is quite possibly last on the list. Actually it's not on the list.

For many families, this pandemic has been a lot more devastating than working from home and less social interaction.

A light at the end of the tunnel is badly needed.
My post was pretty clear but I'll reiterate:

The light at the end of the tunnel talk is a bit much. It could be a year until we all get vaccinated and that's really when society should return to normal. No way we should be abandoning social distancing and masks a minute before then. I have this feeling as soon as the vaccine rolls out in any capacity, people are going to go nuts and forget everything we've learned over the last year.


This is precisely the issue. Too many people keep acting like the existence of a vaccine means they can go back to a regular life.

Go ahead and celebrate. But in private, socially distanced with good hygiene while wearing a mask. Not by going on vacation or by having a party or by going out drinking with friends.

It could be 6 months to a year until you are vaccinated. That light at the end of the tunnel is so far away I can barely see it. And that assumes there are no shortages or any other problems.

Can you imagine when the lucky few have gotten it and they're all going out having fun, travelling, going to Flames games and concerts but you're not allowed because you aren't vaccinated? And people think FOMO was a problem before with social media. Lol. Wait until vaccines roll out.

You think people are irresponsible now? What about when they see the privileged group that get their vaccine first and can return to normal? You think people won't go nuts and say screw it? We'll be at most risk when it first rolls out too because a tiny % of the population will be vaccinated and the virus will still be rampant. It won't get safe until nearly the entire population is vaccinated, which could take months and months and months.

You ever been to a big Christmas party or wedding and your table gets called last for supper? You know how ####ing annoyed people get? Ok, now imagine that but instead of getting cold food or dealing with an empty stomach, it is your life at stake.
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Old 11-20-2020, 06:32 PM   #449
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I suspect that restrictions will not care about vaccine status until 30-50% are vaccinated. Once 30-50% are vaccinated the natural suppression in RT will allow the virus not to exponentially grow.

Other than international travel I don’t think you see vaccination based policy for precisely the reasons you describe.

With an R0 of 3 you need 1- 1/ro to be vaccinated so about 66%. With current restrictions we are in the 1-1.5 range. This mean that even assuming a 1.5 rate of spread only 33% need to be vaccinated before the disease starts dying out. In summer we were closer to 1.2 so just 17% of people would need to be vaccinated to see benefits.

So given with current restriction levels it takes low levels of vaccine penetration to limit spread I suspect it’s a slow reduction of population level restrictions over the summer and not vaccine based restrictions.

Based on the above for me the Vaccine is places an end date of getting back to normal for back to school September 2021. Meaning no masks in schools and no significant online enrolment. For me that end date being reasonably insight does a lot to mitigate that this Christmas is going to be different.

Last edited by GGG; 11-20-2020 at 06:35 PM.
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Old 11-20-2020, 07:09 PM   #450
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Yeah, the rate of spread is going to dictate restrictions just as it does now. The first people to get vaccinated aren't going to be going to Flames games or concerts because those won't be happening if there is still wide community spread. Just like people with natural immunity don't get to do whatever they want right now, even though in places like New York City they likely make up 30% of the population. The rules are based on the risk for people without immunity, and they'll continue to be.

However, once the most vulnerable populations are vaccinated, I suspect the level of acceptable community spread will be higher, and then things will be more lax. So barring strong new evidence of serious long-term complications in younger people who've been infected, I think next summer will be pretty normal, even if only a small minority of the population has been vaccinated because the risk to the vulnerable will be largely mitigated.
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Old 11-20-2020, 07:09 PM   #451
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That light at the end of the tunnel? Yeah it’s a freight train and it’s coming this way fast.

Just saw we are on track for 20,000 cases per day by Christmas. CTV news.
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Old 11-20-2020, 07:16 PM   #452
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That light at the end of the tunnel? Yeah itís a freight train and itís coming this way fast.

Just saw we are on track for 20,000 cases per day by Christmas. CTV news.

That assumes that growth since September remains unchecked; I don't think that'll happen. Most provinces have already taken fairly drastic measures to reduce spread and I think the curve will flatten a bit. In fact it probably already has started to flatten, with the rolling 7-day average cases in Canada going up only 6% in the last week vs. 32% the week before. BC, Manitoba, Ontario, and Quebec have all seen their rate of new cases flatten or decline over the last 4-5 days.
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Old 11-20-2020, 08:59 PM   #453
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My post was pretty clear but I'll reiterate:

The light at the end of the tunnel talk is a bit much. It could be a year until we all get vaccinated and that's really when society should return to normal. No way we should be abandoning social distancing and masks a minute before then. I have this feeling as soon as the vaccine rolls out in any capacity, people are going to go nuts and forget everything we've learned over the last year.


This is precisely the issue. Too many people keep acting like the existence of a vaccine means they can go back to a regular life.

Go ahead and celebrate. But in private, socially distanced with good hygiene while wearing a mask. Not by going on vacation or by having a party or by going out drinking with friends.

It could be 6 months to a year until you are vaccinated. That light at the end of the tunnel is so far away I can barely see it. And that assumes there are no shortages or any other problems.

