(btw, I really appreciate all the info you bring to this thread)
Sorry, I just read what I wrote and realized it sounded snarky - wasn't the intention.
Cloverleafs create unsafe weaving movements where you're trying to merge into the mainline and others are trying to exit. Cloverleafs look good on paper because they have no traffic lights which is good, but what's built now is 6-ramp partial cloverleaf (parclo) that do have light-controlled intersections but can flow better in some circumstances. Sarcee/Bow has heavy left turning traffic in all directions, particularly NB-WB and EB-NB during the PM rush and those 2 movements conflicting would actually grind a cloverleaf to nearly a halt in the PM rush.
6-ramp parclos are the majority of interchanges on Stoney/Henday.
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Here's a video that explains on a basic level what's wrong with cloverleafs:
And here's is Alberta's favourite interchange design now, the six-ramp parclo - in this case Stoney/Peigan in the SE. The new hip and cool thing to do for 2020 is to make those intersections on the surface street into roundabouts, so people stop T-boning each other - which is what is currently being built at Stoney/14 St NW if anyone lives up there.
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The terrain and the whole setup of that area is going to make an interchange there absurdly expensive, so RIP the city budget. This is the study I cited that estimates $250M for both interchanges plus Sarcee widening to 6 lanes. The province is spending $600M and change to finish off the ring road and provide a backdoor for Sarcee, more or less bailing out the Sarcee/Bow intersection from utter failure.
There's some pretty serious cost-benefit discussions to be had when it comes to Sarcee/Bow... and none of it is good. Current plan is to quietly pretend like they don't know how much a gongshow it is and see what relief comes from the west leg.
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Yeah it's no consolation to anybody that has to deal with that mess on a daily basis, and 201 will dump even more traffic into Sarcee when it extends all the way down to 22X next year. It is what it is.
The only relief is for Richmond/Sarcee in the form of the new Westhills Way backdoor onto Glenmore, which it looks like a few people have discovered and are probably ecstatic. Also just noticing that Google Maps has completely ignored that entire bridge and interchange, despite somewhat correctly plotting the rest of Tsuut'ina Trail.
The terrain and the whole setup of that area is going to make an interchange there absurdly expensive, so RIP the city budget. This is the study I cited that estimates $250M for both interchanges plus Sarcee widening to 6 lanes. The province is spending $600M and change to finish off the ring road and provide a backdoor for Sarcee, more or less bailing out the Sarcee/Bow intersection from utter failure.
There's some pretty serious cost-benefit discussions to be had when it comes to Sarcee/Bow... and none of it is good. Current plan is to quietly pretend like they don't know how much a gongshow it is and see what relief comes from the west leg.
But you know that probably is the best plan at this stage, no? Like I can sympathize with that decision basically.
I was meaning to ask - has there been a noticeable impact on volumes on 14th, Elbow, etc? Not that it would effect me directly, but curious to hear from those in the areas it would...
Google Maps is now properly plotting routes using the new segment so you can get an idea of times, but Westhills Way still does not exist on the map and that could save 5-10 minutes for people in the PM rush when NB Sarcee at Richmond is a gongshow. It appears to still be massively underutilized, but slowly folks are discovering it.
It happened. People are taking the ring road to crowchild instead of 14st. It was backed up onto glenmore this morning trying to get onto crowchild.
... a few pages ago...
Quote:
Originally Posted by TorqueDog
Oof, Glenmore EB to Crowchild NB is an awful interchange for even moderate amounts of traffic, it's a joke of an interchange, you can maybe fit 6 or 7 cars tops at the light. That is going to cause all sorts of issues if people collectively think they can rely on it for their morning commutes.
That didn't take long!
As Glenmore is technically a provincial highway (Hwy 8; Crowchild doesn't become Hwy 1A until north of Banff Trail NW), would the interchange be provincial or municipal jurisdiction? Either way, nice of them to do all those improvements without addressing the actual problem which is the connection from Glenmore EB to Crowchild NB.
__________________
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GO FLAMES GO.
Last edited by TorqueDog; 10-07-2020 at 09:56 AM.
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As Glenmore is technically a provincial highway (Hwy 8; Crowchild doesn't become Hwy 1A until north of Banff Trail NW), would the interchange be provincial or muncipal jurisdiction? Either way, nice of them to do all those improvements without addressing the actual problem which is the connection from Glenmore EB to Crowchild NB.
On the East side of Sarcee Glenmore is the city's deal, other than the Deerfoot interchange, and obv the other side of Stoney east
I think Highway 8 might end now way at the west city limit near 101 St where it becomes Stoney. Either way, it's 100% city jurisdiction and their issue to fix.
It's the same folded diamond that's used in multiple places elsewhere on both ring roads, and in all cases it's the best design given the geometric constraints of that area. The loop ramp is less than ideal, but they did that so that a westbound onramp from Westhills Way can exist. Stoney is free-flow underneath so it's obviously fine, WB Stoney into Discovery Ridge is a simple right turn so they're fine, and the heavy traffic turning left northbound will be at the opposite time of the day as the heavy traffic southbound to turn east.
I foresee zero backups here as long as as the north intersection is timed correctly.
Hopefully they get that intersection working soon, all week 69th Street has been backed up past 26th Avenue in the mornings and not much better in the evenings, and the offramp is backed up onto the ring road in the evenings. I still think there is plenty of room for them to have had an offramp directly off westbound Stoney to northbound 69th which would have eliminated a lot of the problems.
Google Maps is now properly plotting routes using the new segment so you can get an idea of times, but Westhills Way still does not exist on the map and that could save 5-10 minutes for people in the PM rush when NB Sarcee at Richmond is a gongshow. It appears to still be massively underutilized, but slowly folks are discovering it.
So are both roundabouts on either side of glenmore trail open?
