FF80F - Changes to the roster

[Hockey-and_stuff]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

This was very weak poorly thought out and written article. I was thinking that I was missing not subscribing to the Athletic but not anymore if this was the quality of article.



Was Haynes doing this on purpose to mess with the Athletic as revenge?

Ah yes the age old journalistic revenge tactic of writing terrible articles to get revenge on people who lay you off.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Hey, Gillies is an HOFer.

Very true and deservedly so. But imagine what his career might have been, had they not placed him beside Trottier and Bossy?

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Very true and deservedly so. But imagine what his career might have been, had they not placed him beside Trottier and Bossy?

IMO he’s not deserving. He is the luckiest player ever. But no big deal.

[tvp2003]

The premise of the article was to take Monahan and Gaudreau off of "first line" scoring duties by balancing the scoring responsibilities on the other lines and/or building around Tkachuk as your "first line".

So while I disagree that the solution involves putting Bennettt with Tkachuk, the reality is that unless Gaudreau and/or Monahan are miraculously traded for a solid return, the big changes this year will be in net and on the blue line.

[DeluxeMoustache]

There is no shame in assuming the roster is pretty much set

They have the bodies and are close to the cap

Maybe there should be another thread, or a refocus, as Haynes generally was making a decent point.

Say this is the roster, what should the lines be? Account for coaching strategy and style of play

[Rick M.]

I like the article because it focusses on the great building blocks the Flames have, rather than obsessing about the deficiencies of the “first” line. I’d keep Bennett and Dube together because of their great chemistry.

[JTech780]

The way I see it is that Gaudreau and Monahan have become stale and predictable playing together. It's time to switch it up.

Gaudreau needs a center with speed who can push back the defense and can give Gaudreau room and time to create.

Backlund is the name that jumps to the top of the list, the problem there is that it plays havoc with your matchup game. Gaudreau isn't the greatest defensively and is probably best suited seeing mostly offensive zone starts. Using Backlund in that manner takes away from some of his best assets.

Moving Lindholm to the middle has been thrown around, but I just don't see him as an everyday center. He is best suited for the wing.

My suggestion is Bennett. Now I will admit that this idea depends on Bennett keeping his game simple and not trying to be a finesse player to fit with Gaudreau. If Bennett just skates the center lane hard and goes to the net it will open up more space for Gaudreau to operate and do what he does best. The top line as currently constructed isn't able to retrieve pucks that are dumped in, Bennett can help in the regard as well.

Gaudreau-Bennett-Tkachuk
Mangiapane-Monahan-Lindolm
Dube-Backlund-Leivo
Lucic-Ryan-Simon

[Enoch Root]

If you want to split up Gaudreau and Monahan, that is how I see it as well - Bennett makes the most sense. It isn't that Bennett is a 'top line guy', no one is saying that. But if you want to split the top line and get more balance in the lineup, I think Bennett with Gaudreau is the way to do it.

[Bingo]

I certainly don't agree with a lot of the suggestions in the article.

But if you're in on the Scotty Bowman "pairs" roster building over trios, the Flames are in a much better position to shake up lines now than they were last season.

That's a good thing.

They haven't improved or changed the core (other than adding a goaltender to the core), but they've added to the plug in options they can use in search of chemistry.

[tvp2003]

If you break up 13 and 23, I would try:

Tkachuk / Backlund / Mangiapane
Gaudreau / Bennett / Dube
Nordstrom / Monahan / Leivo
Lucic / Ryan / Simon

Gives Gaudreau some speed and finish (well, Dube moreso than Bennett), and it keeps 93 and 29 together as well. I also like the thought of giving Monahan a fresh start. You can tell he was trying to reinvograte his game a little bit last year (being more physical, etc), but it's hard to do that if he's still the triggerman for Gaudreau. Let him play with some wingers who have something to prove and see if they can play smart 200 ft game while still contributing a bit offensively.

Meanwhile, the "fourth" line is solid defensively and all three guys can elevate into the top 9 if needed.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

If you want to split up Gaudreau and Monahan, that is how I see it as well - Bennett makes the most sense. It isn't that Bennett is a 'top line guy', no one is saying that. But if you want to split the top line and get more balance in the lineup, I think Bennett with Gaudreau is the way to do it.

Move Lindholm to the middle if you want JG away from SM.