Can you imagine when the lucky few have gotten it and they're all going out having fun, travelling, going to Flames games and concerts but you're not allowed because you aren't vaccinated? And people think FOMO was a problem before with social media. Lol. Wait until vaccines roll out.

You think people are irresponsible now? What about when they see the privileged group that get their vaccine first and can return to normal? You think people won't go nuts and say screw it? We'll be at most risk when it first rolls out too because a tiny % of the population will be vaccinated and the virus will still be rampant. It won't get safe until nearly the entire population is vaccinated, which could take months and months and months.

You ever been to a big Christmas party or wedding and your table gets called last for supper? You know how ####ing annoyed people get? Ok, now imagine that but instead of getting cold food or dealing with an empty stomach, it is your life at stake.
Iím not too worried about the vaccinated people partying. Iím looking forward to health care workers getting vaccinated. And members of my family who are high risk. You that worried about people living in a retirement home living the high life while youíre still socially distancing?

This isnít some stupid buffet line. Yes it is peopleís lives and those who most need protecting are going to get helped first.

I donít get your rant at all. Sorry but it seems rather self centered.
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Old 11-20-2020, 09:15 PM   #454
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You clearly don’t, I’m not concerned for myself in the slightest. I was quite clear that the current isolation hasn’t bothered me all that much.

I have no idea why you’re referencing people in care facilities. What does that have to do with anything I posted about at all? How did they become part of the discussion? Same with health care workers? If you needed to change the topic to refute some imaginary boogeyman who is mad that health care workers are getting vaccinated then I don’t know what to tell you. I already posted about this twice and was quite clear. No one else seems confused.

If you need to change the conversation to find something to disagree with, then you are right, you don’t understand my post at all.
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Old 11-20-2020, 09:27 PM   #455
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You clearly donít, Iím not concerned for myself in the slightest. I was quite clear that the current isolation hasnít bothered me all that much.

I have no idea why youíre referencing people in care facilities. What does that have to do with anything I posted about at all? How did they become part of the discussion? Same with health care workers? If you needed to change the topic to refute some imaginary boogeyman who is mad that health care workers are getting vaccinated then I donít know what to tell you. I already posted about this twice and was quite clear. No one else seems confused.

If you need to change the conversation to find something to disagree with, then you are right, you donít understand my post at all.
You said you were frustrated because people are so happy about a vaccine. Iím suggesting itís not because they are thinking only about themselves.

You are 100% entitled to feel how you do and Iím not suggesting otherwise. Just pointing out that many people are awfully happy about this news for very good reasons.

ďThe light at the end of the tunnel talk is a bit muchĒ? For you sure but not for many others. Quite the opposite.
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Old 11-21-2020, 11:44 AM   #456
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We could all work to make a difference in everyone’s mental health by refraining from referring to people who are responding to Covid differently than yourself as “babies”. Or “germaphobes”. Or describing their overall response to be on the verge of “curling up in a ball and crying”. Try to help us all out and give others a bit of respect.
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Old 11-21-2020, 11:50 AM   #457
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The argument that significant numbers of young people who recover from covid will suffer permanent damage to their physical health is thrown out here all the time, with little substantiation. I'm not sure why those warnings should be given a free pass while the warnings of mental health treated with 'let's wait for the data' skepticism.
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Old 11-21-2020, 01:24 PM   #458
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The argument that significant numbers of young people who recover from covid will suffer permanent damage to their physical health is thrown out here all the time, with little substantiation. I'm not sure why those warnings should be given a free pass while the warnings of mental health treated with 'let's wait for the data' skepticism.
And it is routinely regarded as hyperbole and everyone agrees that there isnít data. What to do as a result of the lack of data is where the discussion is. Some days I donít think I am reading the same thread as you.
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Old 11-21-2020, 02:27 PM   #459
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The argument that significant numbers of young people who recover from covid will suffer permanent damage to their physical health is thrown out here all the time, with little substantiation. I'm not sure why those warnings should be given a free pass while the warnings of mental health treated with 'let's wait for the data' skepticism.
Worth considering that long term physical effects that develop on otherwise healthy people, like lung damage, could be irreparable.

Mental health issues that are short term and develop in otherwise healthy people are generally viewed as recoverable.

I think it is hard to imagine an otherwise well adjusted person with no history of addiction going out and trying meth or fentanyl or some other hard drug due to covid depression. Most of these people likely have existing addiction or mental health issues. Likewise with suicide or severe depression.

On the other hand, permanent physical damage due to covid occurs to otherwise healthy people who have no history of health problems.

So we’re talking apples and oranges here.

Really the discussion should be focused on the effects on high risk people physically vs high risk people mentally and separately the effects of covid on mentally healthy people and physically healthy people. It completely changes the discussion when reframed and not muddied by incorrectly and unfairly mixing up the comparisons.
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Old 11-21-2020, 10:54 PM   #460
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How bout this, the shut down never ####ing ended? I mean we opened back up officially but a lot of people never really came back out because it was obvious the problem was still not resolved.

I want another shut down made official to curtail the fools who can't follow simple rules!

I never got to leave the forced isolation, I want out and I see only one way to bring that about. So I will take the vaccine light at the end of the tunnel because it is part of the goal, this MUST end.
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