Bennett simply doesn't have the mental acuity to play with a guy like JG whose hockey IQ is off the charts but has a very indifferent GAF metric. There is a reason the best Bennett has ever looked is with a north south guy like Lucic. Lindholm also provides the defensive awareness that would be needed and Bennett simply has never shown at C.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by tvp2003

If you break up 13 and 23, I would try:

Tkachuk / Backlund / Mangiapane
Gaudreau / Bennett / Dube
Nordstrom / Monahan / Leivo
Lucic / Ryan / Simon

Gives Gaudreau some speed and finish (well, Dube moreso than Bennett), and it keeps 93 and 29 together as well. I also like the thought of giving Monahan a fresh start. You can tell he was trying to reinvograte his game a little bit last year (being more physical, etc), but it's hard to do that if he's still the triggerman for Gaudreau. Let him play with some wingers who have something to prove and see if they can play smart 200 ft game while still contributing a bit offensively.

Meanwhile, the "fourth" line is solid defensively and all three guys can elevate into the top 9 if needed.

Lindholm?

[goflamesgo18]

Gaudreau - Bennett - Tkachuk
Dube - Monahan - Lindholm
Mangiapane - Backlund - leivo
Lucic - Ryan - Simon

I like the offensive depth this team has right now. This is just my idea for opening day roster.

[Enoch Root]

you forgot Lindholm - he is kind of important

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Move Lindholm to the middle if you want JG away from SM.

Bennett simply doesn't have the mental acuity to play with a guy like JG whose hockey IQ is off the charts but has a very indifferent GAF metric. There is a reason the best Bennett has ever looked is with a north south guy like Lucic. Lindholm also provides the defensive awareness that would be needed and Bennett simply has never shown at C.

First, I don't think it is a good idea to move Lindholm to C.

Second, I think the hockey IQ argument is overdone sometimes. Of course, Johnny needs to play with someone else who thinks the game at a high level. But I don't think the 3rd guy on the line necessarily has to be that as well. Lots of great lines have two intelligent players and one guy that is doing the grunt work along the boards and in front of the net. Bennett can do that.

[JTech780]

Right now we are seeing teams pressure Gaudreau in the neutral zone and forcing him to dump it in, because they know that Monahan doesn't have the speed to go retrieve the puck, Lindholm can occasionally, but he often gets outnumbered in the corners because Gaudreau and Monahan are little to no help with puck battles.

That's why I would put Bennett and Tkachuk with Gaudreau, they can go get the puck and will win the board battles. I also think that Bennett's speed will help push back the defense. Tkachuk is able think the game along with Gaudreau. All Bennett has to do is go to the net hard and back check hard.

It's about finding ways to help create time and space for Gaudreau to do what he does best.

[Enoch Root]

Gaudreau - Bennett - Lindholm?

Gaudreau - Bennett - Leivo?

I kind of like the idea of 3 balanced lines for 5 on 5 play...

Tkachuk - Backlund - Lindholm
Gaudreau - Bennett - Leivo/Dube
Mangiapane - Monahan - Dube/Leivo

Gaudreau - Bennett - Dube is an interesting thought

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Gaudreau - Bennett - Lindholm?

Gaudreau - Bennett - Leivo?

Gaudreau - Bennett - Dube is an interesting thought

I like the idea of any of those lines. It was such a small sample size, but that preseason, back when Gaudreau, Bennett, and Ferland were rookies, that line was so damn exciting in how they played together. It wasn't like any line Gaudreau has played on since then, with the exception maybe of the Gaudreau - Monahan - Ferland line in the 2017 playoffs when Monahan was playing at an extremely high level driving play through the middle.

[DazzlinDino]

Originally Posted by tvp2003

If you break up 13 and 23, I would try:

Tkachuk / Backlund / Mangiapane
Gaudreau / Bennett / Dube
Nordstrom / Monahan / Leivo
Lucic / Ryan / Simon

Gives Gaudreau some speed and finish (well, Dube moreso than Bennett), and it keeps 93 and 29 together as well. I also like the thought of giving Monahan a fresh start. You can tell he was trying to reinvograte his game a little bit last year (being more physical, etc), but it's hard to do that if he's still the triggerman for Gaudreau. Let him play with some wingers who have something to prove and see if they can play smart 200 ft game while still contributing a bit offensively.

Meanwhile, the "fourth" line is solid defensively and all three guys can elevate into the top 9 if needed.

You forgot Lindholm.

[Rick M.]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Gaudreau - Bennett - Lindholm?

Gaudreau - Bennett - Leivo?

I kind of like the idea of 3 balanced lines for 5 on 5 play...

Tkachuk - Backlund - Lindholm
Gaudreau - Bennett - Leivo/Dube
Mangiapane - Monahan - Dube/Leivo

Gaudreau - Bennett - Dube is an interesting thought

I think Johnny might play braver with Bennett as his centre. Also, all 3 guys can do zone entries and play an attacking style. Try swarming Johnny and the other two can burn you.